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Thread: Superbiking in India

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    @jeevan.chaukar thanks for such a detailed answer.
    i agree with this step by step approach as well your elaboration on what type of bike is made for what kind of rider. i still fail to understand why would someone willing to buy a cruiser or willing to go touring on motorcycle or wishing to buy and use a trailie( i think these ones must be seasoned riders. newbies would rarely consider trailies right away) need to go through upgrade cycle.
    Only reason for gradually going up the capacity and power is to allow our body and brain to adjust sufficiently with behaviour of the machine.
    very well put and i wholeheartedly agree. but on streets, our body needs to adjust to riding posture , bike weight and weight distribution etc. of different families of bikes. for advanced street riders, maybe engine power delivery or brake bite too. but that barely need 2 3 hundred kms of cautious rides to get used to. then why suggest this step by step upgrade approach at all.
    would appreciate your ( as well as other members') thoughts on my above mentioned doubt.

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    Quote Originally Posted by entsurgeon View Post
    @jeevan.chaukar thanks for such a detailed answer.
    i agree with this step by step approach as well your elaboration on what type of bike is made for what kind of rider. i still fail to understand why would someone willing to buy a cruiser or willing to go touring on motorcycle or wishing to buy and use a trailie( i think these ones must be seasoned riders. newbies would rarely consider trailies right away) need to go through upgrade cycle.

    very well put and i wholeheartedly agree. but on streets, our body needs to adjust to riding posture , bike weight and weight distribution etc. of different families of bikes. for advanced street riders, maybe engine power delivery or brake bite too. but that barely need 2 3 hundred kms of cautious rides to get used to. then why suggest this step by step upgrade approach at all.
    would appreciate your ( as well as other members') thoughts on my above mentioned doubt.
    As I said, there is no fixed formula. Step by step approach is advised purely because beyond 200-300 cc class, the amount of investment into any particular bike as well as ongoing maintenance is very high (relative of course - if you have a problem of "how to spend money" then it is a different ball game!).

    For premium bike in any segment above 600 cc, you are looking at minimum investment of:
    1) Anything from 8 lakh to 70 lakhs depending on your budget and aspiration for a bike
    2) Anything from Rs 40000 to Rs 4 lakhs for your protective gear (Helmet, Gloves, Jacket/Pants OR one piece suite, Boots)
    3) Any amount of accessories for your bike (people spend as much as Rs 5 lakh on a bike in accessories which originally is priced at Rs 14 lakh)
    4) Electronic stuff that compliments your riding - GoPro camera (ok cheaper stuff is also there - but....), BlueTooth Communication Device like SENA and so on...

    Basically you are looking at endless spending just at the beginning! If you crash, then you spend much more of course and also have to wait a lot for repairs to the bike as well as your body!
    Therefore it may be good to slowly up the stakes rather than directly buying BMW S1000RR and crashing on 2nd day after purchase and staying in hospital for next 6 months!
    Obviously some people may very well adjust with such superfast bikes on day one and won't crash anytime so soon (can't say that they will NEVER crash - almost everyone crashes at some point - please understand!).

    India has 1.3+ billion people and world has 7 billion Each one has different thinking - so there is market for all kinds of bikes - even toy/monkey bikes as they are called, pocket bikes also...So naturally there is huge market for Cruisers and Tourers as well. Cruisers are glamorous and suit long distance riding strictly on good roads while Tourers are sturdy and hardy vehicles that can take rough and smooth roads equally well. But tourers are not real off-roaders - so people want trail bikes. They can take these bikes and literally jump on top of big boulders or do river crossing, hill riding and all that...To each his own!

    As for me, I like to go FAST! In straight line as well as corners! So my choice is of an agile, lightweight, sufficiently powerful motorcycle which is also fairly good in daily riding conditions (like jammed traffic in Hinjewadi Pune!). Street Triple is one bike throwing minimum heat on your feet even during summer. Even 200 cc bike such as Duke throws more heat on your feet than Street Triple.

    Only problem of Street Triple is lower ground clearance which makes it vulnerable - your engine sump bottom can crack OR you may end up tearing your coolant tank if you are careless while going over a sharp and high-rise speed breaker. Unfortunately, we have too many of such speed breakers all over India including Pune so one has to be super careful. Except this part, I am very happy with the bike so far.

