Announcement

**ksameer** · 03-16-2011, 11:48 PM

Hero does need to bring in something new. Its good that they have been making reliable bikes for decades however others are catching up on this. There is Honda who actually has the reliable technology on which HH sold its products. Even Bajaj is steadlily moving up the ladder in reliability. 5 years down the line, I don't see Hero being able to sell purely in the name of reliability. They need to develop something new.

**chinmayakar** · 03-17-2011, 12:46 AM

Originally posted by Satyamzma View Post

don't worry Hero group is busy making a 400cc Disel bike..

Lets see. Even if it comes out, it wont change the fortunes drastically. If HH is able to do it, then Bajaj would do it much before them. Atleast by the way Bajaj is working now it looks a possibility.

Everyone knows how the Bullet Diesel faired in the market inspite of running on cheaper fuel.

**Samarth 619** · 03-17-2011, 12:59 AM

Originally posted by forty6 View Post

Hero Honda has always been a volume player. It is no porsche or Ferrari. Over the years it provided reliable two wheel transport to anyone and everyone who could not afford the car. Hero Honda never made bikes for bikers no matter what their advertising says. Fill it Shut it Forget it. About money rather than biking. And it was a smart thing to do in those days. But the trouble is they never changed. But the people have. Please understand the youth today is a lot different from the youth in 80s. They can sacrifice a bit of mileage for a bit more of style. And style not as in ++ but genuine good design. People are more aspirational these days. Also the market has matured a lot. In the 80s there was a lot of gap between a bike and a car. Now Nano is available at 1.5 lakhs or some such. Loans are easily available. Yes it will take another 10 years when like the west where only people who want to ride will buy bikes and till then Hero can still do well but it has to change how people perceive it as. What has worked wonders for them till now is their anathema now. Fill it shut it forget it doesn't work as well as fill it shut it revv it. It will be interesting to watch how the Munjals will respond it. My advice get a younger Munjal in charge a la Rajiv Bajaj the oldies are incapable of understanding the youth and right now it is the market of youth.

You're partially right about Hero Honda not changing for bikers. But, they did get CBZ, Karizma & ZMR for bikers & tourers, no doubt about that. Brothers, Let's credit them fairly.

But think about it, did they change for commuters? Did they? No, they did not.
Let's face it- 60 kmpl was a SPLENDEROUS Mileage back in the 1980's, but not anymore. Did they really change the splendor/ passion for better mileage? No.

What do the commuters get from HH? Today, Discover gives a real 80 kmpl something and a TVS Star City is capable of lasting long enough, as some owners claim. So, where's the USP of Hero Honda Commuters? Brand name? Graphics?

Hero was on the right path, hunting for reliability & service, and it was rewarded well too. But when every other company provides the similar level of these aspects, Hero must find its USP again... Hope, the Diesel bike turns out to be just the USP Hero needs!

**payeng** · 03-17-2011, 03:30 AM

Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post

So, where's the USP of Hero Honda Commuters? Brand name? Graphics?

Yes, Brand Name of Splendor and Passion, something which has been built over 10-15 years is something HUGE..

Thousands of people still BLINDLY buy the Splendor/Passion every day.

**aargee** · 03-17-2011, 08:56 AM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

If Bajaj improve their quality, it will be unbeatable. Nothing else matters. Their design and styling is quite good if not as good as foreign companies.

Add to that...improvise on their engineering front too.

Originally posted by forty6 View Post

My advice get a younger Munjal in charge a la Rajiv Bajaj the oldies are incapable of understanding the youth and right now it is the market of youth.

+Million

**surya220** · 03-17-2011, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by aargee View Post

Add to that...improvise on their engineering front too.

What do they have to IMPROVISE on the engineering front..? They've already shown that a well tuned carb with good cylinder head work can produce more power and torque than a FI unit that's mildly tuned.. There has been so much of tech upgrades in the Bajaj motorcycles over the decade, i haven't yet seen another Jap maker doing so much, save for the R15..

**aargee** · 03-17-2011, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by surya220 View Post

What do they have to IMPROVISE on the engineering front..?

Ride a simple Rx & Pulsar to know the difference

Originally posted by surya220 View Post

There has been so much of tech upgrades in the Bajaj motorcycles over the decade, i haven't yet seen another Jap maker doing so much, save for the R15..

There has been upgrades & improvisation, no doubt on that, they still lack the final touch on the engineering which I'm sure they'll do it in the years to come.

**nitrosatya** · 03-17-2011, 10:15 AM

Originally posted by surya220 View Post

What do they have to IMPROVISE on the engineering front..? They've already shown that a well tuned carb with good cylinder head work can produce more power and torque than a FI unit that's mildly tuned.. There has been so much of tech upgrades in the Bajaj motorcycles over the decade, i haven't yet seen another Jap maker doing so much, save for the R15..

Really?

Try a Japanese bike. See the refinement. Pulsars vibrate like anything. Atleast mine does. It just puts you off the riding experience.

