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**Samarth 619** · 01-01-2013, 11:38 PM

Topic Approved.

If I remember correctly, I never saw a 2 stroker at full throttle with no smoke. Ok, maybe some well maintained RX100's had no smoke when they were ridden as commuters. So, are you absolutely sure about the smoke being more, at the "Same engine speed"?

@ 2 Strokers: Guys, kindly help him out.

**srikany** · 01-02-2013, 12:02 AM

Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post

Topic Approved.

If I remember correctly, I never saw a 2 stroker at full throttle with no smoke. Ok, maybe some well maintained RX100's had no smoke when they were ridden as commuters. So, are you absolutely sure about the smoke being more, at the "Same engine speed"?

@ 2 Strokers: Guys, kindly help him out.

HI Samarth, first of all Wish you a happy new year. Thanks for your reply. Yes the smoke is across all the rpms from idling to WOT. I am checking the oil consumption to see if there is some fine-tuning to be done. I have topped up with 100 ml yesterday.

**Honda_CBF** · 01-03-2013, 02:11 PM

Smoke levels also increases because of engine wear, mostly piston/rings and cylinder. Replacement of piston to next oversize and cylinder rebore or replacement of whole kit is required. Another reason can be oil pump itself, get it checked from a experienced mechanic. My personal opinion is running premix is best.. Oil pumps can die without warnings and when it happens you know the result.. But premix always causes smoke and is more harmful to environment.

**srikany** · 01-04-2013, 11:27 PM

Originally posted by Honda_CBF View Post

Smoke levels also increases because of engine wear, mostly piston/rings and cylinder. Replacement of piston to next oversize and cylinder rebore or replacement of whole kit is required. Another reason can be oil pump itself, get it checked from a experienced mechanic. My personal opinion is running premix is best.. Oil pumps can die without warnings and when it happens you know the result.. But premix always causes smoke and is more harmful to environment.

HI Ateesh, Thanks for the details. I simply lubricated the cable and re-adjusted the oil pump. Bingo! everything is back to normal. Yes I do agree regarding the oilpump thing. I remember having read somewhere that the proper way to monitor the health of the oil pump is to check its oil pumping capacity with every service. The mechanics do not even adjust the cable in the way it is supposed to be let alone taking the pains to check the oil flow. I am mulling over the option of setting the oil pump to half the designed capacity and the other half as premix in petrol. Would this be a good approach..Please let me know

**Dinesh.P** · 01-05-2013, 04:25 AM

Originally posted by srikany View Post

HI Ateesh, Thanks for the details. I simply lubricated the cable and re-adjusted the oil pump. Bingo! everything is back to normal. Yes I do agree regarding the oilpump thing. I remember having read somewhere that the proper way to monitor the health of the oil pump is to check its oil pumping capacity with every service. The mechanics do not even adjust the cable in the way it is supposed to be let alone taking the pains to check the oil flow. I am mulling over the option of setting the oil pump to half the designed capacity and the other half as premix in petrol. Would this be a good approach..Please let me know

2 Strokes running with excess oil is never a problem it just flutters while we red line the bike ... But try to maintain the same grade of oil you use in oil tank for the premix purpose mixing two different grade oils is not a good idea .... When we did ISG2G to Chikmaglur last year I drained up the Yamalube from the oil tank and filled up the Motul 510 because our whole gang of 2strokers were using Motul 510 for the premix .....
One easy way to check the oil flow is use a transparent tube between the oil tank and oil pump so that you can see whether the oil supply is taking place

**Honda_CBF** · 01-06-2013, 08:37 PM

Originally posted by srikany View Post

HI Ateesh, Thanks for the details. I simply lubricated the cable and re-adjusted the oil pump. Bingo! everything is back to normal. Yes I do agree regarding the oilpump thing. I remember having read somewhere that the proper way to monitor the health of the oil pump is to check its oil pumping capacity with every service. The mechanics do not even adjust the cable in the way it is supposed to be let alone taking the pains to check the oil flow. I am mulling over the option of setting the oil pump to half the designed capacity and the other half as premix in petrol. Would this be a good approach..Please let me know

that would be better than relying on the oil pump only. Use something like 15ml per liter as pre mix and adjust oil pump to supply ~15ml per liter or 20ml as premix and 10ml via oil pump. I never had the chance for experimenting. First time when the engine seized, it was because the oil pipe from oil reservoir to carb got disconnected somehow. Second time when my kinetic killed itself it was because of dead oil pump (it happened just after running in

) now I'm of to premix, oil to petrol ratio differs from use, 20ml~40ml per liter.

