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  • psr
    replied
    Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
    Your readings with that brew is quite correct . During dynamic compression the spring inside the forks will absorb most of the load . The oil will show it's character mainly during rebound . Manufacturers preloads forks & shock-absorbers as per their definition of the bikes expected load and road etc . Not every person or riding condition will fall within that defined range , or maybe the manufacturer have been simply careless about it . Since you like the stronger dampening action with this bit heavier oil , I am sure it shall suit you . Rest assured , nothing will happen to your forks , if anything , the oil shall actually withstand a bit longer & better in use , than standard fork oils . This is because multigrade SAE engine oils have additives designed to prevent degradation of the oil under much more severe service conditions inside the engine sump . You see , forks and shock absorbers are quite primitive devices .
    Wheww....Mr.Pinaki thats one of the most detailed to the point explanation I had read......You are correct in every point you have made...

    Coming back to fork oils , there is a vast difference in operation of forks and engines . Inside a fork , the role of the oil is that of a hydraulic fluid , it's only desirable characteristics being not to lose it's fluidity in operating temperature and not to foam or sludge up quickly , on passing through the small orifice of the fork plunger . Although specific fork oils are really low-tech low-single-weight oils , multigrade engine oils / ATF perform admirably in this role too , since they too are designed not to foam/sludge up or lose viscosity easily . In that case , the first number of a XXwYY multigrade oil is it's working number inside a fork . i.e 10wt for a 10w30 . This is because forks don't heat up the oil much at all . Neither are they subject to shearing stress like in an engine . ATF is about 7.5wt , consistently , all over the world , which is why people like it . Many bike comes with an engine oil recomended for use in it's forks too .
    One more realistic factual explanation......
    Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
    OT @prince
    If it's the bike , it's popularity does not seem to diminish , and so you can still buy the cub new ; it is being made and sold in japan , malaysia , vietnam etc asian countries and australia , new zealand , usa etc . The CT90 / CT110 variant ( honda trail ) , which has a high-low range lever to instantly switch it's all four gears to a lower ratio to climb steep inclines , is the official post-office bike for Australia post ( postie bike ) . In 2008 it was 50 years in production and the sales has increased this year too . The PGMFi fuel injection technology used by HeroHonda ZMR in India was first developed , tested and incorporated by Honda on the cub in 2007 . The horizontal engines used on HeroHonda splendors , super splendor , passion , glamour etc are CUB engines .
    Key milestones of Honda Super Cub Series


    Now that's an amazing bike , isn't it ?

    What is Amazing here is the expanse of knowledge which you had chosen to hide so far, and the details in it.....So no more excuses..come forth and deliver and share your knowledge so we can all benefit...
    Replies in bold....

    Leave a comment:


  • Pinaki
    replied
    Originally posted by princesirohi View Post
    pinaki.....man thats a pretty detailed expalnation...........
    btw.....i liked that M80 ........eerrrr....honda cub photo.........
    OT @prince
    If it's the bike , it's popularity does not seem to diminish , and so you can still buy the cub new ; it is being made and sold in japan , malaysia , vietnam etc asian countries and australia , new zealand , usa etc . The CT90 / CT110 variant ( honda trail ) , which has a high-low range lever to instantly switch it's all four gears to a lower ratio to climb steep inclines , is the official post-office bike for Australia post ( postie bike ) . In 2008 it was 50 years in production and the sales has increased this year too . The PGMFi fuel injection technology used by HeroHonda ZMR in India was first developed , tested and incorporated by Honda on the cub in 2007 . The horizontal engines used on HeroHonda splendors , super splendor , passion , glamour etc are CUB engines .
    Key milestones of Honda Super Cub Series
    • August 1958 Sales of Super Cub C100 began (air-cooled 4-stroke, single-cylinder OHV engine, 49cc, 4.5 horse power)
    • Production site: Yamato Plant (later became Saitama Factory Wako Plant)
    • 1959 Exports to the U.S. began
    • 1960 Production at Suzuka Factory began
    • 1961 Cumulative production reached 1 million-unit milestone
    • 1961 Production based on component parts sets began in Taiwan (first production outside of Japan)
    • 1964 Sales of Super Cub C65 (the first OHC engine) began
    • 1966 Sales of Super Cub C50 (OHC engine) began
    • 1967 Cumulative production reached 5 million-unit milestone
    • 1974 Cumulative production reached 10 million-unit milestone
    • 1983 Fuel consumption of 180km/liter (30km/h constant-speed test value) achieved (Super Cub 50 Super Custom)
    • 1988 Sales of Press Cub began
    • 1991 Production was transferred to Kumamoto Factory
    • 1992 Cumulative production reached 20 million-unit milestone
    • 1997 Sales of Little Cub began
    • 2005 Cumulative production reached 50 million-unit milestone
    • 2007 An electronically-controlled fuel injection system, Honda’s PGM-FI, was installed on Super Cub 50, Press Cub 50 and Little Cub.
    • 2008 Cumulative production reached 60 million-unit milestone (April)

