Announcement: Threads regarding Joel.

[antz.bin]

Every business establishment reserves the right to choose which customers they wish to serve.
eg.
1. An airline will refuse to sell you a ticket if you have a prior record of troubling fellow passengers.
2. A bank will refuse you a loan if you have a track record of being a defaulter.
3. The Doorman at a 5-star will shoo away some people but will open the door with a smile for some others.
4. Some automotive forums make you fill up an elaborate form, the contents of which decide if you are worthy enough to be a member.
5. Rolls Royce recently refused to sell one of their cars to Mallika Sherawat.

Coming Back to Topic

This decision was taken to help eliminate the multiple issues that were caused by the thread which didn't attract much attention (link in post #1). Had there been a common meeting place for all of the members who use Race Concepts products on their R15s, all doubts/misunderstandings would have been cleared up pronto. Just like it happens on other stock bikes' ownership threads. We are not trying to push any modder into a corner. Thats the reason, the threads started by Joel himself have not been touched. What we are trying to ensure is that all users get maximum exposure to related content to ease knowledge sharing.

But Satyen has given a good option too and that can also be looked into. Thank you Satyen for that .

[abhimanyu31]

^^^ how about creating an new sub forum 'Tuning and Tuners' and moving all these threads to the said sub forum.

[NitinGirish]

if I ask a question and someone does not want to answer it, I understand that the person is not interested in doing business with me, so I will take my business somewhere else and to someone more receptive

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The new section looks like Ownership threads in the Motorcycle Ownership sub-section. Agreed it is a maze but that is how it is for everything from Splendour to N650 right? And whenever a new member posts an elementary question, the favorite retort is 'search the thread before you ask questions' This can be practiced in this thread too. Isn't there an understanding that all members would do sufficient reading & searching of the forum before they post queries? I think the new thread is fair enough.

Leaving these nitty grttites aside, I think thought has to be provided by people who run this forum (not just the Mods) on how they want to deal with commercial interests on the forum. At one end of the spectrum is entirely disallowing anything related to buying/selling and other end would be to allow it so much that it starts looking like an e-commerce site

In my opinion we have to take a middle path. It is enough if a thread/section be easily identified of having commercial interest or purely knowledge exchange discussion. That way the forum doesn't lose credibility.

Translated to practical action item, it means it would be good to have a separate SUB-SECTION. You can name it Tuning/Performance modification/whatever and have tuners not only sell their products but discuss performance tuning too. Just my 2 cents.

[jd666]

One thing i would like to clarify in the announcement is that negative reviews should be allowed however the person facing the issue should start a thread of his own rather than posting in everyones thread about the tuner.

This will allow for an active redressal of issues by the tuner and give a balanced overview of the situation.

So if anyone has feedback to give it should be done in the correct manner and I hope will not be suppressed by the staff here.

My 2 cents

May the force be with you

[Samarth 619]

There are some posts in each thread that have more valuable information than others. There should be a way to highlight these posts (user ratings?) similar to making threads sticky. Mentioning post numbers or asking the mods to add the information to the 1st post is not nearly as simple

I mentioned it in Joelled R15's topic that, you can PM me, to add important links to the first post. So, please do so. Thanks.

Doesn't the moderation team feel by achieving the the below
will still lead to below?
How do you think it will achieve the purpose? Kindly explain. Tks.
PS - Anyway, this is not a challenge, this is just a thought & I certainly respect the GROUP's decision

Today Joel has to check 6 topics, now he has to check only 2. The same applies to moderators too. Clear how it is useful in controlling chaos?

Tuners are a rare breed on this forum. Especially the likes of Joel. We have already lost a few legends like Venu, RKumar, Atul and so many more... this is a pretty sorry move. Instead of nurturing them, am sorry to say but you are treating them as crap. "Here, this is your corner, stay here!"

Your idea about a different section for tuners is good. That kept aside..

You're blaming us, that we're saying, here is your corner, stay here, by merging bike owners' threads (not Joel's own started threads, mind you.), is it?? We're trying to control Chaos, and you say we're disrespecting tuners.

We just wanted similar threads so that:-
1. All interested members go to that thread only, and help out other members and clear confusion much easier,
2. Even tuners get lesser threads to manage and view,

I can't understand, how we disrespected tuners getting their bike owners together.


@ Other members: But at the end of the line, we have not touched a tuner's topic at all.

Bottom line- Tuners' topics are for knowledge & initial discussion. Owners' topics are for the later experience.

We're just merging R15's owners topics. Like Kwokfist, navnish, etc. So, please give it a rational re-thought.

[satyenpoojary]

"More decisions on these issues can be taken later on, and shall be suitably conveyed. You're welcome to post constructive feedback in this thread, but anything going personal or negative shall be deleted without explanation. Thanks."

lol.. How is your feedback and brainstorming "essential feedback" and my feedback "Blame"
And yeah terming my suggestion as an emotional - irrational rant is the last I expected... Thanks a TON for that! Worst after what YOU wrote in your first post.

That asides, heres an objective breakdown on what I was saying:
Like every x trip to a y destination, every x bikes tuning experience is an "experience"

If a user is allowed to individually share his experience of his bike going to a Destination
Say a R15 to Leh. Why is that a Owners experience of his bike being tuned not be allowed to be shared individually.

If an aggregation has to be made, then thats why you have a concept of "Tags"
Tag all those threads with "R15 - RaceConcepts"

Keep these threads in a sub section, with the tuners thread as sticky.
And on locked thread by admin which says "Read me before posting" where you give info/link on the good experiences, bad experiences, and a FAQ of sorts.

[Jeanie]

100% agree with satyen , just create a new section for modifications and accessories for bikes with a sub section for peopl to post their own threads . the main section can have the generic threads like lighting modifications ,tyres ,filters , etc .

