shrinathrao

just one query, is it ok that you drop your speed before you hit the corner and then your start accelerating and in mid corner apply a liitle of your rear brake and than leave the brakes and than take exit at good speeds or rear braks should not be used at all ?

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satyenpoojary

There a lot of parameters that come into play Shrinath. Riding more, or riding with those who have ridden more are good ways to learn. In the link that you mention, you might want to re read the bit
I guess it implies that there is a definite amount of "slowing" down that the front can provide, any more and it would probably slide, which is when you use the rear to scrub off the speed.
Ritwik has hit the nail on the head and eliminated the problem before hand. Why not enter the corner in its correct speed.


PS: Cornering on gravel~! Chopping the throttle~! Why all this confusing theory man!
You slide if your rear travels faster than your front in a corner.
Why would your rear travel fast involves a whole list of variables from the contact patch, to the speed, to the line, to the type of bike!

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nav75

"Apply brake" in the above, when you try to brake hard enough that it could stop the bike, that's when it could start to stand up.
But if you are braking to scrub off some extra speed, it won't make you go straight. Atleast that's what I have seen and experienced. But then there is always something new to learn.

You can't turn a bike without having it lean to certain level. If the bike is not leaning, it will go straight, unless the speed is at crawling pace.

+1 but crash will not happen right away. Upto some level of unsettling you won't notice then bike will make you remind that you are pushing the limits and if crossed that limit, you will crash.

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shrinathrao

From the inputs of Navendu and vishwas it feels that if you apply little rear brakes (not complete in a way it locks) depending on what you call as your slow speeds, the chance of bike straightening is less, and you can take the corner at your comfort speeds without the issue of low slide or the bike going straight and you running out of the road.


correct me if i am wrong.

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nav75

As far as my personal exp goes, cutting speed with some rear brake, doesn't make you go straight.
Regarding bike sliding or not, it could depend on lots of factors, like the amount of pressure you applied on the brake, amount of lean (that will decide the contact patch), road surface, etc.
But if you want to use the rear brake, while in the corner, to take the corner at your comfort speed. I'll suggest you plan about entering the corner at slow/comfortable speed itself.

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TenHut

Low side is one when you are NOT thrown into the air catapulted by a highsiding bike. Inshort..if you are not highsiding you are lowsiding and that doesn't have anything to do with speeds being slow or fast.

@Shrinath : I don't think you should try to learn cornering on forums. One wrong advice from a tom dick harry like myself and yourself may cost you a lot on the streets. Learn about cornering in person when you have a bike standing aside just in case you need a demo in rider inputs mid corner. Best way to do this is at chennai at CSS !

Also u are reading articles about 'catching a slide' etc which will obviously talk of using the rear to have a firm line but trust me those are very advanced articles. You will have to learn how not to slide before you learn how to catch a slide. NEVER use your brakes at any part of the corner...neither front nor back. If you have to stop for whatever reasons or need to brush off speed rapidly then stand the bike up and start braking. Demand no braking from the bike when in lean. On bigger bikes this habit will kill you instantaneously and on smaller bikes its just a habit that will take you down with it within a jiffy ! Braking when in corner is potentially so risky that this epitaph was born
"When in doubt..give it some gas "
U can usually get out sticky situations with some clever throttle and lean angles and don't have to brake rapidly when in lean. Remember to look right !

Dude I agree that the article could have been better written. Hell they could have gotten my name right at least :P
But I don't know what you are saying when you go on about the article portraying us as fast and risky riders. It talks of fast bikes as "fast bikes" which they are whether you and I choose to ride them fast or not and it talks of protective suit, proper licensing rules, riding education all in the name of adopting the right approach towards riding bikes like these.
Don't you think talking about the suits as 'secondary safety' and differentiating between a slide or an impact is a little too out of scope for an article which is titled "Life in the fast lane" ?
Article never says the leather suits will save a riders life come what may. It never even bothers to say it saves lives. It just talks of our helmets which can take "impact" not the suit ! Education and skill is primary safety which the article does talk of by saying "..it takes months of dedicated practice to tame machines like these....non of them who ride are irresponsible" and mentions CSS for the very same reason.
It also talks of proper coaching. I don't get how the article portrays that we are fast riders risking our lives. If at all it portrays we are fast riders who are a different breed. ( which we aren't but that must have been the editors perception after the ride..keep in mind to someone completely uninitiated, speeds of 150kmph can be life changing)
I think the editor was smitten by the bikes and the speeds and chose to speak of both and was rather mum about the group of riders so again I don't realize how he is talking of the group as rash or risky. He is so smitten by it he wants to go out and buy one bike himself lol.
I think what you were expecting and what you got is different but that doesn't mean that the article is portraying us wrong. If we were the HOGS or the Bulleters maybe the stress would have been on the riding brotherhood and camaraderie. But with 15 Superbikes starring at the editor when he came on a ride with us its gonna be difficult for him to write about anything but bikes and the speeds they do. Superbikes will always be inseparable from Speed and you cant change that fact of life !

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nav75

I think Shrinath asked the query with respect to riding on public roads and with respect to that I replied and would like to mention a few things below:
[Never ridden a big bike, so can't say anything in its context. All are wrt to our small Indian bikes]

So you don't support Trail braking I guess.

For an example, Consider riding on a mountain road. You enter a corner and found that its getting tighter (reducing radius). Here, you can't just lift up the bike and start braking, you will start moving into opposite lane.
You have to start cutting off some speed in that position only.
No, don't even think about gassing, as that will start increasing the turning radius and you will land up in the opposite lane and sadly in India, what ever little I have traveled, mountain roads don't have a divider in between to protect you from oncoming vehicle.

Amount of variables and unknowns is what differs riding on public roads different from riding on racing tack.

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trustvishwas

Giving more gas while a bike is leaning will tighten the turning radius and not increase it.

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niks_devil666

I dont think this is possible. increasing gas will only load the rear more than front reducing the chances of front losing grip and hence a crash. and the radius will definitely increase.

To tighten the radius , u can shift a little forward to bars but without increasing throttle input.

At times , on public roads when u need to tighten ur turn u need to scrub some speed by a gentle pressure on brakes and lean forward to tighten the turn. At times u also have to put more pressure on the inside bar to tighten the turn (more countersteering) . but all this should be done considering the fact that u take a 80kph turn at 70kph so u have ur margins of safety.

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nav75

Considering that you are taking a turn, with the same lean angle. At slower speed, you will be able to take a tighter line as compared to when taking at a faster speed.
If you still want to take a tighter line and at faster speed, you will have to then opt for more lean and you can lean only upto a limit.
Right?

So, when you give more gas/increase the speed while in a corner. You can't hold the same line, unless you lean the bike further. But if you are already at the limit of the lean/can't lean too much (specially on public road - as mentioned by Niks below), the only option left is to widen your line.

+1.

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