Nay-kid! Nay-kid!

Damn but everytime I see a kwaker or a ceeber, sigh!

This is exactly why I would put my money on a BMW F800GS over any supersport or sport cause it wont serve the purpose I am looking to buy a motorcycle for. And 85bhp is enough to give me the 'thrills' on Indian roads.

85Bhp is enough to give you the thrills almost anywhere in world other than on a 5km long airstrip. But then you do not go to an airstrip that often I presume!

Hey Ken,
Long time. On the contrary I do go to airstrips quite often, but not with a motorcycle !

Dude,

Its not like those fellas would let you drive any of those thingies anytime either , or let you drive anything else there!!

But waise, more than bhp, I'd prefer raw torque anyday - the game in India is about midrange not top end.

I mean you do 120-160 with a REAL fast bike, and then some halfblind old foggie dawdles across at 2 kph. You brake to 60, swerve, and then what you need is midrange.

So not xbhp, but xtorque beyond a point

Yeah, true. But then with 42Lb of Torque and 17Bhp won't get you very far either!

Maybe we are speaking the language; but then with just torque and not much Bhp is not my deal.

Power equals torque times RPM

Can't escape the reality of torque Ken. There is 'bhp' because there is torque.

Torque is usable power, the real twisting force that turns the wheel. BHP is actually a mathematical entity derived from this turning force....primarily to make communication between physicists, engineers, machine designers easier. It is torque with the time factor added. How quickly or slowly can the torque do the work. The quicker is that torque applied, the greater is the power produced.

Hitanshu's bias towards torque vis a vis power is pretty relevant and very much in sync with what you have stated in your write-up. Getting the 'punch' by just revving the engine from say 2000 rpm to 3000rpm is way less stressing than making it scream from 8000rpm to 9000rpm for the same kick. you wouldn't want to tour all 'keyed up' screaming the guts out of a 'high-strung' engine all day long, would you? If nothing else...the sheer touchiness of the throttle would tire you soon.

But then I am only repeating what you've actually written

OT:
Gurudev,
Shishya bana lijiye mujhe aap. So so so many things to learn

An affordable 40-60bhp machine with oodles of torque all through it's rev range, and "STURDY" enough to take what the tough Indian terrain can throw at it is what we need. Though it is very nice to have choices like the R1s and the Busas of the world sold in our country for superbike/hyperbike enthusiasts, the middle class affording it is another story altogether. So, that leaves the majority of our motorcycle enthusiasts with very limited choices. Apart from the reasonably focussed P220, Zma and the LB500, we don't have enough choices to take on both the urban grind and the winding highways with equal fervour. IMHO, the Indian motorcycle market is mature enough for reasonably priced dual purpose motorcycles aimed at the weekday-commuting-weekend-touring market. Our roads are improving vastly. There is no doubt about that but they still will remain public property with a wide variety of users. This obviously means that doing constant speeds of >140 is plain foolhardy. So, the motorcycle makers can do very well to target this growing market than focussing solely on the minuscule number-super high end sport biking market. Till that happens, the motorcycle enthusiasts will forever be yearning for high capacity dual purpose machines or have to make do with the smaller capacity Indian alternatives. Hope someone's listening.

that was really a piece of understandable information buddy ...

@ Ken da: Very good analysis of the Indian bike market that it is today with the major changes happening and the new emerging player. Further, you have also explored what the Indian biker should look for and what the manufacturers should offer in years to come.

You have been gunning for 600cc bikes that according to you could just strike the right balance between a litre class and the puny little super-mopeds that we currently ride with pride but on a personal level I think manufacturers should eventually explore bikes in the 250-300-375-400-450cc ranges to help the Indian enthusiast biker slowly graduate from their 100-125-135-150-180-200-220-225cc performance bikes to a proper 600/650cc bike.

Just my 2 paisas.

Thanks sabretoothe.

I doubt anywhere in the world you have so many choices between 250cc-450cc. Only for touring and commuting. Since a 400cc bike would support both commuting AND touring. And so would a 600.

I for one do believe that if you have been riding a 200 for a couple of years with a few thousand kilometres under your belt and you are passionate about your ride and riding, you have developped sufficient maturity for taking on a 600cc like a CB600 or a Fazer 600 without any problems. You really do NOT need the upgrades at multiples of 50cc with increments of 6bhp! The reason why I am looking at a 600 is it will give you sufficient Torque and Power to avoid the Scorpio and Tucson Hooligans that push you off the road the moment they see you riding a "good looking fast" bike. I think we have ALL faced this problem sometime. For that, you need 70+Bhp on two wheels!

After reading your excellently written article (&with numerous PMs from you too), I have chosen the Suzuki GSX 650F for myself...it seems to be the ideal sport tourer for me. Waiting for Suzuki to launch it as a CKD/CBU!

I doubt if that is going to happen very soon!

For that matter the Zook Bandit 650S/650SA is also a nice alternative to the Fazer and the Honda.

While the heart wants to ride a 600 or a super sport or even a hyper sport, lets take a look into the evolution of motorcycles around the globe. As the author has been riding Yamahas (RX and now the R1), lets take their example. Yamaha didnot unleash a superfast, multicylinder mad muttha to win over biking enthusiasts all over the world - they did it in small steps, peppy little two strokes singles in the 50s to begin with! They oviously followed the mantra of "race on Sunday, sell on Monday" but that alone doesnt guarantee you success. They catered to all and sundry, from the tiny 50cc two stroke mopeds to the fearsome V4 500 cc grand prix replica your momma warned you about.

The point that I am trying to make is, Yamaha or any of the big 4s need to do more to build a biking culture here. A 998cc WBSK replica or a 600cc sports tourer, they will remain out of reach for 99% of the motorcycle touring community in India. Only launching a 6 lacs 600cc sport tourer isnt enough, manufacturers would need to answer the unasked question of "WIFM"(Whats in it for me) of the thousands, a clue would be Rider Mania, Bullet didnt become a cult in the 1980s, it became post 2000, that too without changing their products(almost). To make a case for the sport tourers, you dont need a Fazer or a CBF necessarily, a 250 can do it just fine, your WIFM needs to be answered, how? The R15 is a big step forward, but all the 600s and the litre bikes wouldnt help the cause of Indian bikers (tourers included) as a 40 bhp inline twin 250cc would!

Yamaha has promised much over the last 12 months and the rest of them is watching, one deviation, one more disappointment, once more the middle class enthusiasts getting left out - chances are, we will be back to the Discovers and the Unicorns.

P.S. No offence meant to the Unicorn riders or Honda for reasons known to many

Cheers,
Shamik