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Thread: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by sibun View Post

    1. Vibrations are there but with kilometers it smoothens out. My bike is nil vibes and only vibes on revving in idle. On road its super smooth. This bike doesn't have counter balancer although i have seen the hole in crankcase for counter balancer. The extreme 200 has a counter balancer.


    .
    I am having a problem with vibrations, especially from 5.5k rpm onwards. Haven't gone beyond 7k so can't comment if it's better after that.

    The vibrations are pretty much there, and makes me not want to rev higher.

    Is this normal for the Xtreme or am I looking at potential problems with the engine?

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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by falkirk223 View Post
    I am having a problem with vibrations, especially from 5.5k rpm onwards. Haven't gone beyond 7k so can't comment if it's better after that.

    The vibrations are pretty much there, and makes me not want to rev higher.

    Is this normal for the Xtreme or am I looking at potential problems with the engine?
    How much on odo? Is it a new bike?

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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by #bpk View Post
    How much on odo? Is it a new bike?
    33700kms. Used bike

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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by falkirk223 View Post
    33700kms. Used bike
    Use motul 5100, 10w 30. Used it on my brother's 30k run super splendor which had severe vibrations, now after using that very little vibes even in 80 kmph! Also gearshifts have become smoother.

  5. #11335
    Moderator Divya Sharan's Avatar
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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Well, a lot of commotion on the thread of late and I see shots fired from all sides.
    All said and done, lets keep using this platform to learn. Yes, a couple of niggles or two here and there don't mean that quality has degraded, certainly not by a ghastly amount. Even the costliest of vehicles throw tantrums and if the manufacturer recalled/replaced something under warranty FOC, then it's a lesson learnt for both - customer and manufacturer.
    A prime example is a Ninja 250R. Kawasaki refined that bike mechanically over 20 years and once it landed at our shores, we got a mechanically invincible machine. It threw some gremlins now and then, but still it has been the standard bearer in terms of reliability and engineering. N300 is based on the same mill, so it carries forward the legacy.
    Now, Hornet is only a few years old and we're not patient enough to give Honda the time that Kawasaki had!

    Not just us, manufacturers learn too, with their offerings. Some are quicker to try and resolve issues compared to others, but as long as it's not a niche product, ALL manufacturers pay heed one day or another. Nobody likes losing market share.

    Senior members, please avoid using slang words like 'cr@p', 'sh!t' etc on the forum. Not only is it against rules, it degrades page search ranking on Google search engine.
    And these rules apply to all.

    Quote Originally Posted by falkirk223 View Post
    I am having a problem with vibrations, especially from 5.5k rpm onwards. Haven't gone beyond 7k so can't comment if it's better after that.

    The vibrations are pretty much there, and makes me not want to rev higher.

    Is this normal for the Xtreme or am I looking at potential problems with the engine?
    First try figuring out if vibes are from the body or engine or both.

    Check all nuts and bolts, all joints, cracks in plastic, console area gaps etc.
    Check engine mounting points, chain cleanliness, slack and lubrication. Use a thinner oil and check oil level (low oil level causes vibes). Avoid 20w oil. It won't flow well and cause vibes as well as heat.
    Ensure tappets are correctly set for both inlet and exhaust.

    These are basic things. Knock each one out and we shall then discuss the rest.
    Last edited by Divya Sharan; 03-14-2019 at 10:14 PM.
    sibun, ashwanth.r and dumb0 like this.

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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwinprakas View Post
    This is news, had no idea they missed out on the balancer on the CBZX, commendable that even without one there isn't much to complain.
    The international cousin of the Unicorn 150 engine, the CG150 Titan (Similar to Unicorn 150) and NXR Bros 150 (essentially an Impulse) has a balancer. The same engine was used on the Hero Honda Impulse and later this design was carried on to the Xtreme 200R.

    I don't know why Honda choose to dump the balancer on the Unicorn, may be more moving parts = lesser mileage and also not every engine requires a balancer. They should have optimized the crankshaft to run without a balancer. Even the CBF125 Stunner/Shine doesn't have a balancer but there are holes to fit the bearings. I have a feeling that the engine life of Impulse should be slightly higher than Unicorn/CBZ.

    On the Unicorn, what they essentially did was to pull out the balancer like appendectomy and simply replace the gear that turns the balancer shaft with a solid piece of metal, Honda called this a "collar". The collar is there to maintain weight balance of the crankshaft and make the gear primary drive at right height to contact the clutch.

    Name:  CBF150 balancer.jpg
Views: 198
Size:  66.6 KB

    Out of curiosity, I wondered if the Unicorn 150 engine can be fitted with Impulse's balancer shaft, crankshaft and cylinder-piston kit. Later, had my heart in the throat when came to know that balancer shaft of Impulse costs 2800/- .

    It is also to be noted that Honda retained the balancer for it's 150s sold in Colombia and other similar countries while removed it for India. Interestingly, their oil recommendation for Colombian CG150 Titan was 20W-50. TVS too recommended 20W-50 for their Apache series in Peru/Colombia. Now, all of them are just recommended 10W-30.


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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by falkirk223 View Post
    I am having a problem with vibrations, especially from 5.5k rpm onwards. Haven't gone beyond 7k so can't comment if it's better after that.

    The vibrations are pretty much there, and makes me not want to rev higher.

    Is this normal for the Xtreme or am I looking at potential problems with the engine?
    Get your tappets, timing chain and tensioner checked. Also clean and lube the chain with gear oil and apply grease on gearbox sprockets. Will take care of the bikes. And what are you doing by not revving beyond 7k rpm. The real fun starts after 6.5k rpm and stops at 9.5k rpm. Enjoy that band.


    Quote Originally Posted by Divya Sharan View Post
    Well, a lot of commotion on the thread of late and I see shots fired from all sides.
    All said and done, lets keep using this platform to learn. Yes, a couple of niggles or two here and there don't mean that quality has degraded, certainly not by a ghastly amount. Even the costliest of vehicles throw tantrums and if the manufacturer recalled/replaced something under warranty FOC, then it's a lesson learnt for both - customer and manufacturer.
    A prime example is a Ninja 250R. Kawasaki refined that bike mechanically over 20 years and once it landed at our shores, we got a mechanically invincible machine. It threw some gremlins now and then, but still it has been the standard bearer in terms of reliability and engineering. N300 is based on the same mill, so it carries forward the legacy.
    Now, Hornet is only a few years old and we're not patient enough to give Honda the time that Kawasaki had!

    Not just us, manufacturers learn too, with their offerings. Some are quicker to try and resolve issues compared to others, but as long as it's not a niche product, ALL manufacturers pay heed one day or another. Nobody likes losing market share.

    Senior members, please avoid using slang words like 'cr@p', 'sh!t' etc on the forum. Not only is it against rules, it degrades page search ranking on Google search engine.
    And these rules apply to all.



    First try figuring out if vibes are from the body or engine or both.

    Check all nuts and bolts, all joints, cracks in plastic, console area gaps etc.
    Check engine mounting points, chain cleanliness, slack and lubrication. Use a thinner oil and check oil level (low oil level causes vibes). Avoid 20w oil. It won't flow well and cause vibes as well as heat.
    Ensure tappets are correctly set for both inlet and exhaust.

    These are basic things. Knock each one out and we shall then discuss the rest.
    As our Mr.mod has said many companies take years to master their products. Even skoda like companies have many problems which get solved with time, DSG gearbox is still doubtful in customers mind.

    Even bikes like dominar have niggles of coolant mixing with engine oil.

    So everything takes time.

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwanth.r View Post
    The international cousin of the Unicorn 150 engine, the CG150 Titan (Similar to Unicorn 150) and NXR Bros 150 (essentially an Impulse) has a balancer. The same engine was used on the Hero Honda Impulse and later this design was carried on to the Xtreme 200R.

    I don't know why Honda choose to dump the balancer on the Unicorn, may be more moving parts = lesser mileage and also not every engine requires a balancer. They should have optimized the crankshaft to run without a balancer. Even the CBF125 Stunner/Shine doesn't have a balancer but there are holes to fit the bearings. I have a feeling that the engine life of Impulse should be slightly higher than Unicorn/CBZ.

    On the Unicorn, what they essentially did was to pull out the balancer like appendectomy and simply replace the gear that turns the balancer shaft with a solid piece of metal, Honda called this a "collar". The collar is there to maintain weight balance of the crankshaft and make the gear primary drive at right height to contact the clutch.

    Name:  CBF150 balancer.jpg
Views: 198
Size:  66.6 KB

    Out of curiosity, I wondered if the Unicorn 150 engine can be fitted with Impulse's balancer shaft, crankshaft and cylinder-piston kit. Later, had my heart in the throat when came to know that balancer shaft of Impulse costs 2800/- .

    It is also to be noted that Honda retained the balancer for it's 150s sold in Colombia and other similar countries while removed it for India. Interestingly, their oil recommendation for Colombian CG150 Titan was 20W-50. TVS too recommended 20W-50 for their Apache series in Peru/Colombia. Now, all of them are just recommended 10W-30.
    Balancer shaft is omitted because honda and hero managed to make the bike smooth without one.
    And slowly tolerance are getting tighter so use of thinner oils.

