[xBhp Universal Thread]: to Warm up or not to

[Zapps]

So, I've been around xbhp for some time now, and the good folks here helped me decide what bike to go for last year.

Coming to the topic of Warm up, I've always believed warm up to be necessary. I warm up my P220 for 3-5 minutes in the morning and evening every day, infact, while it warms up I get time to clean it off with the rag I keep in the bike. So, the time needed serves both purposes. So, today I stumbled upon this warm up article and thought I should share the info provide by the dude with you fellas, here it goes:

“Why is it important to warm up an engine”? The answer lies in a simple explanation of science and mathematics. Before you quit reading because you may not have been an ace at math and science in high school, just give me a minute to break it down. It is actually really simple...

The whole reason we need to let our engine warm up revolves around the concept of linear thermal expansion. Your engine is made up of a number of different materials. The piston is made from a certain type of aluminum alloy, the cylinder another type of aluminum alloy, the rings cast iron or steel, the valves if you have a four-stroke from steel, stainless, steel, or titanium, and the guides are made from yet another material. Once the engine is started these components begin to heat up from combustion and friction as they slide back and forth. None of these materials are exactly alike, and because of this they will expand when heated or contract when cooled at different rates. This interaction between material and change in temperature is predictable and linear.

Now that we understand that engine components change dimensionally from when the motor is cold to when the motor is warm we can start to see the importance of warming up the engine. When a cold engine is first started the piston heats up and expands first. Heat is transferred from the piston to the rings and then to the cylinder wall. If we rev the engine and generate lots of combustion cycles and increase the frequency of friction too early the piston will grow much faster than the cylinder. If there is not adequate space between piston and cylinder to account for this growth the engine could suffer what is known as a cold seizure and you will have yourself a bad day.

By allowing your engine to warm up before you start riding you allow all the components in the engine to slowly expand and stabilize. Once the engine is warm, changes in the engine part dimensions are less drastic and there is much less risk of damaging the engine.

And here's the ink to the article - https://www.diymotofix.com/blog/warm...-engine-how-to

[xBhp]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Thread approved.
A practice of prime importance that is mostly ignored.
Thanks for sharing the information, Zapps.

[Zapps]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Thread approved.
A practice of prime importance that is mostly ignored.
Thanks for sharing the information, Zapps.

Thanks for the Approval Mod, a fellow xBhpian also mentioned the concept of cooling down.

I guess he meant that like warm up, bike needs to be cooled down appropriately. Would that involve riding slowly without load on engine for the end of journey like for last 2-3 KMs or to let the engine idle after one has arrived at destination.

I'd appreciate if you and fellow riders could share your thoughts on this cool down concept too.

[ajaythakur]

Re: to Warm up or not to

If we rev the engine and generate lots of combustion cycles and increase the frequency of friction too early the piston will grow much faster than the cylinder. If there is not adequate space between piston and cylinder to account for this growth the engine could suffer what is known as a cold seizure and you will have yourself a bad day.

Interesting...
Can you please elaborate about cold seizure.
I mean how the engine behaves in that case.
But i think the friction is actually is between piston rings and cylinder.correct me if i am wrong ..

[B7ACKTHORN]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Interesting...
Can you please elaborate about cold seizure.
I mean how the engine behaves in that case.
But i think the friction is actually is between piston rings and cylinder.correct me if i am wrong ..

Cold seizure is when the piston expands faster than the cylinder itself. When this happens, the expanded piston gets restricted inside a smaller bore and hence gets seized. For example, what happens when your finger swells due to an accident and you have a ring in your finger. Doesn't the ring hurt and become even harder to remove and get stuck until the swelling comes down? Similar thing is what happens inside an engine.

All metals expand at different temp coefficient, so that's why it's advised to warm up the engine at idle, so that all the engine parts warm up equally and efficiently especially in cold conditions.

Cheers!
VJ

[eliksir]

Re: to Warm up or not to

I warm up my P220 for 3-5 minutes

Do we really need to warm up for that long, especially in Indian conditions? Are the components used in our mass market bikes prone to such big compression-expansion cycles?

while it warms up I get time to clean it off with the rag I keep in the bike.

Ha, this is what I do too. It takes only 30s to 1min though. But then I ride the first couple of kms in low rpms and then gradually increase after that.

[Ankey]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Do we really need to warm up for that long, especially in Indian conditions? Are the components used in our mass market bikes prone to such big compression-expansion cycles?


Ha, this is what I do too. It takes only 30s to 1min though. But then I ride the first couple of kms in low rpms and then gradually increase after that.

I do the same thing sir.
The first thing I do is to switch on the engine, then pun on my helmet and gloves and open the house gate.
Then take the bike out and go back to close the gate, it takes anywhere about 2-3 minutes.
Then I ride under 3K rpm on my colony roads till I reach the main road, which I also count as warm up.

So by the time I get out of the colony road to the main road, its about 4-5 minutes of warmup, which I think is more than enough even in the freezing temperatures of North Indian winters. And this method has served me well for more than a decade.

Good to know that more experienced riders do the same thing.
Thank you, it just confirms that I have good riding habits.
Cheers.

[#bpk]

Re: to Warm up or not to

I do the same thing sir.
The first thing I do is to switch on the engine, then pun on my helmet and gloves and open the house gate.
Then take the bike out and go back to close the gate, it takes anywhere about 2-3 minutes.
Then I ride under 3K rpm on my colony roads till I reach the main road, which I also count as warm up.

