Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

News Approved

It would be so cool to be zipping around on a 100 kg bike in the city, overtaking everybody without a sound.

I would call it the Silent Assassin

Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

Firstly, I'm glad that they didn't use the word "Green Technology" blindly. Because, if electricity comes from burning coal, its anything but green. But its ok.


Secondly, for an electric motorcycle to be aimed at enthusiasts, it should confer to the following requirements, among others:

1. Should have good handling, and mass centralisation. Most such bikes have battery packs around the conventional fuel tank area, giving that "top heavy" kind of handling that gives you shivers when you ride through corners, and it takes lot of muscle to steer too. Not to mention the inertia that you feel when quick steering through corners.
This street bike seems to be hollow around this area, which can be a good news. Will have to see final version to comment accurately.

2. Given its low weight, atleast 25 bhp is a must, since enthusiast is mentioned in the text.

3. Gears. Ideally, 6 of them. I know that, them motors have equal torque all the way to right below redline, and hence they don't need gears as they can pick up from Zero kmph, in longest gear itself.
But there's no doubting that for a good acceleration and top speed figure, and MOST IMPORTANTLY the feeling of an enthusiast's bike, multilple gears are a must.
Dirt bike is ok, but the street bike must have a mildly tuned gearbox. Just for reference, in Brammo Engage, Empulse & Encite, there is already a 6 speed gearbox.

4. Attractive design. Which these bikes seem to have to an extent.


5. Maintenance. I'm sure we're all ok with minor maintenance like chain lubing, servicing, etc. but the battery packs must last long enough in durability, atleast 4 years or so, given that we're in 2014 now. Any less than that could be a deterrent for many of us. And we would appreciate if the battery packs don't cost a huge fraction of the bike's cost itself. But maybe it will, and we might be ok with it if we don't have a choice.


Should Yamaha meet all this, I think one should not have a problem shifting to these bikes. The 100 kgs figure will have to be seen in final, to be believed. But it sounds amazing.
Macro & environmental wise, it is not giving much benefits in the long run, but Micro Economics wise, its a great idea for the individuals and small to large businesses.


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@The Monk : Apt name... "Silent Assassin". I like it. Although, I honestly believe that there should be some sort of purposeful vehicle noise, for the purpose of safety. This noise can come from a dynamo powered honker, or motor design. Otherwise, EITHER it might become a thief's favorite nocturnal vehicle OR we might hear a lot of accidents happening due to these bikes, or both (?).

Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

waterproof? esp that PED1

Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

Maybe I'm stupid but why dynamo on a electric powered bike? BTW electric bikes produce a loud buzzing sound too.
About 6 speed transmission, I think if it must have a transmission, it should be two or at max three speed transmission since the powerband is wide enough. Maybe one gear for good acceleration and another for top end and good FE. Actually transmission on electric bike is a debatable topic due to the power loss at transmission, extra manufacturing and maintenance cost and of course weight increase.

Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

Don't worry, its a valid question.
And the answer is, Dynamo so that the sound increases proportionately (or semi proportionately) with speed. It can be a sealed unit so that it is not easily removable. As an alternative, it can be a mechanical component working on friction, or air whistling to produce sound.

Some electric vehicles that I rode were hopelessly silent. Although yes, their speeds were 25 kmph too so faster machines will be different for sure.

I agree with you. It can even have a single gear/ gearless transmission, and still reach a good top end. What you said, regarding 2-3 gears is also quite possible.


But, firstly, I'm not sure how a long spaced gearbox would react to sudden downshifts, because shifting 1 gear down would be like shifting 3-4 gears down on a I.C. Engine. The sudden increase in rpm might damage the motor or the battery, who knows? Experts on electric motors can share more....


Secondly, its about "feeling like an enthusiast", and that's the reason for having 6 gears. 2 or 3 long spaced gears may meet our needs, and it may feel fast too, but so does Honda VFR 1200R on Auto mode.
I find shifting gears fun, but of course, this is quite a subjective matter, so that's the reason I said, that I agree with you.


As an informative sidenote, I wish to however mention Brammo's reason (according to them) for having 6 gears. They didn't want to go for heavy research, to specially create a 2 speed manual box. It was easier for them to go for a ready 6 speed manual gearbox, and this is how it ended up being like that...

Re: Yamaha PES1 and PED1 Electric Bikes Production Ready: xBhp News

2010 Zero DS Electric Motorcycle - Natural Sound - YouTube
2013 Zero S Electric Motorcycle - Natural sound of the ride. - YouTube
Sound of electric motorcycle - YouTube

These videos should give you an idea about the sound emitted by electric motorcycles. BTW that Zerobike looks like a Ducati or the P200NS.

I too emailed Brammo regarding their 6 speed transmission, and got a similar reply. But when big players enter the market, they can afford to do some R&D on the transmission.

I'm a biking enthusiast too and I love playing with the gearbox but when I am in congested roads, I wish gears did not exist. I enjoy shifting when I'm on recreational rides on good roads but during my commutes, life would be easier if I did not have to shift that often. This is kind of a big issue to be honest, the only reason gearless motorcycles are not that popular is because in developed countries, namely Europe and USA, motorcycles are considered more of a recreational tool than a means of transportation. Thus, the primary buyers for motorcycles there are the biking enthusiasts who just like you, loves the act of shifting. Also cities there are not as congested as here and traffic is usually well behaving so it's not much of an hassle for them. On the contrary, in South Asian countries where two-wheelers are considered a means of transportation and the roads are congested, gearless scooters are popular.

I'm sure you remember the incident where you had to take your girlfriend with you on Shivratri on the 390, a gearless vehicle would be less stressful to ride in such scenario.