Re: Does ABS really help?


You can say that over and over again buddy!. We always need to keep margin for the WISE GUYS on road who SPONTANEOUSLY take turns and go criss-cross across the road.

Having said so, ABS is really one of those things that you'd rather have and not need than need and not have.

Re: Does ABS really help?

LOL No! Its a well known rally-ing rule. "When in doubt, Flat out"

Re: Does ABS really help?

^This, here, exactly!

Re: Does ABS really help?

An experienced rider is not infallible ... I think he is more of someone who has seen a lot of people make mistakes and learnt not to make the same.

But its the notion that ABS makes you infallible is what is .... to put it bluntly ... makes people feel like Joey Dunlop on the street. Just the same way people think 'Gear up' is synonymous to 'Lock and load'.

ABS is really one of those things that you'd rather have and not need than need and not have.

Yes its that statement that I think justifies ABS. Its a good thing, but it isn't something you need to tick a bike off on. Its like rejecting Isabella Lucas because she isn't blonde.

Re: Does ABS really help?


Are you saying that you have never skidded or crashed due to faulty braking ?

I don't know in what context MS Dhoni said it.... But if i apply this to motorcycling then YES; if we learn the valuable lessons in a good riding school PRIOR to setting off on our pocket rockets then significantly less chance of failure.... but unfortunately its not the popular course in our country.
So the only way a Regular rider gets his lessons is by trial & error.
Atleast this is how i learned before i had easy access to the internet, and learning is a never ending process.


Cheers





Hi

What are the chances of a person witnessing large number of people making mistakes ?
And then the insight and reasoning to self discipline ?!

"ABS is really one of those things that you'd rather have and not need than need and not have."


Absolutely.
Its like people going for airbag models in cars.

Its really surprising when people admire high tech electronics and loads of features on supersport/hypersport bikes which gets even various riding modes but they will question and counter-argument for simple ABS to be a priority in bike selection.



Cheers.

Re: Does ABS really help?

Nope. Never. Nada!

I used to watch MotoGP long before i got a bike. And the way those guys braked, getting the rear wheel in the air, with the front sus completely maxed out was inspiring to say the least. So when i got my own bike, the first thing i did was learn how to brake. And it has held me in good stead over the years.

But this is not a question of whether ABS is good or not. ABS is good, it is just not essential. That is the point! And more importantly ABS should not be taken as such magic potion that will keep the rider safe, even if he uses his brakes with the IQ of a chimp. It won't help. The rider is and should always be in control of his motorcycle.

Re: Does ABS really help?

I find that this thread is going somewhere, but let me put my perspective.

I personally think ABS is very well suited to 4wheelers(and above) than 2 wheelers. When the ABS is activated in 2 wheeler(read panic/strong braking), the rider is already into the trouble, and it will/may help the rider to regain the control or avoid worsening it. Still its the rider who needs to have the skill to get the bike back to control.

In cars, the ABS will allow the driver to steer the vehicle under braking(which cannot be done in 2 wheeler under same situation), as the balance of the car is taken care by the number of wheels it has(which is not the case with 2 wheeler again).

The place I think where ABS can be of most useful is to better things when its already good. Like tracks, closed road where you are trying to push the limits little further.

Ram

Re: Does ABS really help?

Its like discussing bullets ...

No one in their sane mind will ask for a bike without ABS if provided on with. But while we have to make do with what we get; we need to understand the machines we own better.

Example being the Mojo. IMO the front brake might be good ... but the feedback is terrible for me. I blame it on the rake angle and the suspension play. But there are some reviewers who have commented that the braking on the front is bad. Take the rear in the same case ... it will give way even with those Pirelli's gripping the road.

I ride an FZ which is has a drum in the back ... I'm always afraid to use it because it will lock as in many cases. I'm even trying to see if I can somehow get an ABS fitted to it.

What is being missed is the two major points that I'm trying to make

1. ABS is not insurance against ignorance or sometimes even stupidity. Good riding habits need to and can be cultivated even before you get on a motorcycle
2. A good motorcycle should not be played down because it lacks something

Re: Does ABS really help?

Re: Does ABS really help?




Answers in BOLD.

----consecutive posts auto-merged-----

Hi

I used to have the same scary L shape stops in my pulsar too and with time,ignorance and little control i started enjoying them also till one day the rear tyre regained traction and the bike flung me off.
May be i was too fast or i let off the rear brake...... i don't do it nomore.


ride safe.
Cheers

Re: Does ABS really help?

Well, if you think that ABS cuts out this panic situation, then that ABS is more of a moral support than an electronic device which controls braking(no offence, an aid can be in any form).

With respect to track/closed road, yes one will remember the condition well and can effectively use it. But in public road which is not so perfect and can throw anything at ABS and the rider, which may inversely affect the situation. Then that rider will definitely complain that ABS failed and it's of no use and the manufacture is taking his money and giving out faulty product.

So my view,
Can ABS be a life saver: Yes.
Will it save life: It greatly depends on the given condition.(read as not always).

Ram

Sent from my C1904 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: Does ABS really help?

Luck Yeah luck is the reason for having been safe all these years!

To put things in perspective, when we say xBhp promotes safe riding, we aren't pontificating without practicing. The 3-4 people who run xBhp haven't had a crash between them after having clocked over 10-15 lakh kilometres, over years, variety of bikes, road conditions, weather conditions and every other variable you can throw in. This doesn't just boil down to luck my friend, far from it in fact! And if you look at other good riders across xBhp, even those who have crashed, have crashed without injury, because they knew how to control their motorcycle sufficiently, to bring it to speeds so low in a tight situation, that no major injury was allowed.

For the second part of your argument, please read Naveen's response below. Pretty much sums it up and leaves me with nothing more to add Thanks Naveen! ABS WILL NOT protect a rider, if they do not inculcate good riding habits. As the old saying goes, "Bad habits are easy to form, but difficult to live with; good habits are difficult to form, but easy to live with"

Cheers and all the best


On a side note, as is with ABS so is it with riding gear. Wearing riding gear, doesn't make a rider 'a safe responsible biker', only his/ her riding habits will make him/ her that! After multiple rides around India where i was very fortunate to interact with tons of bikers from across the country. I saw that the most geared up bikers are not necessarily the safest riders. An old uncle with a 100 rupee helmet on his head could be safer than an idiot with the most expensive riding gear. Eventually it always boils down to the 'nut' between the handlebars!

Re: Does ABS really help?

Quite an interesting discussion going on here.

My father has never crashed either and he has roughly 2.7 lacs km on a Splendor and around 1 lac in his WagonR, neither of which have ABS.
But he's not a safe driver/rider. He moves fast for city speeds so to say. And he cuts between vehicles. All at 65-75ish speeds which many of us think is ok.

He wears a helmet/seat belt but then his driving is dangerous and he doesn't like being confronted. He usually gives the control of the vehicle to me when I'm home but he's a terror on the road for the rest of the year.

So, 'just' not meeting with an accident may only be a self consolation prize. It doesn't mean one is safe. But yes, good riding habits + zero crashes is what one aims for over his lifetime. Luck plays a very small factor in this. It's all about good riding habits as Avinash mentioned.

I also agree that so called enthusiasts abuse their vehicles more than a normal point A to point B person and geared riders usually are a lot more moronic than other people on the road (helmet-less hooligans included).

Do I want an ABS equipped vehicle? Yes, because I need it to save my behind when the time comes.

Re: Does ABS really help?


Answers in bold.
Cheers.





P.S:- Is it a prerequisite to have a Clean record to become one of the higher ups in xbhp ?

Re: Does ABS really help?

A good temperament matters. Nothing else.