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Ideal Suspension Setup

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  • Ideal Suspension Setup

    I came across a good article on suspension setup and its implications.. Thought it would be interesting read for all...

    Here is the link..

    Motorcycle Suspension Set-up

    The article..


    I bought myself a Yamaha YZF R1 bike which was supposed to a top handling bike. It was not. The bike was reluctant to turn. I took the bike to a club racer mate of mine and he had a test ride and then suggested that I increase the rebound (????) I turned the rebound (???) screw and it seemed to improve the bike handling. I turned it a bit more and it went back worse. I felt that since I had already fiddled with one of the settings, I might as well try other suspension settings.

    I tried suspension setting from motorcycle newspapers, sports bike magazine, top racing websites and forums and they were all crap. In fact two sources never recommended the same setting for my bike and no one adequately explained how they got those settings. I felt I had to find my own suspension settings for my bike. In order to do so, I had to understand how it worked and this article will attempt to explain how I set up my bike and how you can too.

    Lets start at the very beginning.
    DAY 1
    Your bike suspension is designed primarily to absorb the imperfections in the roads, and ensure that tyres keep contact with the roads. Most bikes suspension are based on a springlike oil filled bicycle pumpsWhere did I start?
    Before I touched the bike, I located the handbook for my bike as supplied by the manufacturer. The handbook contains details on what can be adjusted and where on the bike the knobs and screws are for setting up your bike front and rear suspension. Also it details the manufacturers recommended suspension settings for your bike. If you have aftermarket (third party) suspension, contact them.
    Depending on your bike you may be able adjust some, all or none of the following
    • Preload (Spring tension, based on your weight)
    • Damping (speed the spring squashes and returns to normal )
      • Compression (advanced damping control, speed the spring squashes)
      • Rebound (advanced damping control, speed the spring returns to normal after been squashed)


    Note that compression and rebound are part of damping.

    After I had established what I can adjust on my bike and how to adjust it, I got a pen and paper and wrote down my bikes current settings so that I can return the bike to it if I make a mess of things. On my bike, this meant counting manufacturers recommended settings.

    You should be able to fiddle with your suspension and bring it back to the settings recommended by the manufacturer or your original setting before you go any further. Do not read any further unless you are competent with the above and acknowledge that this whole article is purely for information only. Please do not fiddle with your bike, then injure yourself and then blame me.

    DAY 2 - SET UP BIKE TO YOUR WEIGHT (PRELOAD)
    To set up your bike you will require the proper tools as recommended in your bikes handbook, usually a long screw driver, spanner for the front and a funny looking tool for the rear preload and tape measure!!. You will need patience and time. It is best to set the bike up where you are most likely to use it i.e. on the roads or race track.. Ensure your bike is in good working condition, including replacing dodgy fork seals, lubricating linkage, and changing fork or shock oil and you have correct tyre pressure . If you are unsure of your tyre pressure and it is a track bike use 32psi front, 30psi rear.

    Twiddling with setting randomly will not get you far. You suspension can be broken down to the following

    • Front wheel
      • Preload
      • Damping Compression
      • Damping Rebound

    • Rear Wheel
      • Preload
      • Damping Compression
      • Damping Rebound


    If your bike does not have some of these setting then you will have to compromise on the setting of your bike or buy aftermarket suspension if necessary. You really should set up your bike in the right order. It is best to start with the preloads, front and rear as this is based on your weight and relatively easy to set up, then work your way down.

    Rear Preload
    Whatever your weight, when you sit on the bike, you want the bike to squat just a little bit (about 30mm) but not too much. You want to ensure that the bulk of your rear suspension travel is available for when you actually ride the bike as opposed to supporting your heavy frame. At the same time you should have a little bit of sag left. If the bike drops too much then increase preload and if you are very light and the bike barely moves under your weight, then soften the preload.
    Below is a more detailed explanation. This is easy to set up but can be a bit confusing so just follow the steps one at a time.
    Step 1Step 2Step 3Step 1: First find the fully UNLOADED length of your rear suspension. Put your bike on its centre stand. If you do not have a centre stand find a means of lifting the rear wheel up under the engine so that there is no weight (including the weight of the bike) on the rear axle and wheel. Measure the distance between the rear axle and a fixed point directly above like a bolt or mark. Note this measure measurement. Do not use a rear wheel bike stand as there is still the weight of the bike on the swing arm.