    ----consecutive posts auto-merged-----

    Quote Originally Posted by Divya Sharan View Post
    Y Sadly Indian/Victory aren't available for renting.
    INDIAN motorcycles are available for test ride at their showrooms - if you are a serious buyer, I do think they will entertain you. But beware that all cruisers have low sitting position with legs spread a bit wide and stretched to rest on the foot pegs far ahead of you to make it comfortable for longer distance. It is good for going slow and easy. For normal daily usage - go for a naked sport bike (just read reviews of Kawasaki Z650 - now it has ABS and very reasonable price also with decent performance..Other option is Benelli 600i which also has ABS and sounds great - but Z650 may actually be slightly faster in real conditions. As you increase budget options will also increase.)

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    Quote Originally Posted by jeevan.chaukar View Post
    If you crash, then you spend much more of course and also have to wait a lot for repairs to the bike as well as your body!
    Therefore it may be good to slowly up the stakes rather than directly buying BMW S1000RR and crashing on 2nd day after purchase and staying in hospital for next 6 months!
    Obviously some people may very well adjust with such superfast bikes on day one and won't crash anytime so soon (can't say that they will NEVER crash - almost everyone crashes at some point - please understand!).
    hmm.
    so all this step by step upgrade advise is to prevent crashing eh? to promote safe riding right? to help riders save their machines, skin, cash and of course egos. did i understand it correctly?

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    Quote Originally Posted by entsurgeon View Post
    hmm.
    so all this step by step upgrade advise is to prevent crashing eh? to promote safe riding right? to help riders save their machines, skin, cash and of course egos. did i understand it correctly?
    Not sure what you intend here or you are simply needling me to have some fun while I keep typing long responses - but I will take it as a genuine query once again. There is nothing to prevent crash. Whether you are on Activa or BMW S1000RR, there is no assurance that you will not crash. All I am saying is about probability and consequences.

    If you are good rider and don't overstep your own limits then your crash probability on S1000RR is much lesser than humble Activa - because of electronics (ABS, traction control), great brakes and super sticky tyres and also because you are so skilled.

    On the other hand CONSEQUENCE of crashing on S1000RR is much worse. Typically your riding speeds will be higher and hence a fall will impact you much harder. So personal and vehicle damage - if at all it happens - will be huge in such case. Very minor damages to a bike like Street Triple run into 2 lakhs etc where rider just slipped a bit and few parts had to be replaced. Forget crash - even things like getting rim damaged due to pothole has major cost (of course insurance will reduce the burden).

    Again - in case of activa crash - personal damage still could be high but vehicle damage is much cheaper (entire scooter can be replaced at Rs 70000/- even if there is no insurance right!)

    There is no guarantee or formula - but if you are a real rider on Indian roads then you should very well understand what I am trying to say here.

    Nothing except your budget and age (if you are below 18 you can't!) stops you from buying most exotic and fastest bike directly as your first one - but just be aware and cautious and don't hurt yourself in such case.
    ethanbikerhuntVN likes this.