    Postman delivering mail on a Honda ct110 melbourne .

    Honda cub 2010 model - courtesy Autopro Magazine .

    Now that's an amazing bike , isn't it ?
    Last edited by Pinaki; 05-31-2011, 11:51 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Thunder
    replied
    @Pinaki : Thats an Amazing explanation, i do see that many local mechs here use Engine oils for their Forks,,, too when we ask they will say Fork oil is costlier and engine oil will not do any harm to the forks,,,, but after reading your explanation only i can figure out that what they are doing is actually no harm,

    To be in precise i've changed my fork oil only once since 2 years

    Leave a comment:


  • princesirohi
    replied
    pinaki.....man thats a pretty detailed expalnation...........

    btw.....i liked that M80 ........eerrrr....honda cub photo.........

    Leave a comment:


  • Pinaki
    replied
    Originally posted by Prith View Post
    hehehe... .. all blessings MUCH needed.
    Yeah. I liked this Pinaki. I have travelled ~ 45 Kms till now with the molatov cocktail in my front forks and all seems well except that recoil is little slow and much consistent and speed breakers are a pleasure to scale..vibration in handle bar has reduced considerably.
    Guys, let me run my bike this way for a week and will get the progress card for your perusal on Saturday..lets see how things turn up... CHEERS
    Your readings with that brew is quite correct . During dynamic compression the spring inside the forks will absorb most of the load . The oil will show it's character mainly during rebound . Manufacturers preloads forks & shock-absorbers as per their definition of the bikes expected load and road etc . Not every person or riding condition will fall within that defined range , or maybe the manufacturer have been simply careless about it . Since you like the stronger dampening action with this bit heavier oil , I am sure it shall suit you . Rest assured , nothing will happen to your forks , if anything , the oil shall actually withstand a bit longer & better in use , than standard fork oils . This is because multigrade SAE engine oils have additives designed to prevent degradation of the oil under much more severe service conditions inside the engine sump . You see , forks and shock absorbers are quite primitive devices .
    Originally posted by aargee View Post
    So can we see your report on using brake oil inside your engine instead of whatever specified XW-Y engine oil?
    Prince -
    I also have a splendor . It's engine is the same one Honda uses in it's CUB / CT-Trail bike range . In 2006, in a show on the Discovery Channel, "The Greatest Ever", a series of documentaries on various motor vehicles, in the episode on motorcycles, they tried to destruct the CUB by various means . One of them was to fill it with used cooking-oil from a fast-food joint , instead of engine oil . It actually ran a little better on it . Finally after making it pull enormous loads and throwing it off the roof of a three storey building , it's frame bend , but the engine still started up & ran just fine . Rating it the best in a top-ten system, deemed the Honda Super Cub "Number One", declaring it "the greatest ever motorcycle". So I may be tempted to take your suggestion , brake oil ??!! awww , not just yet .
    The Honda SuperCub


    Coming back to fork oils , there is a vast difference in operation of forks and engines . Inside a fork , the role of the oil is that of a hydraulic fluid , it's only desirable characteristics being not to lose it's fluidity in operating temperature and not to foam or sludge up quickly , on passing through the small orifice of the fork plunger . Although specific fork oils are really low-tech low-single-weight oils , multigrade engine oils / ATF perform admirably in this role too , since they too are designed not to foam/sludge up or lose viscosity easily . In that case , the first number of a XXwYY multigrade oil is it's working number inside a fork . i.e 10wt for a 10w30 . This is because forks don't heat up the oil much at all . Neither are they subject to shearing stress like in an engine . ATF is about 7.5wt , consistently , all over the world , which is why people like it . Many bike comes with an engine oil recomended for use in it's forks too . See this page I dug up ... The page on fork oils from the Honda CB250/Cl250/CB350/CL350 workshop manual ...

