Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

GBD approved!

Rupee has fallen down in value. So what was priced at 25,000 rupees maybe twenty years back is priced much more today, add to that various taxes!
And a brand new Nano costs between 2L to 2.9L ex showroom Delhi. It's no more just a 1L car. If bikes are getting costlier, so are cars!

Now, coming to your query - a 150cc commuter delivers 40-55 kmpl mileage depending upon the riding style and conditions. Does a Nano give that?
A 2 wheeler is smaller and hence nimbler. It requires very little parking space and moving in traffic is very easy when compared to cars. The Nano wouldn't qualify for these conditions, right?

In India, 2 wheelers are rarely a luxury. SBK owners and enthusiasts aside (I guess these 2 combined don't even account for 5% of the motorcyclists in India); bikes in India provide a cheap mode of transport/commute from point A to point B.
If cars were as cheap to run and maintain, Mr Ratan Tata wouldn't have bled crores and every person would have had a roof during commute in rains.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

It all depends on the consumers interest as well, Some use it as just a travel tool and some take it as a passion.

A Bajaj Plaitna sells under 50k (I guess), so owning a two wheeler is not that big issue if someone really wants to. I have seen people who owns a big retail store in our place comes in splendor, for him it does the job.

I work for an IT firm and I spent 6L to get a bike for myself. But yeah, bikes are getting dearer and costlier as days goes by, But we really need to stop it comparing to a Nano.

Its not just Psychological impact here, imagine the amount you will end up spending on the maintenance and like what DS pointed out, a two wheeler has it Pros and cons. We dont want to get into a debate of which is safer, which is not, yadda, yadda...

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!


I have no idea where you are from, but from the prices, I guess you are from Nepal or Bangladesh.

Anyways, a CT100 is 40K, Platina 45, Splendor 50, Stunner/Ignitor(the top 125cc bikes) are 65 K/

Suzuki Gixxer is 85 K, FZ ver 2 is 90K
Karizma R is 90K
Pulsar 220 is 100K
Pulsar 200AS is 110K

So the prices are fair

And the Tata Nano costs 1.99 lakh ex-showroom(base model) so thats about 2.5 lakhs on road.
I fail to see the point you are making.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Hi,

The prices you have given are all ex-showroom prices. In Bangalore, the place where i stay in,the onroad price of gixxer is 93 k, sf gixxer is 103k and fz is 97k .

I was talking about 125/150 cc bikes that their prices reaching the five figure mark could hit the affordability of a common man

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!


They are NOT ex-showroom prices here. They are all on road.

The stunner retails for 65k on road. And its the most premium 125cc in the country.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

A bike is a bike and a car is a car
They both can't replace each other. If you want a bike a car will not do and if you need a car a bike will not do. Having said that inflation catches up with everything including bikes. Top Model nano cost above 200k bro

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

During my college days back in 2004 dad bought me a Bajaj Discover 125 Dtsi self start for 48k On road. I remember Unicorn was launched around the same time for 53k on road. Pulsar used to be 55k back then.

I bought my second bike in 2009. It was a Honda Unicorn self start. Paid exactly 60k On road in Delhi.

I'm looking to buy my third bike now( Gixxer SF) which is 1.02L on road.

Prices of two wheeler has definitely gone up. Part of the reason has been increasing wages, escalating prices of raw materials and increase in road tax & other taxes. One needs to pay 13% of the ex showroom price towards life time tax in Bangalore.

Having said all of the above, Income levels in India has also gone up considerably over the last decade. 50k back in 2004 was a lot of money but 1.0L isn't a lot of money for young employed guys these days. Moreover, loans are available in plenty these days which was not the case 15 years back.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Why not AS200 ???

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Thanks for your views. And it was my bad to compare bikes with cars.

Definitely the income levels have gone up, but still to get approval from the home ministries (wife and parents) would be very difficult as 1 lakh is a huge psychological figure.

Though it is not directly related, but I have a different opinion on two wheeler loans. The two wheeler loans are not cheaper. My friend was looking for a loan of 50 k for which he had to pay 25 percent as interest, transaction fee, other charges etc. This is for one year loan and a three year loan was much higher, the interest portion and other charges were closer to the principal amount. This is insane.

And then he took a personal loan from his salaried account (which works out much cheaper), the interest was about 11 percent, with out any other additional charges.

Hope this makes sense for all prospective buyers

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Automobile Finance becomes more and more relevant as prices go up. And this upwards movement isn't going to go down anytime soon.


