Ayush Singh

I thought to write on this topic after I went through a locked thread by some member who wanted a protest of some sort to give away the Import Duty set by Indian Government on Vehicles.

Our country has its own set of problems to deal with, which range from poverty to terrorism. Free spirits like Kowalski also dwell in this beautiful country but they usually belong to the sub categorized upper middle class or the high class, the poor on the other hand struggle to get that 20yr old bicycle gifted to him on his wedding or from his father, get fixed by doing some tightening here and there. In a country where people do not have enough to eat and die or commit suicide for a few grands, a sum of over 100 million rupees is caught in cash, how sad it is. And in the same country where people walk without footwear, people want to buy Harley Davidson.

The enjoyment, fun and reprise is meant for the rich, or the upper classes, who can afford it. They want a Harley, and they don't look at the price they are getting it for. So, Import Duty for them is absolutely no gimmick.

With time, the standard of living has improved in India. From Rajdoot which used to be a fashion symbol, now we have Pulsar and Karizmas. Change for development is inevident, but the problems are still in large, and they have not reduced to the fact that we can start buying Porsche and Harleys like they are affordable. These vehicles are not even affordable in developed nations, however their standard of living is in a state where a large percentage of people can get their hands on these vehicles.

I think the government in India helps individuals who earn substiatial money in lot of ways. They impose very less tax and individuals enjoy a lot of liberty. These individuals should pay that extra for enjoyment and it surely is appropriate.

My intention was to make members here remember that the country in which they stay, still is developing and has a long way ahead to develop. Over here people live to live and survive not enjoy, and so anything like an expensive imported vehicle is limited to the rich and should be unless we make the poor and rural live a better life.

Aryan

General Biking Discussion Approved.

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niks_devil666

Care to explain this?

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theslayer

Over here people live to live and surive?

So every other form of enjoyment like music, literature and arts all died out during the World Wars is it? Weren't people trying to survive back then after all?

How about when we were under the British Raj and fighting for freedom? Did people fervently avoid theatre, carnatic music and innumerable dance forms?

As far as I can see, people have lived harder lives in the past and inspite of everything the human race has always sought fragile moments of pleasure in things that have nothing to do with 'survival'. Maybe those moments are what keeping the sanity in us intact.

So dear sir, don't you go around pointing out people below the poverty line to stop me from having my moments. It's not about surviving. It's about living. We're not animals are we?


Now that we're done with the philosophical hogwash, in terms of reality...

We've been mollycoddling our bike manufacturers for a long time and it has to stop. Probably if we had affordable 250s and 175s from other countries for competition, our manufacturers would've taken steps to offer us much more technologically advanced products than what we're being fed now.

Development doesn't come from slogging yourself to death doing a 9 to 5 job without any joy. Development comes from necessity, development comes from passion, development comes from dreaming, wanting, and working towards it.

Finally, rich or not, nobody wants to pay double the cost of a bike/car.

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svjhonda

^
Superbly said. If a person walks 10 kilometers barefoot, does it mean I should not dream of an SBK to ride for 10 kilometers in light of how many people live below poverty line?

Agreed we can certainly take measures to end poverty, but I didn't quite get it how paying (freakishly, if I may add) greater import duty helps these people. For all we know it might be going into deep pockets.

The topic is very touchy, because many people don't have an idea of facts and figures, including me. But definitely paying 100% duty and a penalty for a below 800cc bike is wrong. Opinions may differ.

viny

I at time feels what made govt to come up with rule of penalty for two wheelers below 800cc and 100+ import duty

1. We dont have any manufacturer other then Enfield producing bikes from 250cc+, so whom is govt trying to protect here ?
2. Hero Honda is worlds largest bike producer in the world for the category between 100 - 250cc. No where in the world I have seen govts trying to block imports of a product for whom the worlds largest producing company is in there country. Rather govt should open up the category above 250cc so that we have more competition for innovativeness, or else we will keep seeing the sticker jobs every 6 months.
3. How much govt could earn from few 100 motorbike imports per annum. Probably govt can earn more if they allow proper motorsports, this will develop a big industry and direct revenues from it would bring in large income for government. And this will help the automoble industry and its ancillaries to start producing world class products. India has good opportunity to quickly grow in automobile hub, we have seen that happening in small car segment. Which less that 1/10 of motorbike segment size.
4. How much logically and morally its right to kill ones aspirations to meet others aspirations. Middle class has already being lot of compromises in there life, they need opportunities to have some happiness for which they are willing to pay real amounts and not the highly inflated ones.


