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Thread: Braking

  1. #21
    Rusted Sunnyside_up!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TenHut View Post
    Are you aware that some newbie will read your post and try the stuff out on the roads ? Do you realise that spreading wrong info may cost someone their life ? Braking is serious business harikeshpk.
    Here is what you are suggesting : when in panic situation it is wise to tap-release the brakes.
    Have you ever been in a panic situation ? Do you know how much time you have to brake in a panic situation ? There is a reason why it gets termed as "Panic" braking. You practice your braking everyday not because you should know how to brake when in panic. You practice braking on a daily basis to make braking a reflex action. Something what they call as 'muscle memory'
    Now tell me how in the hell are you going to have time to tap and release when in panic ? You wont even be halfway through to your first tap before you crash.
    +1 on that ! There's simply NO TIME to do this.

    Quote Originally Posted by TenHut View Post
    I ride in India too. I know the roads here. Neither have I forgotten the use of rear brakes. Sportsbikes are biased towards the front in terms of weight distribution. On ANY roads except gravel you can afford to completely ignore the rear brakes(for sports bikes)
    +1 again ! I've hardly used my rear brake at all since I got my bike and I'm definitely no expert on riding techniques but I AM very conscious of my bike's traction and have found that the front brake alone does the job beautifully in most cases. I've used the rear only on rare occasions when I felt more stopping power was required more urgently but that too VERY VERY gingerly.

    Quote Originally Posted by TenHut View Post
    Braking is a function of the weight distribution on a bike..its different for different bikes.
    I think this is braking in a nut-shell. Brilliantly put TH!

    I could be wrong but I also feel that in some small way, it also depends on the weight and build of the rider. I'm a tall and heavy built guy and I've found that while the front brakes alone works fine for me 99% of the time, an occasional ( when required ) gentle right foot with an even but slowly increasing pressure helps to shed speed quick while keeping my mass more centered, preventing a stoppie or a tankslap. I also think that the exact amount of pressure and force used on the brake lever and pedal (if used) will vary from one rider to the next, depending on the rider's own mass...... but hey! That's just me thinkin' aloud!

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  2. #22
    Addicted gouravkatyal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TenHut View Post
    its not a technique at all. Its not a way to help your bike stop ..it does the opposite of that. So yeah its not like chosing between two techniques. Its just plain wrong.
    That said..I crashed my 600 due to panic braking...so it aint something I can do myself either. but everyday I am learning to do it better and thats all that counts..it will save my life.
    Thanks for the info Tenhut....really helpful...Have started using this method since yesterday and can understand exactly what you mean... A majority of us haven't had experience with high capacity bikes so these discussions really help out! thanks again...
    Last edited by gouravkatyal; 06-30-2010 at 09:18 AM. Reason: typo

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    What Tenhut said applies not only to high capacity motorcycles, but applicable for any motorized two wheeler. Basics of braking which guys like me missed out on.

    I guess I was braking the way I did because of my bitter experience with the front locking out in the past. But that changes from now on!

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anupdas View Post
    Sorry for my intrusion. TenHut just explained the right method. I remember an interview of John Hopkins mentioning the transferring weight to front tyre while hard turning, to prevent the bike from low siding. He mentioned about using the rear brake to "brake the trail". Can you explain what he meant by that?
    He was most probably referring to using his brakes and body positioning to load up the front to make it more stable by providing it with a wider contact patch enabling more traction.
    I am no racer so guys who have done track-days shall be in a better position to answer your query.

    ^You CANNOT tap-release-tap in a panic situation, you would be shitting bricks at the moment,
    as far as rear brakes go, i do use it to make the bike stable and to be in-line.

    Braking combo does change on gravel-off road situation where the braking for both wheels go in a reverse situation where rear wheel has to do most of the braking and front is used in a straight line.

    @TH--Arai off(Shark for you ) for your words as i see myself in capable of explaining the way in which you have. Thanks

    Even i haven't got the hang off panic braking situation right, though Thank God haven't crashed my Motorcycle for past few years. i need to learn more on the road.

    ^^Lets carry off our discussion to other relevant thread

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    i totally agree with TenHut with regards to braking technique.
    i came across this article, which i believe provides what staged braking is all about. it also justifies the same philosophy as quoted by tenhut ...

    Motorcycle Braking: 15 Questions and Answers - webBikeWorld

    Do read point 7 & 10.
    one good thing it states is that at any point of time your brain can concentrate only one brake, and it's even more at the time of panic.
    So do read it.

  6. #26
    Rusted n_aditya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluevolt View Post
    I guess I was braking the way I did because of my bitter experience with the front locking out in the past. But that changes from now on!
    +1 to that. I was being paranoid of locking my wheels and having a fall.

    Quote Originally Posted by bluevolt View Post
    My apologies to Aditya since he seemed to have used my advice to brake.
    Please dont apologize Rahul. I had read some articles and i guess I didnt pay much attention to the techniques mentioned. I merely glanced through. I've got the Sport Riding Techniques eBook and will be handing out copies of it to fellow riders (who are interested) when we meet for G2G's.
    Last edited by n_aditya; 06-30-2010 at 12:09 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyperion View Post
    So I suppose if you have excess tyre pressure at the front, you would lose traction under heavy braking?
    Yes! Excess tyre pressure will reduce the contact patch even after the front is loaded gradually.
    Last edited by SAGARR_46; 06-30-2010 at 12:58 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sheelpriye View Post
    He was most probably referring to using his brakes and body positioning to load up the front to make it more stable by providing it with a wider contact patch enabling more traction.
    I am no racer so guys who have done track-days shall be in a better position to answer your query.
    Thanks for your reply bro. By listening to MotoGP commentators somehow I know how riders pull off some super human maneuvers. Brakes are used to transfer the weight distribution but the riders use their body position to balance the bike in high lean angles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hyperion View Post
    So I suppose if you have excess tyre pressure at the front, you would lose traction under heavy braking?
    The frictional force equals the product of coefficient of friction and the normal reaction. Under hardbraking the coefficient of friction remains the same, so only way to increase fricional force is to increase the normal reaction which equals the force exerted by the front tyre on the ground. When the braking is done as in tap in method the weight transfer is too quick and there isn't enough friction to prevent lock up. On the other hand when we slowly(not so slowly) increases the brake pressure the normal reaction increases making more contact patch and better friction. So its more effective than sudden application of brakes.

    In hard braking often the rear brakes will be making little contact with the ground. And if we are braking with only front brake, the rear wheel still has the inertia that will increase the stopping distance . So we need to slow them as well to follow our intended line. But as in panic situation the effect of not using rear brake is not so critical.
    Last edited by Anupdas; 06-30-2010 at 02:55 PM.
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    Very Interesting discussion, and an mighty useful one too... learnt a lot from the above posts.

    quick question which might be a stupid one: Does/should the braking technique vary based on the type of bike, like diff technique for cruiser bikes?

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    Whoa! That's a hell a lot of braking gyan over there. Well! if you ask me we need to take a 'horses for courses' approach.

    I came into a 'panic' situation a couple of days back when I was negotiating a S bend. I did the left bend and when on the right I realised I did'nt have enough space on the curve and was going too fast....I have no idea what I did, but I guess it was right...my front tyre wobbled a little and then steadied. I wish I knew what it was, I did! LOL
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