    Step 2
    : Find the NORMAL length of you rear suspension. This is amount the suspension drops under the weigh of the bike alone without the rider. Put the bike on level ground and bounce it up and down to free any stickiness. Measure between the same two points as above, i.e. the rear axle and the fixed point directly above.

    Step 3: Find the fully LOADED
    RIDER SAG is the difference steps 1 and 3. This is the amount the bike drops when your heavy arse sits on the bike.
    STATIC SAG
    is the difference between step 1 and step 2. it is how much the bikes weight acts on the rear suspension or how much you can lift the bike rear without the rider on it before it tops out.

    A top racing suspension company suggest that rear wheel rider sag should be around 30-40mm and static sag should be around 5-10mm. However this many vary depending on your bike and manufacturer. The more rider sag you have, the softer the bike suspension will be. I personally use 35mm for road and a few track days use.
    Therefore if your rider sag is less than 30 mm then your preload is too hard, if it is more than 40 mm, then it is a bit soft. Once you have set your rider sag as close as possible to 30-40 mm, next check your static sag. If you have more than 10mm then you may need stiffer springs. If however, if your static sag is less than 5mm or you have no static sag then your springs may be too hard for your weight.

    If you have to compromise then try to have at least a bit of Static sag in order to stop the bike from topping out.

    Note that books, videos, media and pub acquaintances will all have different opinions on the naming and figures quoted above (and below). I find that I get fewer complaints with the current labelling system than I would with other labelling systems.
    Avoid being obsessed with numbers and naming systems. I will try to explain the underlying principles of setting up your own bike. There are too many scenarios and permutations surrounding the effects of tweaking each setting that it would take me forever to cover them all. Therefore I will only touch on a few of the more common effects.
    Front Preload
    Some people set the front suspension based on rider sag and static sag. This is especially useful in determining if you need softer or stiffer springs. Use the same system as above to determine Rider sag (35-48mm) and Static sag (25-30mm). However I prefer the below method to optimise my current original front forks.

    You want your bike to use as much front suspension "travel" as possible without "bottoming out" (no more travel) even in extreme conditions. So lets establish how much suspension travel you are currently using.
    Wrap cable ties around the smooth part (stanchion) of front forks near the rubber seal to the forks. Ensure that it does not scratch the stanchion and it is not too tight as to damage the rubber seals.

    Reducing preload should give you more travel. If the forks bottoms out, reset the cable ties and increase preload until the cable tie stops around 10mm above the limit. You should always leave about 10mm travel for emergencies like slamming into uncharted potholes.
    Done
    DAY 3 - FRONT DAMPING

    The damping, both rebound and compression are best adjusted after riding your bike and feeling how it handles to you. The reason why there is so much debate and controversy regarding suspension set up is because it is a personal experience and depends on how and where you ride your motorcycle.

    Some people, media and websites will charge or tell you what they think is best for you whilst amongst top racers it is a closely guarded secret. You have to find your own settings that you are comfortable with and take notes as you experiment with different settings.

    tyre profiles
    Setting the right amount of damping depends on the type of bike, how you ride the bike of bike, and shape and pressure of tyres you use. Also it depends on your riding style and how much suspension travel you want at any particular moment. This article will try to explain what to look out for and how to tweak it.
    If you can adjust the damping but cannot adjust the rebound and compression separately, then you will have to find a compromise between the two for your bike. If you run out of adjustment, then depending on if the damping, either rebound or compression, is too slow or too fast then you may need to change the damping oil to thinner or thicker suspension oil relatively.
    Note that your suspension will handle differently under different conditions i.e. high or low speed, wet or dry conditions, therefore experiment with setting up your bike under the conditions you would like to use them.

    To start with, set your bike damping rebound and compression to your manufacturers or your preferred setting.