**srikany** · 01-09-2013, 11:34 PM

Originally posted by Honda_CBF View Post

that would be better than relying on the oil pump only. Use something like 15ml per liter as pre mix and adjust oil pump to supply ~15ml per liter or 20ml as premix and 10ml via oil pump. I never had the chance for experimenting. First time when the engine seized, it was because the oil pipe from oil reservoir to carb got disconnected somehow. Second time when my kinetic killed itself it was because of dead oil pump (it happened just after running in

) now I'm of to premix, oil to petrol ratio differs from use, 20ml~40ml per liter.

Hi Ateesh, thanks for the detailed reply. I only started being quite particular of my Samurais oil consumption recently, a look at the manual and I was horrified to know that I was running at such a lean oil ratio that a half liter would last around 1900kms if not more. The manual gave a figure of 1200kms/Liter of 2T. I have checked the oil consumption after the recent oil pump adjustment and it is more close to 1400kms/Liter. There is no noticeable white/blue smoke and the bike is the usual self happily revving to 65-70kmph which is more or less the top speed for a samurai. Sad to hear that you kinetic Honda had an engine seizure due to a oil pump going kaput that too after a proper run-in. You mentioned that you use a ration between 20ml to 40 ml per liter, I would want to know when you use those ratios and what all factors do you consider for using those ratios.

**srikany** · 01-09-2013, 11:41 PM

Originally posted by Dinesh.P View Post

2 Strokes running with excess oil is never a problem it just flutters while we red line the bike ... But try to maintain the same grade of oil you use in oil tank for the premix purpose mixing two different grade oils is not a good idea .... When we did ISG2G to Chikmaglur last year I drained up the Yamalube from the oil tank and filled up the Motul 510 because our whole gang of 2strokers were using Motul 510 for the premix .....
One easy way to check the oil flow is use a transparent tube between the oil tank and oil pump so that you can see whether the oil supply is taking place

HI Dinesh, Thanks for the reply with so many details. I have a quick query as I happened to google about over lubricating a two stroke motor and happened to see an article about marine two strokes being ruined by over lubrication.

Insights

http://hjlubri.dk/en/news/over-lubrication-two-stroke-engines-and-its-consequences

Gain lubrication insights from our research and success stories. Keep up with trends and boost your knowledge. Join us now!

Does this situation arise for aircooled two stroke bike engines as well. Please share your thoughts on this.

**Dinesh.P** · 01-10-2013, 02:57 AM

Originally posted by srikany View Post

HI Dinesh, Thanks for the reply with so many details. I have a quick query as I happened to google about over lubricating a two stroke motor and happened to see an article about marine two strokes being ruined by over lubrication.

Over Lubrication of Two Stroke Engines and its Consequences | Hans Jensen Lubricators

Does this situation arise for aircooled two stroke bike engines as well. Please share your thoughts on this.

Daily learning something about 2 Stroke machines

but they have mentioned the problem in common. I never heard that a 2 stroke giving up with excess oil.. I even used double the normal level of oil recommended but never faced any issues....

**Honda_CBF** · 01-11-2013, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by srikany View Post

Hi Ateesh, thanks for the detailed reply. I only started being quite particular of my Samurais oil consumption recently, a look at the manual and I was horrified to know that I was running at such a lean oil ratio that a half liter would last around 1900kms if not more. The manual gave a figure of 1200kms/Liter of 2T. I have checked the oil consumption after the recent oil pump adjustment and it is more close to 1400kms/Liter. There is no noticeable white/blue smoke and the bike is the usual self happily revving to 65-70kmph which is more or less the top speed for a samurai. Sad to hear that you kinetic Honda had an engine seizure due to a oil pump going kaput that too after a proper run-in. You mentioned that you use a ration between 20ml to 40 ml per liter, I would want to know when you use those ratios and what all factors do you consider for using those ratios.

then don't alter oil pump adjustment use something like 10~15ml as premix to compensate. Regarding my scoot's (premix) 2T usages its 20ml per liter for daily, shorts rides (6kms to & from and return trip starts from cold engine). 40ml per litter for occasional highway rides (some 100~150kms; takes 4 to 5 hrs with various stops). 30ml per litter when it pings in summer even in short city rides. (though this pinging problem is because of carbon deposits in engine) And marine engines operate in different environment so comparing with them is not entirely correct. Also, using too much of 2t will harm engine, reason being carbon deposits. And too much 2t with premix will lean out the whole AFR making the engine run hotter than optimum. Also, i think, 65~70kmph is rather low for samurai. 80 should come up pretty easy (btw, I've never rode a samurai, here I'm comparing with RX100)

**srikany** · 01-12-2013, 10:16 AM

Originally posted by Honda_CBF View Post

then don't alter oil pump adjustment use something like 10~15ml as premix to compensate. Regarding my scoot's (premix) 2T usages its 20ml per liter for daily, shorts rides (6kms to & from and return trip starts from cold engine). 40ml per litter for occasional highway rides (some 100~150kms; takes 4 to 5 hrs with various stops). 30ml per liter when it pings in summer even in short city rides. (though this pinging problem is because of carbon deposits in engine) And marine engines operate in different environment so comparing with them is not entirely correct. Also, using too much of 2t will harm engine, reason being carbon deposits. And too much 2t with premix will lean out the whole AFR making the engine run hotter than optimum. Also, i think, 65~70kmph is rather low for samurai. 80 should come up pretty easy (btw, I've never rode a samurai, here I'm comparing with RX100)

Thanks for the advice buddy. Yes since the marine engines operate on a much more limited rev band and constant load, comparing them with our air-cooled motorcycle engines would not be fair. What you have suggested in terms of premix with 10ml is really helpful.