Electric vehicles will help you get more financial freedom:-

1. They help you get rid of the "regular services" of their petrol counterparts, thus saving lots of money.

2. They help you get costs as low as Rs. 0.20/ kms even for a well performance commuter touching 60 kmph with good acceleration.

3. They break down comparatively less.

4. No engine oil costs.

5. Lithium battery is replaced only after years of service and life, almost when you'll overhaul an engine on your petrol vehicle.


The challenges however are:-

1. Initial costs: In comparison to a petrol vehicle, the electric vehicle (with the superior Lithium ion battery) is more expensive.
With a similar segment, we're looking at approximately 50% more expensive electric vehicle.

2. Battery replacement after 5-15 years, may also be expensive.

3. I'm not sure how government is going to make an earning out of this new concept. Earlier, petrol used to be the bread and butter of government, but with this advent I guess, government will focus on getting vehicles charged not at customer's home, but at charging stations, where its quite possible that they will have taxes and duties thus making it expensive to own.
Your best bet is a home based charger.


Now, we all can easily understand that the 5 positive points far outweigh the 3 negative points at first sight.
Rest, we all know how electric motors are reliable, look at our ceiling fans.


So, this concept will help a little, as the initial amount can be financed too.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!


A couple of points on electric vehicles that should be taken into account concerning their cost:

Electric vehicles have a far more rigid range of travel. Once you get to the point where the battery reaches discharge, you have to stop and spend several hours recharging, and wherever that is had better have an electrical outlet.

Electric vehicles, especially smaller two-wheelers, tend to have a more limited top speed and carrying capacity. Even the more high-end electric bikes still only have room for one rider and no cargo.

They might be somewhat more reliable, but if they do break down, there aren't going to be mechanics every couple of km who can help get you running again, and you're not likely to have the skills to do it yourself. Additionally, most electric breakdowns are either some expensive component (relays, rectifiers, or motor) or a software problem.

The comparison to a ceiling fan is fallacious, since the fan runs at a constant speed under light load. An electric vehicle motor is constantly changing speed and load, and is exposed to a far more harsh environment.

And finally, if you care about this kind of thing: despite the so-called "green" label that electric vehicle makers like to flash around, the vast majority of electric vehicles still ultimately rely on coal power, so while they don't produce any real pollution locally, the power that drives them is still dumping all kinds of crap into the air at some power plant a few miles away. And the manufacturing process for those batteries, while much better than it used to be, still involves some pretty horrific substances.

For the foreseeable future, fossil-fuel vehicles are still the most efficient form of transportation. About the only real advance that could be made in the motorcycle world would be the development of modern diesel engines. There have been a few attempts at diesel bikes in the past, and the US Marines actually came up with a pretty workable design based on the ultra-reliable Kawasaki KLR650. With modern computers and the newer common-rail injector designs, a diesel bike line might now be feasible. Since diesel fuel has more energy in it per liter, diesel bikes would reduce fuel usage and pollution, while lasting longer (diesel motors require finer engineering tolerances, and as a side benefit tend to be more durable). The bikes might cost a bit more up front, but will need to be replaced far less often and thus impose a lower TCO on their owners.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Thanks for the informative post. I've edited my previous post with a point no. 3 highlighting one actual problem we may face...

You're factually right.

But, as of this thread, we're focused on the basic bike, the 100cc, the commuter. This kind of bike is unlikely to be used much for touring.. So, I wouldn't worry about range anxiety.
The upcoming lithium ion based vehicle concepts are promising a ride of maybe from 50 kms all the way up to 200 kms, depending on which product it is. This is good enough for commuting in my opinion.
I belong to a very small city, so no matter where I am in the city, its at worst a 10 kms ride to home, but I understand that charge must be managed well in bigger cities like Delhi/ Gurgaon, Mumbai, etc...


Top speed is limited, yes, but that top speed is a realistic speed on which you can cruise the whole ride, without any worry of stressing the motor.

Sorry about the cieling fan reference. Ya, it was a bit casual.

Like I said, its a commute we're talking about. So, if it breaks down once in a green moon, why should we bother? Its just a trip to SVC next door (or next locality), right?
Service center, warranty and insurance will help us out, depending on what kind of breakdown it is.


With time, battery technology will improve. We're about 3 to 5 years away from a commercial Supercapacitor based battery which will charge fully in 2 minutes or so, alongwith most other benefits of lithium ion battery.