    I do not know the exact terminology used in your manufacturers owners manual but note that
    Soft damping=little damping=decreased dampingHard damping=excessive damping=increased damping
    Nose UpNose down
    Front Compressionnose dives transfers more weight over the front wheel. This helps slow the bike quicker.
    If the front suspension compresses too quickly (too soft) you risk the suspension bottoming out and then your bike will feel vague and since it nose dives too quickly the back wheel may loose contact with the road and move sideways. On the other hand when compression damping is too high the suspension can't react quickly enough to compress over bumps and will skip and chatter. You will have an uncomfortable ride and your braking is compromised, especially in the wet. shorten the wheel base and alter the geometry of the bike making the bike turn quicker into the corner. It is important that your bike compresses predictably and safely in a corner/turn.
    SOFT: If your compression is too soft, your bike will nose dive too quickly, then as you turn into the corner, the bike will collapse into it and you end up having to compensate.
    HARD: On the other hand if you have too much front compression damping, do not get enough nose dive and the bike will be reluctant to turn and may drift wide on entry to the corner.

    Go for a ride on your bike and try braking and turning into corners at different speeds. This will cause a bit of nose dive so try different setting. If your bike bottoms out, increase the front preload. See preload notes above. Keep notes.

    Front Rebound
    after the front suspension has been compressed i.e. from nose down position. If it is too soft, the front end will pop up too quickly after any situation causing the front suspension to compress e.g. braking or cornering causing the bike to "see-saw". This may result in lack of traction If rebound damping is too high you may have pump down until it bottoms out which is simply dangerous,
    An alternative to manufacturers setting for front rebound is to place your bike on level ground and have your mate or rear wheel stand support the back of the bike. Press hard on the top of the yoke without pressing the brakes and let go. The suspension should rebound to its original position within a second.If it takes more than a second then you need softer rebound but if it takes less than a second or it rebounds past its original position then you should make your rebound harder. This method may work but really it is too simplistic for real world riding.
    One critical area where you want your front rebound to work well is through them corners and turns. As you fly down the road and brake before or into the corner, the front suspension compresses, then as you let go of the brakes, the front wheel will rebound fully. You do not want your front end to sit up too quickly especially mid corner. It does not matter whether you brake before the turn but this is more critical if you brake into the turn.
    SOFT: washing out
    HARD: On the other hand if the rebound is too hard, when you let go of the brakes and on to the throttle in a corner, because the wheel is compressed for longer you will have a shorter wheel base for longer. This may cause the bike to feel wooden in the corner and turn too quickly. Soften her up.

    To set up your front rebound damping you are going to have to go through a few corners a few times and it is best that you have sorted out the preload and front compression first. Basically you want to be able to

    1. brake hard either before the turn or up to the apex of the turn, (whichever suits you)
    2. let go of the brakes

    by adjusting only the rebound damping only
    NOTES
    No advanced damping control
    if you cannot adjust the rebound and compression separately but you can adjust the damping, then you will have to go for a compromise. Since most accidents happen in a turn, then I will suggest that you set it up for cornering. Try to get the bike to enter and exit a corner with minimal rocking or seesawing to the front end. These setting should be ok for bumpy tarmac.
    Keep a record
    Keep a note of the settings you are using as well as the make and pressure of your tyres. Different tyres shapes, sizes and pressure can affect your readings and therefore you may want to keep a record of all your setting especially if you are a track addict or racer. Also keep a note of the weather and cooler temperature will thicken the oil in your forks while on a hotter day, your fork oil may thin a bit. You do not want to go through all this again
    Counting Clicks
    If your bike uses clicks to adjust damping, and you want to adjust your damping settings, do not simply turn it a few clicks till you think you have the right new settings. Fully count the clicks in to ensure you were on the right old settings then count it out to the right new settings. Example you think your front compression is on 5 clicks out and you want to try 7 clicks out. Do not simply turn it 2 clicks out. Count the 5 click in, and then count the 7 clicks out.
    Set Up
    Do not adjust more than one setting at a time unless it is to a previously recorded set up as you will not know which setting cause the most effect. I commute to work and I used to make one small (a click) adjustment a day. Sometimes I would leave it for a week because the conditions where not right to feel the new settings in action. On the track, I would suggest one setting change per session, minimum.
    Altering Bike Geometry
    You can alter your bikes geometry by sliding your front forks up through your front yoke.. i.e. your forks will stick up through the yoke a bit more than standard thereby causing your bike to have a more nose down bias. This makes the bike turn in faster, it doesn't increase the corner speed and you will loose ground clearance (CBR riders take note)
    I will not recommend moving your front forks more than 5 mm