[The Monk]

There Satyen getting 'emotional' again Kidding!!

But seriously this guy gives a good suggestion, and its not nice to label him emotional.

We are all here to help and see xbhp getting better and better. His words were rational enough.

[Samarth 619]

There Satyen getting 'emotional' again Kidding!!

But seriously this guy gives a good suggestion, and its not nice to label him emotional.

We are all here to help and see xbhp getting better and better. His words were rational enough.

I did acknowledge his suggestion about a different section. Everything takes time. And everything is not in my hands.

But this comment--> "we're dragging tuners into a corner and saying, stay there!".... Is this a rational comment? Maybe it is.

We (the staff) just grouped similar threads together, which is what Moderators do, even in "Motorcycle Ownership Experiences" Section.

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@ satyen: We have taken your suggestion about a different section.

Tag system would still mean that every tuner and moderator has to go through 5-6 different bike owners' threads. And how will these bike owners help each other, unless they visit each other's thread?
One unified thread will gain maximum audience, and maximum knowledge, and ultimately maximum help and support. Fact.

Now, I would suggest you to wait sometime before your suggestion is implemented/ confirmed/ declined as per what the staff decides. And we the staff respect tuners- I'm getting a Big bore and Exhaust from Joel myself soon.

[princesirohi]

wow, lot of fireworks....
i think a seperate sub-section is required.
on the other hand, why someone should be able to take financial benifit from xbhp while some others are not.
just a thought.

[sunilg]

Relax Samarth!

Let us all not get 'emotional' here .

whatever our point of view is, I think we all are struggling to find on how to present and preserve the info on xbhp in a more user-friendly and understandable way. And as of now there doesn't seem to be a quick-fix solution to that.

There are many options and each option as its own negative and positive aspects. The idea of merging similar threads is one of them. Some might find it useful, some might not.

@satyen: you have a valid point, and a useful suggestion too. However, to say that we are cornering people like Joel here is as bit too much!

All: agree there is some unwarranted firework here and some other threads but if you look at the positive side, we are discussing issues that have far reaching consequences, and there can never be consensus on a lot of issues
You. Have to listen to everybody and take the best route possible.

But that is possible only if we discuss and not argue!

Sso gentleman, kindly keep your thoughts pouring in, but respect other's point of view also

Sent from my Lumia 800 using Board Express

[Jeanie]

We (the staff) just grouped similar threads together, which is what Moderators do, even in "Motorcycle Ownership Experiences" Section.

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@ satyen: We have taken your suggestion about a different section.

Tag system would still mean that every tuner and moderator has to go through 5-6 different bike owners' threads. And how will these bike owners help each other, unless they visit each other's thread?
One unified thread will gain maximum audience, and maximum knowledge, and ultimately maximum help and support. Fact.

Now, I would suggest you to wait sometime before your suggestion is implemented/ confirmed/ declined as per what the staff decides. And we the staff respect tuners- I'm getting a Big bore and Exhaust from Joel myself soon.

so by your non 'emotional' logic all tuned bikes from say one tuner should be merged together then why have you conveniently ignored satyen s comment on touring triplogs for every destination be also clubbed together . and who cares if joel has to visit 2 threads or 6 , the community comes first . im sure he has no problem in visiting individual threads . and majority of these are tuned bike experiences not help threads .one thread will just lead to posts getting buried deep and the xbhp search is also not very good in finding info . and also when we click a thread that has been merged with another it just directs to the first post of the thread instead of the actual post that was merged , makes it all the more difficult in finding that thread .

[satyenpoojary]

@satyen: you have a valid point, and a useful suggestion too. However, to say that we are cornering people like Joel here is as bit too much!

This reminds me of a joke

Manmohan Singh and Obama are sitting in a bar.
A guy walks in and asks the barman, "Isn't that Manmohan singh and Obama?" .
The barman says "Yes, thats them."
So the guy walks over and says,"Hello, what are u guys doing?"
Obama says, "We're planning world war 3"
Guy says, "Really? What's going to happen?"
Manmohan Singh says, "Well, we're going to kill 14 million Pakistanis and one
bicycle repairman."
.
The guy exclaimed, "A bicycle repairman?!!!
.
" Manmohan Singh turns to Obama and says, " See, I told you no-one would worry about the 14 million Pakistanis!"


I wrote a whole long post there, and linked it to a sample thread from a very popular website... and all you guys are anchoring to it is the last line!
(Which I still feel is true if the "experiences" are merged)

[Joel]

@Samarth - Please stop tagging me a "modifier" along with an "etc" and very soon drag me into a profile of a mechanic.
I work as a race engineer and my profile is to engineer race engines primarily and all the street tuning etc falls after that.
Its really sad that this country does not value any damn effort and you are in the end dragged into a sh!t hole.
Merge threads, topics, words, sentences or whatever you want.
I started on this forum as an enthusiast, got this far with a lot of effort over the last decade. Started my own trend of building engines on this site when everybody spoke about everything else, but tuning. Spending and building my own engines and bikes. Everybody liked it then. Today some commercial interest is built by a few here and I'm in the end let into a comparision with a few people who "sell" parts and called as a modifier. A great respect that I get from a community that I loved the most, shared the most, made great friends and lived the most. With rides, memories, hangouts and a few real friends for life, xbhp was a big thing in my life.
I really feel like quitting this place as it has no more place for me or my work. I will lead things my way. This is not an emotional post, but very logical for me at the moment as I do not wish to be called something else here.

Today you are a moderator, from being just 4 years in this community, with little or no clue of what happens in this part of the world. The real tuning world is beyond what you can imagine. YOu have access to a few extra tabs over what "we" normal members see. Use it more approriately and thoughfully.

Joel

[atulgupta230489]

^^
totally agree