Yes, you are right! I really dont understand the Hero idea. True, that most of the northern part of the country is cold and you need a lower viscosity oil and almost all the Hero bikes are ment to be ride sanely i.e smooth and at slow speeds which is why the engines will never undergo a lot of stress and a 10w30 oil is sufficient. And even in case you rev too much and travel at high speeds, the oil will degrade fast, and needs frequent change, thats all. I guess the 10w30 oil change is recommended at interval of 1500-2000km. Is it correct?
I think for tourer like Karizma at least they could have recommended 10W40 oil. Problem is the oil Hero has suggested is not as high grade as Yamaha uses, its Motul whats being recommended for our bikes. Hero suggestion goes by the Japanese testing (Karizma is actually Honda Engine) and they don't recommend Castrol or Motul since these oils were not available for the Japanese to test. In any case, you know much better than me anyways, I guess you must be using higher grade synthetic right?

Every bike has its set of niggles which needs to be dealed with. By reading throught he above posts I could guess that :
1. CBR is out of question.
2. Its RE vs ZMA vs P220.

So below are my inputs about the topic. (I am a ZMA owner)
1. RE - a different league of bike. A headturner whether you own a 1985 model or 2011.
2. Zma - A seasoned tourer. No matter how bad you abuse it, its faithful. Would never let you down. Spares are worry. But in a new bike you wont need it for atleast 2 yrs. I personally am in a dilema to continue with ZMA or go for P220. Everytime I ride my ZMA, i fall in love with it. Good torque, good handling makes it a breeze in city traffic. I own 2004 model, bought used but still could clock 120km/hr on the odo with a bad clutch plates. That tells about its reliability.
3. P220 - Good looks, priced at par with ZMA with lots more tech like front/ rear disks, projector lights, tubless tyres, digital console. But no where near ZMA in reliability. No offence to P220 owners, its reliable but less than ZMA, spares are cheap but life is less.

Its your call. Take a testdrive and decide.

The ZMA has its origins from the Honda CRF230 an Off Roading bike, pretty strange huh???.

The best bet for ZMA is 10W40, cause the 10W30 has good acceleration and the 20W40 makes the bike good for touring but reduces acceleration by a huge margin. But unfortunately they are'nt available in Mineral.

I use Gulf Pride 4T Plus 20W40, I'm against using SS or FS oils, since they tend to blow gaskets when riding for prolonged periods at WOT.

You are right! Indeed true that the most km done in bikes like platina, splendors all have run on mineral for upto a lakh km without rebore.

I feel, its better to replace mineral oil that costs 230rs 4 times than a FS that costs 900Rs.

But FS oils are good to keep engine wear and tear to minimum, they stick to the walls quick, better heat management, not too thick or too thin, etc. etc. But all this I feel is good for bikes that travel a lot and demand that immediate response should get SS/FS oils itself. Infact the R15 only uses 15w50 semisynt. We may use it on Karizma but the 10W30 oil with a changing interval of 1500km should be the optimal.

The 2010 Karizma has a lot of issue with quality, rockerarms, piston cranks, etc all are not of the quality, you can read in ownership thread too if you dont believe me. So its just the same when you are comparing Karizma with Pulsar 220. Both are good and have issues, but pulsar comes more refined and you need not get additional mod done spending even more money.

You dont get it bro, its not about the cost or drain interval.

SS/FS Oils have finer particles that help it to stick to the engine walls etc, but the problem is when we ride the bike at WOT, there's a higher chance the oil will seep through the gasket and result in oil leak. So its always better to use mineral.

Using mineral oil is no harm, however, for the newer engines it is recommended to use Mineral than of SS/FS. Once the engine is done with safe 6k-7k on the odo, one can switch to SS oil. I'm not taking expense into consideration but the performance. The advantage of using SS is that they coat the engine with film like protecting from extreme wear and tear. Mineral oil if used is best because, after 2-2.5 either SS or mineral would start showing colors. The drain period between SS and Mineral are not that huge when compared to FS oils. For long road trips, SS/FS oil is considered than Mineral. These come from personal experience.

Read my reply one more time i clearly mentioned that it depends on owners satisfaction & desire .


Sorry as i have not seen your mentioning Karizma needs a break after covering 100 km in GHATS , & i thought about on roads . Break is good for both engine & a man , but after eack 100 km

BTW i don't found any GHAT of 100 km .