    DAY 4 - REAR DAMPING
    Kick UpSquatting
    Suspension BalanceRear Compressionlethargic
    When you accelerate, you need a bit of rear end squatting to give the tyres a chance to get some traction and absorb excessive power to the back wheel. However, it is that squatting action under heavy acceleration that can cause problems when coming out of corners.

    SOFT: nose up drift wide on exit of the corner. This is not the same as a too much of front compression damping which causes the bike to drift wide on entry to the corner.

    HARD: wheel spinkicking upRear Rebound
    Nearly the end of this setting up drivel. You have exited the corner and the bike is now flying forward in a straight line. At this point you want the rear rebound damping to keep the rear wheel in contact with the road, thereby giving you maximum traction

    SOFT: wallow
    HARD:
    SUMMARY
    First get your owner manual out and familiarise and compare your current suspension settings with the recommended settings in the manufactures hand book. Still not satisfied?
    Then set-up your preload, front and rear, so that you can use as much suspension travel as possible when riding your bike. This is based on your weight, so if your weight fluctuates then keep an eye on it.
    Next adjust your damping so that your suspension does not compress or rebound too fast or too slow to upset the bike and be uncomfortable. I believe that if you can get your bike suspension set up for cornering then it should be OK on a straight line.
    1 - Front compression
    This is when you want your front compression to control the "nose down" effects of braking so it turns in to corner properly
    2 - Front rebound
    You have let go of brakes, adjust front rebound so that the front forks extend at a controlled rate allowing you to keep your line.

    3 - Rear Compression
    You want the rear end to squat a bit as you apply the power.

    Make sure that the rear rebound setting keeps the rear wheel in contact with the road.
    Note: this image is only for illustration only. Your braking, turning and exit points and lines may vary, especially in the wet.CONCLUSION
    The point of this article is to educate you on how your suspension works so you can attempt to sort it out yourself. You should be able to feel the bike through the handle bars and the bike seat and be brave enough to note down the current settings and have a go at altering it to suit yourself.
    I found that it is difficult to set up the bike for all condition. I recently changed my front brake pads and they were biting harder which made the bike nose down quicker. As summer approaches, I like to ride a bit faster. My weight is fluctuating. All these scenarios have caused me to change my setup. Top racers alter their setup at every track.
    However if you are not competent with DIY, remember that if it isn't broke, don't fix it

  • #2
    Topic Approved.
    :)

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    • #3
      Awesome Article...worth a read!

      Comment


      • #4
        @ SandycoreBiker: hey thanks for sharing the info dude...nice find
        2003 Kinetic GF170 Laser Sport Edition
        2007 Bajaj Pulsar 180 DTSi UG3
        2015 Kawasaki Ninja 650 ABS KRT

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        • #5
          Thanks for Approving Aryan.

          Best part is that he tells you how to take the feedback while making those changes to the setup.
          Last edited by SandycoreBiker; 01-31-2009, 01:57 PM.

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          • #6
            @ Sandycorebiker, many thanks for this exhaustive article and your own efforts for the trial & error. Really good work

            For me Suspension preload, damping etc was greek & latin. On my touring bike, when I take a pillion, I just turned the rear suspension 3 clicks to 'hard' and once the pillion was off, I turned it back 3 clicks. Beyond that, I really didn't know & was too lazy to read and learn about it. This was indeed a very nice write-up.