**Satyamzma** · 03-17-2011, 10:21 AM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

Really?

Try a Japanese bike. See the refinement. Pulsars vibrate like anything. Atleast mine does. It just puts you off the riding experience.

+100 Anyday I will Prefer Japanese Make over Indian Brands

**vrugonnab** · 03-17-2011, 09:59 PM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

Really?

Try a Japanese bike. See the refinement. Pulsars vibrate like anything. Atleast mine does. It just puts you off the riding experience.

Really.. can't believe it.. I've never experienced Pulsar vibrating like anything.. it's rock solid even at 100+ speeds. But, it's like a rocket at those speeds.. if anything they have to improve handling at those speeds.. below 80kmph mark, it's pretty good.

yeah... japanese bikes.. not all of them are where you imagine them to be.. for example take a shine/stunner and see how they vibrate once you cross 60kmph mark...

**aargee** · 03-17-2011, 10:09 PM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

Try a Japanese bike. See the refinement. Pulsars vibrate like anything. Atleast mine does. It just puts you off the riding experience.

You simply echoed my mind that I didn't want to spell it out!!!

Surya, I don't have anything against Pulsars or even Discover nor the people who ride them. BAL is known for rattling & heavy vibrations from the days of KB100 which is clearly evident even after 2 decade where you can find considerably more number of Rx running on roads compared to KB's.

Personally I've lot of respect & admire BAL & its just due to this factor I don't want to own a product of BAL. I used to be & still a lover of KB100 & 125, IMO, they provide a best of both worlds w.r.t speed as well as FE compared to Rx.

The same trend is seen even on P220 or 150. They give a decent (or even better) FE & power compared to most 150 air cooled engines. But like Satya says, refinement is what will get BAL to compete in the international market. I'm damn sure BAL knows about this & I'm sure they'll get this point when they move along.

**nitrosatya** · 03-17-2011, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by vrugonnab View Post

Really.. can't believe it.. I've never experienced Pulsar vibrating like anything.. it's rock solid even at 100+ speeds. But, it's like a rocket at those speeds.. if anything they have to improve handling at those speeds.. below 80kmph mark, it's pretty good.

yeah... japanese bikes.. not all of them are where you imagine them to be.. for example take a shine/stunner and see how they vibrate once you cross 60kmph mark...

Tell me after one year of usage. BTW I have the first gen 220. And Japanese bikes as in performance bikes.

Originally posted by aargee View Post

You simply echoed my mind that I didn't want to spell it out!!!

Surya, I don't have anything against Pulsars or even Discover nor the people who ride them. BAL is known for rattling & heavy vibrations from the days of KB100 which is clearly evident even after 2 decade

There was a Ninja test ride in Pune once. The company official told me that vibration is the character of Bajaj bikes and some people prefer it!

I am still in shock of what he said!

**chinmayakar** · 03-17-2011, 10:38 PM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

Really?

Try a Japanese bike. See the refinement. Pulsars vibrate like anything. Atleast mine does. It just puts you off the riding experience.

Pulsars definitely do not vibrate the way you are making it sound. I am saying this after having owned bikes from almost all the makers. A FZ, 2 Karizma R's, and a 220FI and a 220 Carb. The FI is with me for 3 years now and the 220 Carb has just completed 18 months.

My first bike was a P150 dtsi, which was with me for 3 years. I never faced any major issues with it. Theres been a lot of difference in the quality of Pulsars then and now.

P220 has definitely come a long way, and it does not vibrate like you present it.

You cannot take it from Bajaj, they have made huge improvements which everyone is able to see.

Remember Bajaj was down in the dumps before Pulsar happened and it has evolved ever since then.

Nitrosatya, you can very well test ride my 220's and make out for yourself if it vibrates. even after getting the carb 220 Joeled, it still does not vibrate. Anyone is more than welcome to test it.

**aargee** · 03-17-2011, 10:44 PM

Originally posted by nitrosatya View Post

The company official told me that vibration is the character of Bajaj bikes and some people prefer it!

I am still in shock of what he said!

Lol!!! I'm still Lol hearing this

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Pulsars definitely do not vibrate...220's and make out for yourself if it vibrates

No one is speaking against BAL or Pulsars. Its an universal truth that our Indian brands are no match for fit, finish, refinement, technology & most importantly QUALITY for any Japanese manufacturer. Even our own HH CD100s quality & refinement is much better than Discover 100, forget alone comparing ZMR's.

Sigh!!! How else can I prove we're talking positive on BAL/Pulsars/Discovers

**nitrosatya** · 03-17-2011, 10:45 PM

@chinmayakar:I am not against Bajaj Pulsar 220. But I have experienced a lot of vibrations bro! I have had tingling sensations in my hands after Lavasa riding in Pune. Taken her to 140. Why would I want to badmouth Pulsar 220 otherwise?

aargee: You can ask Satyen, he was with me.

Announcement

What is Hero Honda not doing right and Bajaj is?

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment