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**Noor** · 09-08-2011, 05:03 PM

Thread approved

**jd666** · 09-08-2011, 06:24 PM

It is possible, but then if once the engine is warmed up, does the bike start normally? as in if you switch it off for about 20-30 seconds and try starting it when the engine is hot.

And 1 L + kms in indian conditions is a lot. A change of timing gear, cams, rockers, valves, springs etc should be in place if not already done. ( if you are planning to keep the bike further ). its a kawasaki engine.. thats the usp!!

**Samarth 619** · 09-08-2011, 06:27 PM

If I bike did not start, you could try using choke.

What mechanic said mostly sounds logical, except that there are many other ways of compression loss, other than just a bent or leaking valve. Try some other mechanic and notice what he says about the situation.
Secondly,

1. Did the mechanic opened the engine before saying that the valve is bent?

2. Did you get the clutch plates checked?

3. Do you notice a engine sound change, noticeable near the engine?

80 kmph is slightly lesser than the Caliber's actual potential. Let me tell you that around 1 Lac kms is the time when most of the motorcycles' engines go for a serious overhaul, although your case might not require it.

**abdriver2000** · 09-08-2011, 06:51 PM

Originally posted by jd666 View Post

It is possible, but then if once the engine is warmed up, does the bike start normally? as in if you switch it off for about 20-30 seconds and try starting it when the engine is hot.

And 1 L + kms in indian conditions is a lot. A change of timing gear, cams, rockers, valves, springs etc should be in place if not already done. ( if you are planning to keep the bike further ). its a kawasaki engine.. thats the usp!!

Yes, the engine starts normally when warm. Availability of spares for this model has been an issue for last couple of years. How do I ensure engine parts are available?

**abdriver2000** · 09-08-2011, 06:55 PM

Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post

If I bike did not start, you could try using choke.

What mechanic said mostly sounds logical, except that there are many other ways of compression loss, other than just a bent or leaking valve. Try some other mechanic and notice what he says about the situation.
Secondly,

1. Did the mechanic opened the engine before saying that the valve is bent?
No, he removed the spark plug and slowly kicked the start pedal while hearing the engine sound closely.

2. Did you get the clutch plates checked? I changed the clutch plates at 75k. There are no false neutrals, so I am assuming the plates are good.

3. Do you notice a engine sound change, noticeable near the engine? No

80 kmph is slightly lesser than the Caliber's actual potential. Let me tell you that around 1 Lac kms is the time when most of the motorcycles' engines go for a serious overhaul, although your case might not require it. Yes, my personal best has been 85 with pillion. Company stats say 100kmph is top speed.

My answers in bold above

**Samarth 619** · 09-08-2011, 08:07 PM

Unless he sees the valve himself, how can he claim its leaking? Sound doesn't always tell a bent valve? And how can a valve bend anyways?

And by the way, your problem is just the morning startup, and top speed, right?

Achieving the same Top Speed on an older machine is not always possible, due to less compression. Again, less compression doesn't mean its due to bent/ leaking valve only...

It happens due to age and running. Even R15's engine starts to lose compression on 20,000 kms and above. Yours ran 1 Lac kms somehow, credits to the amazing Kawasaki engineering.

1. So basically, apart from top speed, your other problem is just the morning start and nothing else, right? Did you try using choke?
Remember, that everyone with a carburetted bike, faces this problem in varying degrees.

2. And one more thing, I think smoke should be seen out of your silencer if the outlet valve is leaking. Do you see smoke out of your exhaust, specially on revving it high?

Read the post carefully and answer the questions, then we'll see what can be done...

**abdriver2000** · 09-08-2011, 10:30 PM

Yes, Samarth! My only problem is the cold start. Using choke did not help. Top speed is not my issue.

There is no absolutely no smoke at any speed.

**Samarth 619** · 09-09-2011, 10:15 PM

I hope your idle rpm is up to 1400 rpm when engine is hot/ returning from a ride... is it?

Secondly, get the spark plug polished/ replaced as per requirement.

Valves do not cut off just like that when they are cold, as you say. Valves are physical parts and not flexible parts affected by temperature. Moreover, you don't see smoke (although this is a very inaccurate method).

I suggest you show the bike to a different mechanic, and get the 2 things done (idle rpm, spark plug).

**Aneesh@4GHz** · 09-10-2011, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post

Unless he sees the valve himself, how can he claim its leaking? Sound doesn't always tell a bent valve? And how can a valve bend anyways?

If the stem valve seal is damaged,there will be oil in the spark plug and thus he can identify oil leak from the valve area and he assumed it as a valve bent.

Correct me if i am wrong.

**sharingan** · 09-10-2011, 12:24 PM

On my friends bike the valves were replaced because it was bellowing white smoke.. unburnt fuel was escaping as the valves were not sealing.

In neutral, just rev the engine to see if the exhaust if white, this is a sign.

**jd666** · 09-10-2011, 03:59 PM

It could be the valve seat wearing out in the head. His problem is vehicle not starting. That generally happens if there would be a gap between the valve and the valve seat ( no compression ). Once things heat up, and expand, the gap is minimized, so the bike starts when the engine is hot.

New valves, and a new head would be the proper fix. But im sure the seats can be ground as well.

Bullet owners would know of this issue, when at times if the de-compression cable adjustment is too tight, or its really cold, The de-comp cable shrinks, and pulls the valve open. So no amount of kicking can start the bike. Only fix is to create a slack in the de-comp cable.

**abdriver2000** · 09-11-2011, 12:28 AM

The bike has suddenly corrected itself and no issues for past 2 days. Let's see if it starts correctly on Monday. Spark plug was recently changed, and is dark brown when hot. No smoke from exhaust. Idle rpm on tacho at start is about 1000 and 1400 when warm.

**abdriver2000** · 09-12-2011, 09:45 PM

The bike started in 2-3 kicks after 2.5 days. Maybe there was no problem in the first place, just some moisture due to rains.

This reminds me of another mechanic who advised me to replace the piston when I had complained of low mileage. This incident had occured at 17K on the Odo. It has been >7 years since then. I stopped going to him since then.

This current mechanic has been with my bike for about 4 years now. And he has helped me at times when I have been stranded 35kms from home. Will do a reality check with him when I visit him for the next oil change.

**boxter83** · 11-30-2012, 04:53 PM

valves

valves, if i would do that first is i will check the tip of the plugs and see how the carbon deposits are burned. if i see black deposits then i have to adjust mixture of air in the carburator. if this does not work after adjusting the air and yet the deposit is still black take out the plugs and to be more technical check the compression using a compression guage. if it reads below its recommended try adjusting the valves tappets. this is to bring back the compression ratio to its required ratio. this is part of a major tune-up. A valve problem always makes your spark plug busted even after replacing it with a new one. (major symptoms) on a valve problem next is upon accelaration no pull or power. I hope this can help you.

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