As my bike is already close to 60,000 kms I do not go beyond 65 normally. I have occasionally touched 80kmph on a clear stretch which is more or less the top-speed for Samurais ( Considering that I weigh more than 90kgs)

What is the correct way of de-carbing a two stroke motorcycles engine. Most of the mechanics only open the head and then remove carbon from the piston head, and clean the silencer if they are in good mood. that is all. How are the exhaust port(s) etc supposed to be de-carbed, what is the 100% textbook way of de carbing the entire engine. I would be grateful if someone shares their insights.

**Honda_CBF** · 01-14-2013, 11:23 PM

For decarbonising, dismantle cylinder head and silencer. make sure piston is at TDC. spray some 2T oil (carbon will soak oil & swell a little then it will be easy to scrap it off) on piston top, combustion chamber (underside of head) and also spray some oil between piston and cylinder. Next, scrap all carbon from combustion chamber and piston top. Then, turn the crank & push the piston down. Now you'll see, carbon particles sticking to cylinder, near the top area (where piston stays at TDC) wipe those with lint free cloth (yeah, they ain't hard carbon deposits

) Now, next part is for exhaust port; spray 2T, brush it off, wipe with lint free cloth and repeat until satisfied. (start easy with small portion, clean few millimeters of area at once) don't let the carbon particles come close to piston. Make sure no loose carbon particles are left on/around cylinder, piston, ports, head or anywhere. As loose carbon particle can damage cylinder liner. Assemble everything back. Done!! P.S. This is what I do. Not sure if any better way's around. Hope it helps

**srikany** · 01-21-2013, 10:27 AM

Originally posted by Honda_CBF View Post

For decarbonising, dismantle cylinder head and silencer. make sure piston is at TDC. spray some 2T oil (carbon will soak oil & swell a little then it will be easy to scrap it off) on piston top, combustion chamber (underside of head) and also spray some oil between piston and cylinder. Next, scrap all carbon from combustion chamber and piston top. Then, turn the crank & push the piston down. Now you'll see, carbon particles sticking to cylinder, near the top area (where piston stays at TDC) wipe those with lint free cloth (yeah, they ain't hard carbon deposits

) Now, next part is for exhaust port; spray 2T, brush it off, wipe with lint free cloth and repeat until satisfied. (start easy with small portion, clean few millimeters of area at once) don't let the carbon particles come close to piston. Make sure no loose carbon particles are left on/around cylinder, piston, ports, head or anywhere. As loose carbon particle can damage cylinder liner. Assemble everything back. Done!! P.S. This is what I do. Not sure if any better way's around. Hope it helps

Thanks for the very detailed reply. I would have to buy a good torque wrench and try this out the next time. I would also lookup youtube for any videos about this as well.

**srikany** · 01-25-2013, 10:08 PM

Adjusting the Oil pump on Suzuki Samurai bike.

Here is how to adjust the oil pump for Suzuki Samurai Bike.

Step 1) Loosen the lock nut of the oil cable and leave it slightly turned into the magneto cover.
Step 2) now remove the gear shifter lever ( This is the most tricky part as this requires you pull the lever properly without damaging the teeth)
Step 3) remove the magneto coil side cover
Step 4) Check for the alignment of the mark on the lever when the throttle fully opens with the reference mark on the right side of the oil pump lever as shown in the picture two.
Step 5) Adjust the slack accordingly and then tighten the lock nut for the oil pump cable.

Step 6) top up the 2T oil with 100ml exactly and this should last for about 120-140 kms. If it is beyond this range, adjust the cable accordingly ( Step 1 onwards)
Note: Adjust the oil pump cable only after the throttle cable is adjusted properly. If the throttle cable is adjusted, the oil cable also needs to be adjusted.

---
The main problem with my Samurais oil pump was that the nut was too tight and the lever was not returning to the normal position after releasing the throttle from the fully open position. I loosened the nut and applied WD 40 and a dab of grease to the spring after this. I did not tighten it to as much as before and now everything works very fine.

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Excessive smoke from Samurai 1999 - Suggestions required

Excessive smoke from Samurai 1999 - Suggestions required

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