So by the time I get out of the colony road to the main road, its about 4-5 minutes of warmup, which I think is more than enough even in the freezing temperatures of North Indian winters. And this method has served me well for more than a decade.

Good to know that more experienced riders do the same thing.
Thank you, it just confirms that I have good riding habits.
Cheers.

I too do the same [emoji4]

[Abhishekilke]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Warming up the engine for 3-5 minutes before riding is absolutely unnecessary you're just wasting fuel, warm up the engine for maximum 60-90 seconds and then increase rpm's after you ride for a distance. If you've just come back from a long distance ride keep the motorcycle idling for 60 seconds max.

[sparky]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Warm up is needed for bikes of bigger capacity, at least 300cc or more because their engines have higher rpms and it takes time for oil to warm up and fill up the clearances. For Indian commuter bikes it is not needed at all unless you rip right after you start. It will still help in cold conditions to warm up for a min or two before you go. But, it still is always a good practice nonetheless as it keeps engine condition healthy throughout its life.

[The Mountain]

Re: to Warm up or not to

For what it's worth, BMW specifically advises AGAINST warmup of their bikes, including the really big ones. The owner manual tells riders to ride off immediately once the engine has started, and to not idle for any length of time.

Modern fuel-injected bikes do not need warmup for the most part. The practice got its start with carbureted bikes that need time for the engine to be able to run without the choke applied. It also allowed engine oil to circulate up to the valve train, since older bikes often had inefficient oiling systems and the cold thick oil took a little time to get pushed through all the engine passages. With modern engineering and the advanced oils, the latter are no longer an issue, and fuel injection system takes care of balancing the fuel mix so the engine can be driven immediately. At most, start your bike, and then put on your helmet and gloves. That is ample time for the oil to circulate, and then you can ride off. Ankey's routine is pretty much ideal.

If your bike has a carburetor, then you do need to allow enough time for the engine to at least warm up enough to run on half-choke. I have never, not even once, heard of an engine seizing due to being ridden while cold. At worst, you'll wear the rings faster and it might burn a little oil.

[Zapps]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Agreed, actually I have an old school designed carb P220, hence I like to go with warmup. I can't comment on modern Fi ones since I don't have firsthand experience, I guess it's suffice to just drive slow for first km and then rip the throttle.

Mine drives well if I let it warm-up and then drive slow for the first 1-2 kms to warm up the tyres (which co-incides with the first traffic lights on my route), then I go into the crazy mode.

For what it's worth, BMW specifically advises AGAINST warmup of their bikes, including the really big ones. The owner manual tells riders to ride off immediately once the engine has started, and to not idle for any length of time.

Modern fuel-injected bikes do not need warmup for the most part. The practice got its start with carbureted bikes that need time for the engine to be able to run without the choke applied. It also allowed engine oil to circulate up to the valve train, since older bikes often had inefficient oiling systems and the cold thick oil took a little time to get pushed through all the engine passages. With modern engineering and the advanced oils, the latter are no longer an issue, and fuel injection system takes care of balancing the fuel mix so the engine can be driven immediately. At most, start your bike, and then put on your helmet and gloves. That is ample time for the oil to circulate, and then you can ride off. Ankey's routine is pretty much ideal.

If your bike has a carburetor, then you do need to allow enough time for the engine to at least warm up enough to run on half-choke. I have never, not even once, heard of an engine seizing due to being ridden while cold. At worst, you'll wear the rings faster and it might burn a little oil.

[sagarzzz]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Yes i also warmup my bike ...time is alswas xlose to 3 to 4 minutes...

[krishna77]

Re: to Warm up or not to

I live in Kolkata and ride a 2012 Yamaha SS125. My warm up routine is as below.

From Mid November to Mid February - 60 seconds.
Rest of the year - anything between 30-40 seconds. Yes in the summers as well.

I make sure to go through all the gears at least twice in the first half kilometers. I think it is as important as warming up the bike.

[Balgi]

Re: to Warm up or not to

Interesting write up. My warm up procedure is the same regardless of season and ambient temperature. I have 2 two strokes one 4 stroke commuter and 1 4 stroke multi cylinder bike. And I start and let idle all of my FI bikes until the revs settle down to normal running rpm and then ride slowly at about 20% throttle until I go through all the gears. This comes down to about 40 secs of idle followed usually by 3 minutes of slow riding. And post that I gradually start going through the revs increasing the throttle in increments until I feel the bike is comfortable running as intended. So total time of 6 minutes including 40 sec warm-up.

As for my carburated bikes (including 2 strokes and 4 stroke) I like to let them idle on choke until rpm drops which is about 15-20 secs since start. And then I let them idle for another 15 secs with choke off. Then I ride slow for a couple of minutes while gradually increasing throttle and going through the gears so about 3-4 minutes total with the standing idle with and without choke.

My Rx 100 is 33 years old and has seen over 5 lakh kms of use in mine and my dad's hands, I also have a 50 year old Yamaha, an Apache 200 (1 and half years old with 25k kms on odo), unicorn (sold with 10 years and 2.4 lakhs kms on odo), ktm Duke 390 (sold 2 years and 17k kms on odo) and CBR 650f (3 years with 20k kms on odo). Reason I'm mentioning this is because I use this warm-up on all my bikes and they're running fine and problem free with decent FE.

Veteran bikers please shed some light on my warm-up practices. I'd love to have all of your inputs on what I should change and what I'm doing correctly.