It's really funny how people associate engine smoothness or rather less noise from it as good experience & fun. If that's the case Shine has a very good smooth engine, unfortunately the bike doesn't hold up.. it just vibrates once you are above 60kmph. It's okay, may be to each his own!!

For some people it's handling, for some it's outright pickup and so on. Some people get egged on by engine's roar at higher revs, others just piss in their pants and slow down fearing something will go wrong. It's not the machine, it's how we perceive it.

It's just that we have to find the right machine for our kind of mindset. If someone enjoys a bike revving smoothly then go for that kind of bike. One shouldn't expect Pulsar/Apache to be like Unicorn.

Considering their current trend that doesn't look like a possibility.BAL chose the easy way out of buying off KTM and using their engines.The dream of an Indian built big engine from BAL is no more
BAL is the only Manufacturer who has the Money and intent for this.TVS just doesn't have the money and HERO just doesn't have the passion.

I disagree. Bajaj had good power in their bikes and also better FE than the competition but people weigh refinment above everything. Also the power delivery in BAL bikes was not linear. Before Bajaj improved on these things, their sales would start to decline (like what TVS is facing now) and brand image would be hampered. People don't care what efforts they put in in just 10-11yrs. Finally they would just see the lack of refinement factor and little noisy engine and would also hear to the rumours about Bajaj bikes and would not go for them. Even if Bajaj developed their own 400cc bike you won't buy them for these reasons. They are here to do Business like the others.

Bajaj gained the technology from KTM to eradicate these 2 major deficiencies in them. Now they have the confidence to beat the competition and be a true Global company. Some auto-experts believe that KTM also gained (very slightly) from the low-capacity development experience Bajaj had. KTM 125cc engine is also co-developed by Bajaj-KTM joint R&D team. Agreed it was Bajaj who gained the more in terms of technology but they learnt it. They did not plonk the engines of KTM in their bikes like Hero did. Now they have the know-how and most of the technologies have been touched upon (Fi, Perimeter frame, Liquid Cooling, Patented technologies, monoshock etc).

Even the Japs had bought technologies from European Automotive Engineering Firms at many a-times. Eg- Engines Engineering which developed Mahindra's 125GP bikes had also loyal clients like Honda & Yamaha. They have even employed engineers from these firms. The bikes have been invented in Europe and most of the tech also has been developed in Europe. The Japs bought them and imrpoved upon them by doing good R&Ds.

Bajaj learned the technologies and there will be a P150 with the new technologies but no new Duke150 would be on the cards.

Oh c'mon...! Hero have Passion...!!! And Passion plus and Passion pro too... hehehe...

On a serious note no one can beat their "passion" for better and funky stickers... hehehe... j/k

one more thing i would like BAL to do, and that is launch a scooter line-up, coz right now they don't have any product in scooter line-up to compete with activa, dio, scooty, pleasure etc..

@ Anant: What a fine story of your biking life, man! You did make the right decision. Even my friend has a caliber, which just doesn't give up after many years.

What a fine mature post. I remember that RTR 160 was the most vibrating bike I ever rode in my life... But some people love it for its segment crushing performance or exhaust note or anything else.... And I understand them perfectly because I had a smile after the test ride.
"It's not the machine, it's how we perceive it." This quote will go into my signature one day when there's enough space.

HUMOR: Anyone comparing P220 with Dio, huh? Ok, out of Dio and P220, which machine has MORE VIBRATIONS at 110 kmph?
Answer: Oh Wait... err.. I just recollected that Dio doesn't touch 110! Sorry, wrong question. my bad.

Well, you're right. Its obvious, since a completely KTM branded bike (Duke 125 or 200) goes on to share parts with Pulsar. So, its made in India, developed probably by Indians and non-Indians.
But, Bajaj still insists that KTM's involvement is about marketing.

Indian engines may have their own limits. Remember P180 UG4, what did it gain compared to previous iteration, the UG3: well, slightly better looks, and extra 7 kgs of weight with only 0.5 PS+, with not much improvement in any area, power, mileage, anything. Handling did improve but barely enough, just to keep it from flickering through a high speed corner. That's it.

Yeah right. Who will be that silly to compare Dio with P220? Must not even know proper riding i suppose.