    Last edited by Pinaki; 05-31-2011, 01:41 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Prith
    replied
    Originally posted by aargee View Post
    Prince & Pinaki - Whoever says fork oil is mixed with something or other...I don't know what to say!!! May God bless the poor soul!!!

    hehehe... .. all blessings MUCH needed.

    Oil is Oil guys , stop being finicky about it .
    Yeah. I liked this Pinaki. I have travelled ~ 45 Kms till now with the molatov cocktail in my front forks and all seems well except that recoil is little slow and much consistent and speed breakers are a pleasure to scale..vibration in handle bar has reduced considerably.

    Guys, let me run my bike this way for a week and will get the progress card for your perusal on Saturday..lets see how things turn up... CHEERS

    Leave a comment:


  • aargee
    replied
    Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
    Oil is Oil guys , stop being finicky about it .
    So can we see your report on using brake oil inside your engine instead of whatever specified XW-Y engine oil?

    Prince -

    Leave a comment:


  • princesirohi
    replied
    Originally posted by aargee View Post
    Prince & Pinaki - Whoever says fork oil is mixed with something or other...I don't know what to say!!! May God bless the poor soul!!!
    thats what i was saying...........

    Leave a comment:


  • Pinaki
    replied
    Aargee & Aneesh , let me throw another wrench into this mess .... Many guys use ATF (automatic transmission fluid ) as fork oil too . And if anyone has the original Enfield Bullet manual , check if 10w30 is not the recommended fork oil there ? 10w30 motor oil is also the fork liquid called for by the Honda CB250 - CB750K manuals . Oil is Oil guys , stop being finicky about it .
    Last edited by Pinaki; 05-30-2011, 06:53 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Aneesh@4GHz
    replied
    Originally posted by princesirohi View Post
    AFAIK...............fork oil is not mixed with anything....
    +1^^ Didn't heard of this before. Fork oil mixed with engine oil? NO way for that.

    Leave a comment:


  • aargee
    replied
    Prince & Pinaki - Whoever says fork oil is mixed with something or other...I don't know what to say!!! May God bless the poor soul!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • Prith
    replied
    @aargee: I was caught off guard with this "desi" chemistry of engine oil and fork oil mix . you dont see such exquisite workmanship often. Coming to Wurth products, are they OEM distributors only ? I do see their products in Shell bunks, but they dont have the ones the we biker's need . Like chain cleaners, disk cleaners..etc. Do you know any outlets in Chennai offering their range, cause I visit Chennai often and can pick up from there.

    Leave a comment:


  • princesirohi
    replied
    ^^ aargee......first post had three querries..........one of them being....whether it is ok to mix fork oil with engine oil..........so, i replied to that.........

    read the post by Pinaki, he says fork oil is often mixed with other oil..........hence this discussion on fork oil...

    Leave a comment:


  • aargee
    replied
    Given the astronomical price I really want to get to the bottom of this. Has someone noticed this recently
    Go for the high end variants of fuel only when your CR is more than, say 10. Otherwise, a normal good, unadulterated fuel is more than sufficient.

    I used to use Motul in France, but Wurth was something I did not come across for longtime since. Is this after market product specific to OEM and not for general consumer's
    Boy!!! Wurth is a German company & they make anything from screws to tools to automotive care. Just Google for Wurth & see the millions of product that they make.

    Prince - What was that post meant for? All of us including the thread starter knows fork oil isn't mixed with anything

    Leave a comment:


  • Prith
    replied
    @jasmeet: Thanks Jasmeet. This time I saw this guy in service station replacing my brake pads and he cleaned the whole brake unit with Wurth cleaner. It actually was so wet that I could see the gunk literally dripping out of the unit. I used to clean with Motul cleaner, but never saw so much gunk as I saw this time around. Not sure if my brake pads were chewed up.

    @prince: thanks bro, I agree completely with you. I remember buying 2 cans of oil for fork service. 1 can per arm.

    @pinaki: Thanks Pinaki. As you said he would have used his intelligence to "Weigh" in options . I m 6 foot tall and little over the scale... Just kidding, but all seems to be well as of now. Though fork action has not been compromised, I m worried about its performance during high speed impact. Since fork oils do both lubrication and absorb impact, I hope my form arms dont collapse.

    Leave a comment:

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