Electric isn't green for now. Agreed. But the roads will be greener, plus electric can be green tomorrow. There are more than 10 ways of getting electricity.
For fossil fuel, its either that or nothing. Fossil fuels can make electricity too, but not the other way round.
So, a motor is safer from being obsolete than an engine, as long as the winds blow, the water flows, the sun shines, etc...

We can have an electric scooter for a commute and a gasoline multicylinder for those weekends.

So, believe me, situation isn't that bad, and we're in the right direction.. But.....

Reading through your post I was reminded of a possible, upcoming challenge (which I added in my last post).
The government (whichever it may be) can't really find its source of income in this electric vehicle scenario, where companies like Ather, Tork, etc. are promising domestic, home based charging. With petrol, there is huge income.
So, I believe the government will impose a certain regulation in the coming years where you will only be able to charge electric vehicle through another billing scheme, but not your domestic subsidised connection. It could be charging pumps, or it could be separate charger with electric meter right at your home.
This will make their charges expensive in my opinion. Its all about vested interests. But this is 5-15 years in the future probably, not now, as electric vehicles can't be that famous this early....


Diesel is still an option, but it will be better than gasoline only in some matters, plus the engines will have to be bigger to get the same amount of horsepower. We're looking at the diesel range starting from 250cc itself for a commuter.. It will be torquey though.
And what about engine oil, maintenance, regular service, etc?

Yes, fossil fuels are here to stay for decades, but that's a macro interpretation of the scenario.
I'm focusing more on the micro aspect- a commuter thinking about his own benefit and budget. There, electrics seem to be making sense for now...

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!



Actually, the government will probably do what the US state governments are doing now. Currently, the gov't income comes from gasoline taxes. Many states here in the US where hybrid and all-electric cars have become more common are finding that tax revenues from gasoline sales are down. So they're now looking at replacing the gasoline tax with a mileage tax, which has the twofold effect of ensuring that all vehicles are burdened with tax, and it gives the government an opening to track movements (because the only way the gov is going to know reliably how far you drove is to include some kind of monitor on your vehicle).


I will give you that electric vehicles work moderately well if all you ever do with them is commute short distances to work. I will also grant that in a city, or in an Indian suburb, the lower speed of an electric is probably not a problem (in the US, lower speeds like that don't work so well; even in the cities, there are high-speed highways that eat battery charge). However, if you ever plan to ride on the weekend, you'll need something else (as you point out). But then you're maintaining two vehicles, so: two registrations, two sets of tires to replace, maintenance, insurance, etc. At that point, how much have you really saved? The money you're not spending on gas for your 10km daily commute is likely being spent and then some to maintain the other bike, even if you only ride it a couple of times on weekends.


Oh, and diesel engines don't necessarily need to be bigger, though they will be somewhat heavier. In the US, one of the more popular "pickup trucks" uses a 5.9L 6-cylinder diesel engine. That's roughly the same size as the engine in my own truck. Mine's a petrol 8-cylinder engine. That diesel makes the same horsepower and more torque in stock form than the engine in my vehicle. The drawback is that while the engine in my truck weighs a little more than 200kg, that diesel weighs around 500kg. Audi has done some amazing things with diesel engines, including win the LeMans 24-hour race. A modern engine for a bike might be 30% heavier than a comparable petrol engine, but would be the same size and get better fuel usage numbers. With weight being so critical for a bike, I don't think we'll see Pedrosa or Rossi running a diesel in the GP, but for a daily-driver bike it could work.

Re: 1 Lakh price barrier for commuter bikes approaching fast!

Hi Guys, Not to be rude here but you guys seem to go Off Topic. This thread is seemingly a price involved for a basic commuter which is becoming dearer for a common man day by day. Moreover your debate has a potential to be started as a new thread altogether. But that aside its pretty interesting to see the growing sector of electric mobility when compared to fossil fuel. With recent news of many European countries turning there heads towards electric mobility its safe to say that most parts of the world will be electric by 2025 and by that means though India has not really made a reforming statement of go electric yet, it will for sure be forced to do that in the coming G20 Summit. Germany already the fore Front runner to be 100% electric by 2025 sure many other countries will follow suit making electric mobility the only mode of transport. But as The Mountain had already posted about even electric mobility will be considered to be made costlier by levying more taxes on it, I don't see that to be done in the near Future at least till 2025 on the contrary there will be more benefits been given until the complete transformation to electric is done. Most probably the Fossil fuel run vehicles will get costlier as electric vehicles will comedown in price.