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    @jeevan.chaukar brother, your hard work and time taken for such a nice and useful reply will be of utmost importance to all the potential sbk first timers surely. the points you have described in details in last few posts will be very very useful for the novice seeking help at the forum. you summed it up pretty perfectly. kindly note that such a description was very much needed.
    thinking in line with op, forum members' responses (before you chipped in with your experienced words) about whether he should take step by step approach or take a jump from 20odd bhp to 120+ps were a bit confusing for sure and i have lately seen lot of similar threads everywhere getting into this dilemma. just a simple reply like 'dont leap' or 'do it, lot of people did it successfully' would only add to confusion if it was not backed by solid reasoning which was provided for the first time by you on our forum. thats why i thought this discussion is quite pertinent here. although what you explained deserves to be in that superbike sticky thread truly. a rider , sbk beginner trying to take a call about step by step or leap approach should, in the end remember, both the approaches are okay provided one knows what he is signing up for.
    on this topic, i would like to add a few words of my own in addition to what you have said just to clear more air.
    1. utilising the potentials and upgrading step by step. -
    this step by step upgrade is certainly vouched for by pioneer riding schools such as CSS. however that advise is totally correct for track applications. on track, a novice on his supersport or maxi or hypersport repeatedly bites dust off good riders on 390. its happening here on indian tracks as we read this.
    the whole reason this advise came up was because its much more easier to master throttle braking and body positioning on a lighter smaller less powerful bike. once you get good on track on such machine, you can upgrade. this is why you can tell a track rider from the list of his upgrades - lighter wheels, flywheels , race ecu s etc. against cosmetic ones.
    how would you know that this bike lacks power and you need more powerful ride?? if you can hit its top speed much before the braking point on longest straight.
    needless to say, this can never be done on streets. you will never be able to utilise any potential of any bike on streets because street riding is different from track riding as in the goals of riding are different. you are not hitting any straights after an apex. the first and foremost goal on street being avoiding any mishap. and this brings us to next point-
    2. direct leap.-
    on tracks a direct leap will only hinder your growth as a rider because you have to deal with more weight ( ultralight moto gp bikes are not up for sale.) , more sensitive throttle and braking inputs and much more aggressive riding position that makes you numb in 10 minutes hindering your reflexes and worst part is you d realise it only when you need to brake /shift urgently and your fingers/ankle arent moving . gradually getting used to things on less aggressive bikes will help on track for sure. but on streets??
    well you can try a leap if your riding will strictly remain on streets. i personally strongly vouch a track session because it will kill your curiosity of going fast preventing you from taking unnecessary risks on streets. that aside if you still wish to take a leap remember- its not okay to be on a big bike as an absolute first timer. you basically learn riding on smaller easier vehicles.
    now why is a leap not a crime on streets- because street riding has to be safe riding and safe riding isn t just about your control on a given bike - big or small. there are 2 components of safe riding.
    1. having good control on your bike- this will not only include which bike you ride but also how well maintained your bike is.
    2. having an understanding of unsafe and risky scenarios- now this is something largely independent of what bike you ride disclaimer being some rides are better balanced,sprung and calipered. still if its unsafe at 40km on a residential street, for any rider, the range of safe speed would only be around 10kmph- means risk being equal on a drum brake activa at 35 and disc equipped r15 at 45kmph approx. and in no way would double discs of an sbk mean its safe to ride at 60kmph on very same stretch. by years of experience all you gain is whether its safe at 25kmph or fast/risky at 15. the basics of safety margins wont change only few factors would. like if you have a loud exhaust with that deep throaty sound on your big bike, people would be more guarded and allow you better margin of safety as you pass which translates to a little higher safe speed range.
    if you wonder why am i discussing sub par speeds in a thread of ultra fast bikes- its because you can choose not to ride fast on your sbk. but you cant help riding slow on congested streets no matter what bike you have. this skill would be much more useful in day to day life on any bike.
    now coming to the other end of performance range- everyones favourite- riding fast.
    people often mistake highways to be safe for fast riding. in india they never are. apart from a stray puppy or a jaywalker, even the fast bmw may cut lane throwing your lines for a toss. its only a bit safer around the speeds of general traffic on a particular road.
    but why did i need to sum up these factors about safe riding here which are already on forum? its because-
    http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/art-safe-riding/
    Motorcycle Accidents - Cause, Factors & Identification of Countermeasures
    look at the number of threads, replies and views on those very old threads and compare them with threads about sbk and you would understand.
    basically a lot of sbk wisdom floating online is borrowed from west which misses out on few things specific to india.
    in our zeal to talk about superbikes we forget a lot of things that are very basic for a seasoned rider here in india. someone who got on his first sbk after years of riding on indian roads may be quite accomplished about the component 2 listed above and would pick up superbike riding quite fast, say withinn a few thousand kms or even less. however for a young less traveled guy, he should understand that no matter how good your reflexes, the sixth sense developed after years of riding here is incomparable.
    i hope this clears a lot of air about this leap vs step by step upgrade i hope.
    and i d advise everyone who is interested in sbk and preparing to be an sbk rider should go through these safe riding threads.
    senior riders on forum walk a very thin line between guiding the prospective riders and scaring them. your posts are a delight to read and spoke volumes for a lot of confused souls i am sure.
    i thank you profusely for taking out time to help others genuinely and sorry if it was me who made you do that.
    i would wish some mod moves your posts maybe here - Superbiking in India or here Superbikes: A new way of life so more members could benefit off your hard work.
    thanks. @acdc anybody willing to be a better rider and wishes to keep riding until ripe old age should take his fitness seriously. cycling and swimming are 2 exercises that dont put pressure on your knees and are boon for riders over 3rd decade of life working hard to keep fit so they could do another leh /ladakh. no true biker would ever ridicule them or look at them condescendingly. be grateful to splendor riders. if everyone could afford a sbk, one wouldnt grow up dreaming of them. @leech most owners sell their ducatis in 2 3 4 5 years. find me a farmer who does that to his bulls.
    ethanbikerhuntVN likes this.

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    Default Re: Help me buy a superbike

    Thanks...!

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