    If you think 10 w 30 is thinner then my car uses 0 w 20. New k15b uses 0 w 16 oils.

    And as per recent papers that i have seen japan is using since 2 years 0w 8 oil in labs. Soon they will be out.

    So oils are getting thinner as engine parts clearance are decreasing. Moreover with emission norms getting stricter thinner oils are future.

    And for adding balancer shaft no need of changing crank and cylinder kit.
    dumb0 likes this.
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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by ashwanth.r View Post
    The international cousin of the Unicorn 150 engine, the CG150 Titan (Similar to Unicorn 150) and NXR Bros 150 (essentially an Impulse) has a balancer. The same engine was used on the Hero Honda Impulse and later this design was carried on to the Xtreme 200R.

    I don't know why Honda choose to dump the balancer on the Unicorn, may be more moving parts = lesser mileage and also not every engine requires a balancer. They should have optimized the crankshaft to run without a balancer. Even the CBF125 Stunner/Shine doesn't have a balancer but there are holes to fit the bearings. I have a feeling that the engine life of Impulse should be slightly higher than Unicorn/CBZ.

    On the Unicorn, what they essentially did was to pull out the balancer like appendectomy and simply replace the gear that turns the balancer shaft with a solid piece of metal, Honda called this a "collar". The collar is there to maintain weight balance of the crankshaft and make the gear primary drive at right height to contact the clutch.

    Name:  CBF150 balancer.jpg
Views: 198
Size:  66.6 KB

    Out of curiosity, I wondered if the Unicorn 150 engine can be fitted with Impulse's balancer shaft, crankshaft and cylinder-piston kit. Later, had my heart in the throat when came to know that balancer shaft of Impulse costs 2800/- .

    It is also to be noted that Honda retained the balancer for it's 150s sold in Colombia and other similar countries while removed it for India. Interestingly, their oil recommendation for Colombian CG150 Titan was 20W-50. TVS too recommended 20W-50 for their Apache series in Peru/Colombia. Now, all of them are just recommended 10W-30.
    Engine oil grade causes too much confusion! In some countries honda recommends 10w 40 for cbr and here 10w 30 !

  9. #11339
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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by sibun View Post
    If you think 10 w 30 is thinner then my car uses 0 w 20. New k15b uses 0 w 16 oils. And as per recent papers that i have seen japan is using since 2 years 0w 8 oil in labs. Soon they will be out. So oils are getting thinner as engine parts clearance are decreasing. Moreover with emission norms getting stricter thinner oils are future.
    No, my point was not that 10W-30 is thinner. I was saying Honda gave the same engine to India without a balancer and 10W-30 (earlier 20W-40) and to Colombia with a balancer and 20W-50 recommendation. Most of us who buy the Unicorn 150 ride it sedately; however, most of the videos I have seen from Latin Americas, they are ridden ruthlessly. Honda uses, IIRC, 0W-20 even for the diesel Amaze. Am not sure if the motorcycling industry would move to anything lower than 10W-30, as thinner the oil more the chances of gear pitting (since M/Cs have a integrated gearbox) and viscosity degradation over time. 0W-16 sounds amazing, so Suzuki got the Ecstar for their cars too!

    Quote Originally Posted by sibun View Post
    And for adding balancer shaft no need of changing crank and cylinder kit.
    Oh, I thought they are different. I don't know the intricacy of physics involved here but Achiever's crankshaft is costlier than Impulse's and with different part no according to Hero's catalogue. My wild guess would be that Impulse's crankshaft is lighter (less metal) while the Achiever's has more counterweights 'built-in'.

    Quote Originally Posted by #bpk View Post
    Engine oil grade causes too much confusion! In some countries honda recommends 10w 40 for cbr and here 10w 30 !
    No need to get confused. Just use an original (sourced from a reputed shop or a distributor) 10W-30 or 10W-40. And if it is mineral, it can be drained after 2000-3000 kms as the cost will be more or less similar to someone using a fully synthetic and keeping it in for 6000-7000 kms.
    shriramsau and #bpk like this.


  10. #11340
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    Default Re: CBZ xtreme / Hunk

    Quote Originally Posted by #bpk View Post
    Engine oil grade causes too much confusion! In some countries honda recommends 10w 40 for cbr and here 10w 30 !
    Ambient temperature + riding conditions vary geographically. Hence the varying grades. Even in India, manufacturers like Yamaha recommend a range of grades to be used in different seasons and applications.
    Last edited by Divya Sharan; 03-15-2019 at 01:11 PM.
    sibun, dumb0 and #bpk like this.

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