            Growing old is compulsory - growing up is optional
            So many roads, So little time
            RIDE for PASSION

            See us & our global rides at:
            www.rideforpassion.com

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Haroon View Post
              @ Sandycorebiker, many thanks for this exhaustive article and your own efforts for the trial & error. Really good work

              For me Suspension preload, damping etc was greek & latin. On my touring bike, when I take a pillion, I just turned the rear suspension 3 clicks to 'hard' and once the pillion was off, I turned it back 3 clicks. Beyond that, I really didn't know & was too lazy to read and learn about it. This was indeed a very nice write-up.
              DIY and trail & error efforts are all Author's view. I have to still get my steed which has such settings.

              Anyways I am glad that it helped you Haroon!! I hope in return we can expect much more detailed trip-logs from you. Arab is uncharted territory for many of us. Would be nice to have a "Akho Dekha Haal" from your kwacker
              Last edited by SandycoreBiker; 02-01-2009, 02:30 PM.

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              • #8
                Sorry I mixed up the author. But still its a good deed

                Sure some trip-logs for the future. Maybe another steed on the way as well



                Growing old is compulsory - growing up is optional
                So many roads, So little time
                RIDE for PASSION

                See us & our global rides at:
                www.rideforpassion.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  intresting man... nice find there...
                  Vikram.....

                  http://vikramDixit.blogspot.com...


                  sach kadwaa hota hai .. ;)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    This is an old article. It's good for the track where you have access to mechanics all the time but setting it up for the road in India is a freaking pain in the behind. I'm still trying to find the ideal set up for my bike. And the manufacturers do their best to make the settings so friggin difficult to mess with; especially preload.
                    sigpic StreetFighter

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Streetfighter View Post
                      This is an old article. It's good for the track where you have access to mechanics all the time but setting it up for the road in India is a freaking pain in the behind. I'm still trying to find the ideal set up for my bike. And the manufacturers do their best to make the settings so friggin difficult to mess with; especially preload.
                      Well not completely Ariz. I have setup my R1 for my weight on so-called street settings, and it feels very comfortable. Of course, there's not much you can do when you hit potholes with any suspension setting

                      Have never setup the suspension for the track, although I will do it the next time around. It's not too difficult anyway.

                      Your MT shouldn't be too difficult either.
                      "Tough times never last, but tough people do." - Robert Schuller
                      ---
                      R.I.P Kriss; 15.06.1981 - 11.10.2009 -- You will not be forgotten.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by rossiter View Post
                        Well not completely Ariz. I have setup my R1 for my weight on so-called street settings, and it feels very comfortable. Of course, there's not much you can do when you hit potholes with any suspension setting

                        Have never setup the suspension for the track, although I will do it the next time around. It's not too difficult anyway.

                        Your MT shouldn't be too difficult either.
                        I'd like to know the ideal setup for the street and how to do it for an '07 R1.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by rossiter View Post
                          Well not completely Ariz. I have setup my R1 for my weight on so-called street settings, and it feels very comfortable. Of course, there's not much you can do when you hit potholes with any suspension setting

                          Have never setup the suspension for the track, although I will do it the next time around. It's not too difficult anyway.

                          Your MT shouldn't be too difficult either.
                          It's a pain mate, the preload setting is a right pain. Ideally there would have been knobs in buttons in the right areas to do this but we don't live in a perfect world

                          Originally posted by Bladerunner View Post
                          I'd like to know the ideal setup for the street and how to do it for an '07 R1.
                          There isn't any ideal set up Blade, what's good for you may not be good for others. Depends on your weight, riding style, tyres, roads, etc... We've got so many different kinds of road surfaces in Mumbai that the ideal setup on one road feels rubbish on another.
                          sigpic StreetFighter

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                          • #14
                            I'm sure there's a better setting than just default. The R1 can be quite painful on long rides or even long periods in city traffic.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Bladerunner View Post
                              I'm sure there's a better setting than just default. The R1 can be quite painful on long rides or even long periods in city traffic.
                              You're asking about ideal set-up. I'm just saying what's ideal for Ross may not be ideal for you.
                              sigpic StreetFighter

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