I just corrected the wrong information about Karizma has AC Headlight & It need brake after 100 km ride ,
which gonna help the thread starter to understand Karizma has DC headlight & you can continue ride on after 100 km . Untill you think it's time for a brake .


I readed my replies several time & found no where i mentioned such a thing & even i told i don't say about the other bikes pointed as i don't own them .


I am clearly saying about contineous riding/driving not about trip . As i take brake for getting food or other things after 3/4 hours of contineous riding/driving .

I completely understand what you wanna say with ur bike the oil seeps through the gaskets. Which we can actually arrest by using sealants in and around the metal that gasket is installed. Check out for more details: Yamabond gasket sealant

You should also understand my view point, that SS/FS oils cost is equal to changing mineral several times and since it has a drain interval which may exceed several months if my daily commute was less than few km in which case we will have to change the oil much earlier than desired km since it reached a time limit.

First of all this is not about oils. This is about bikes. And please don't always try to find unwanted negativity when other users try to make their valuable inputs.

And regarding oil leaks Karizma is anyday better than RE bikes which start oil leaks at very early stage itself. It is because of the heavy vibrations.

Karizma is an all rounder. Regarding the road conditions in India this bike can satisfy in almost every aspect. For the price tag of 85k it is pretty reasonable. You can't expect 100% perfection in every side for that price. So users must make additional changes to the bike to suit their riding conditions. The thing you should consider is that the versatility of the bike. Only few simple mods are required. For long rides we should shift to 20w 40 oil so that the bike can run for longer time periods without any heating problems. But the bike can run on 10w 30 too. But since it is a higher cc bike the drain period is reduced. For city rides and peppy acceleration 10w 30 can be used.

The handling and suspension setup is unmatched to any bike priced in that range. But yeah it is not made for the track and not everyday you race in a track. It is designed to run on worst roads in India. And headlight its easy to plonk 55w headlights no other mods required just remove the 35w light and you only need to put the 60w light. Regarding tyres for the price of 85k they are offering a bike which has one of the best quality parts and a super smooth refined engine. Because in order to keep price in that range they have to stick to the ordinary tires. You can shift to tubeless if you insist about it.

My friend has a 220 it is a powerful bike but in day to day life its not power that only matters. Honestly I am not so happy about going to service center frequently. Each bike has its own pros and cons. From the query that user asked it is anyway better to take a karizma rather than thunderbird as far as usability is concerned. It can go fast, It can take curves enough, and it offers unmatched comfort. And a good seating position too. Even after buying a karizma enough money is left to get riding gears and a neat helmet .

As we know, by 2014, Hero Honda agreement will come to an end. So what will be the scenario of hero honda vehicles. just think what happen to kinetic honda!! when . Is it will possible that parts will be easily available and same quality hero is going to maintain.

I feel Hero Moto will not go Kinetic way hero group have enough funds to buy firms for design and technology but if it happens it wont happen in one single year. As far as Karizma and TbTs is concerned i owned Zma -R for three years befor moving to australia And used it for my city commute , ride to job, freak out with friends and important long distant rides did chitkul, bharmaur, rohtang ,Dalhausie, Mcleodganj and in plains more than 500Km Up down, its extremely comfortable good pick up (a bit of laid back approach the way tourer should be)suspension is also well matched very good high speed ability on during cross winds a bit of shaky ness is felt , FE is also good with 32 to 42 Kmpl. Now What i do not like is plastics are of very poor quality and they are costly to change , wide rear tyre is needed i had Mrf meteor 110 , quality has worsened over the years specially valve seals , guides , need to be checked my bike started smoking during early morning starts in first 10000 km.Being in same profession HEro honda engineer was my friend so replaced whole cylinder kit under warranty. i dont know about Tbts much but according to ownership reports all over RE should look into quality. i heard a lot of niggles like sprag clutch faliure, speedometer not working , leakages, ....to be continued. i am in same situation for selectin a bike for my leh ride next year in aug and was confused between Tbts and Cbr 250 For now atleast Tbts is out of windowits cbr or any other yammi 250 launched before aug.

what is the FE in Karizma and Thunderbird??

FE in Karizma is 35 and Thunderbird will be giving about 30 Kmph...

My unbiased reply - If you want to keep the bike for more then 5-6 years, go for Enfield.. They are Timeless Bikes..

If you want to enjoy Fast & Reliable Biking for 5-6 years Go for ZMA after that time i think you will get more powerful & reliable bikes compared to Zma from all the Bike makers(Including Hero)

Don't Go for P220 as new models are coming in 1-2 month