Thank god they are not charing 110% import duty on iphones/htc/blacberry's saying that they are more of luxury products

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pudix

I dont think I understood what you were trying to say. What exactly are you complaining about again? The rich getting all ther kicks from expensive products and the poor not being able to afford them and hence becoming poorer? Or NOT bringing in expensive stuff to India will in some weird way make the life of the poor better? Or there are a million problems plaguing our nation and so we otta stop getting better bikes/cars in?

The only reason sound enough to be accepted for this side of the debate is that we need indigenous developement- and I think people have answered that. But even so, the companies we have now are big enough to be not babied- they need someone to tell them they cannot be commercial monopolistic gods- Bajaj was contemplating buying Triumph, HH is probably bigger. Whats stopping them from going a step further and doing something actually laudable? Surely its not Kasab or the erstwhile LTTE.

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Ayush Singh

Great to hear from all the members in here. I appreciate your words and time on this thread.

@niks_devil666
In developed nations taxes are not on the basis of slab system, hence a part of income which is extra gets deducted in tax which at times turns out to be a lot, 33% or so, where as in India the slab lets the tax to be deducted in tune of 10-30% for income above 5lacks and so. Adding on, majority of Indian population's income lies in the Nil slab. A small percentage of people living mostly in urban India pay taxes above 30%. The average software engineer in India pays less tax than what one pays in US.

@theslayer
I understand entertainment is a part of life and it should be there. I cannot imagine my life without music and movies. However, entertainment like riding a 1000cc motorbike which consumes more fuel per kilometer than a poor rural Indian earns in a day is lavish. I ain't against the enjoyment factor, I'm against the fact that people spend huge money on entertainment when someone living few miles away doesn't get enough food to survive.
So, when we are talking about 1000cc bikes, we are talking about a lot of money, and that money can come only from the one who has the capacity to spend, i.e. the rich, so even if they pay double on what they might have paid in US, the rich won't mind it.
With time these policies will be relaxed and of course we will see bikes sold at much affordable prices in India, but the time needed is inversely proportional to development. I'm sure you don't want to ride a Harley from the "smallways" made in between slums.

@svjhonda
How many people do you think want a superbike? A small percentage of people living in urban India. The rural population still strives to own a motorcycle. For that small percentage that wants and can afford a superbike, spending extra is not at all difficult.

@viny
1. There ain't much takes of 250cc bikes in India. In metros the common bike is a 150cc, in semi urban its 125cc and in rural India its 100cc. Its demand and supply principle that doesn't lets manufacture go high on engine capacity.
2. Yeah I agree with you on this. The sticker job from Hero Honda is really bad and can be implied due to lack of quality competition.
3. I understand that the government wants to earn some money and also to limit the use of these vehicles to the class that can afford it with a smile. However, what the government fails to deliver this extra money to the poor and in need.
4. Pay real amounts, then please don't bother paying the extra.

@pudix
I've extensively traveled in various poor states of India. Have been to many villages, hitchhiked on villager's vehicles, and have seen the face of India from a farmer's view. I saw how much pain, trouble and misery poor people go through just to survive. After this I never went back to Taj Land's End or an expensive phone and have used that extra money that I had to help the poor in some way or the other.
With this zeal to develop infrastructure in Rural India, I felt the need for people to see the picture before being biased on the use of expensive vehicles in India. When your brother in a village can ride a Splendor, feel free to own a Harley, but when he struggles to repair his bicycle, its all obnoxious.
India has been talking about development and GDPs, but the whole lot of development is limited to a large Urban population. Even these villagers want a better life and so they migrate to metros increasing burden and population. Problems are everywhere, but they have different sets in places. In India we are hampering our thoughts by thinking that we have the latest Blackberry and now its time to have Harley, where at the same time a farmer is committing suicide because he cannot repay 1/3rd of what that Blackberry costs. Blame it on politicians, or on system, trouble starts from us.


Summing it up, I ain't against the use of expensive vehicles. I feel the need to have a balance in our society and nation, a Harley and a bicycle doesn't create a balance. Hope my comment didn't hurt anyone's, I just tried to present my take on this.

threat2myself1

but dont you think 100% duty is a bit...or shall i say really tooo much???
if all the extra money was genuinely going to the poor and the development of the country u might have had a point...
which i dont think is the case ..is it??

vipin_s

If I were industry minister I would hike duty to 200%, why import ? Let the biggies set up plants here give jobs to us and make profits and share them here in India ? Importing is bad on economy (both macro & micro).