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**Andante** · 02-09-2009, 02:09 PM

Guys, I'm not wanting to provoke a brand war here. Every bike has it's good and bad sides, what I'm trying to do is to make my choice more well informed.

I have already test driven the 220 and I agree the real power doesn't start until you hit 4K+ rpm. But I found that the pull it does have in the low RPM is more than enough to be comfortable.

As for the ZMA, I've been put off it by too many factors. One being the outdated technology (yes, it matters to me, i'm a techhead myself). The other being the utter incompetence of the sales staff I encountered here in AMD. Sorry, no offence meant, but having to wait for more then 15 mins just to get to speak to someone who's capable of speaking some english does not give a good impression and tells me that they simply want to cater to the large masses of schoolkids that roam around here. Plus a total lack of interest in the technology of what they are selling. So once again, I'm sure the ZMA is a wonderful bike, but all things given, it's not for me. (Lack of FI being the prime, the impression being second.)

**v_310** · 02-09-2009, 02:17 PM

Originally posted by prafultripathy View Post

So?

Every bike a has a torque band, but how does not making torque between 2k-4k matter? Most riding in city is done around 3K-6K!

And btw, the powerband on the 220 starts from 4K. Post 6K is the powerful powerband!

And please don't over exaggerate about the changing of gears. The 220 can pull from as low as 20kmph in 5th gear. The way you have put it, in stop and go traffic on ZMA you won't need to go above the first gear. But in the 220 you would have to constantly move from 1st-2nd-3rd and then back to 1st!!! Right?

Whoa - why taking it so personally? I have ridden both bikes and I've expressed what I've felt

. Everyone gives their opinion, the thread starter makes his decision. You don't have to get confrontational!

Peace out!

**rx100.7050** · 02-09-2009, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by Andante View Post

Hi, after my intro over in the who are you bit of this forum, I'd would want to ask you guys to help me settle my mind about what my next bike is going to be.

I'll try and give some background:
Currently I drive a Honda Shine 125, it's a nice bike, but I'm left wanting more. Especially, in the power and smoothness department while driving in the city.

I've checked just about every bike showroom by now and test ridden some variety of bikes.

About me: I'm from NL originally, and now live in ahmedabad permanently. I'm approx. 6 feet 2 inches (1.85m) and I do need to have proper comfort.

Budget: 1lac INR
My list of wants:
- Decent fuel efficiency when ridden sanely.
- Fuel injection (this is a must.)
- Should be reliable when taken care of properly.
- Good power in the lower RPM band.

I have already looked at:
- R15, couldn't shift gears properly due to my height and footrest placement. Low RPM power not confincing.
- Pulsar 220, right now I like this one best, but is it worth the doe?
- Pulsar 200, no FI... rumors about one coming, no rear disc.
- Apache RTR FI, seems to be a good bike, but I totally dislike it's looks.
- Karizma, again no FI, rumors about one coming, don't think i'll wait for it.
- RE 500cc, yes, checked it, hated it as I expected, this is one to be left for the ones that like it.

Maybe I've already dug this one out enough, but I'd like to hear your views on it, since I think that a lot of you have far more experience with the rides here, than I can gather in a short while. Thanks upfront!

It is indeed. Ask any P220 owner how satisfied he is. I am one of them. For a price of Rs 84k you are getting absolutely whatever you are looking for. And believe me, Bajaj never ever sleep on a problem for long. The new P220 has negligiable problems. I am more than satisfied with my 220

**Praful** · 02-09-2009, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by v_310 View Post

Whoa - why taking it so personally? I have ridden both bikes and I've expressed what I've felt

. Everyone gives their opinion, the thread starter makes his decision. You don't have to get confrontational!

Peace out!

No No brother, its not about taking it personally or getting confrontational.

Totally agree that every one has the right to free speech. But please put a little more thought into what you have written, well all make mistakes no doubt about it.

All I said is how relevant is having a lack of power between 2K-4K? And to what degree is the lack really? When you say you would have change gears often, do you really have to change it that frequently?

You probably could have chosen to either word or phrase it differently than "very little torque" & "lot of gear changing"!

Getting my point?

Originally posted by Andante View Post

As for the ZMA, I've been put off it by too many factors. One being the outdated technology (yes, it matters to me, i'm a techhead myself). The other being the utter incompetence of the sales staff I encountered here in AMD. Sorry, no offence meant, but having to wait for more then 15 mins just to get to speak to someone who's capable of speaking some english does not give a good impression and tells me that they simply want to cater to the large masses of schoolkids that roam around here. Plus a total lack of interest in the technology of what they are selling. So once again, I'm sure the ZMA is a wonderful bike, but all things given, it's not for me. (Lack of FI being the prime, the impression being second.)

What you get with the ZMA is reliability which no other bike can match up to! (Assuming you are looking for tourer (sorry have not read the thread completely incase you have already mentioned this)

Well, what is the prime reason for having FI?

PS: Most of the bikes being sold are actually outdated technology, the R-15 being the only one which relatively more *updated*!

PS: Just read your posts, and reliability, smoothness and low-end torque simply point towards Honda/Hero Honda.

**Andante** · 02-09-2009, 05:15 PM

Okay, I neglected to mention that I want a larger displacement motorcycle. That cuts out most of the bikes, including R15 (not to mention that i'm just too tall and find it uncomfortable).

Now, low-end torque a relative measure. Any larger displacement will have decent low-end torque.

As said I don't want a brand war. But HH do not appeal to me, I already mentioned the why. And Honda doesn't have any bike with what I want. (Trust me if they had even a 150cc FI bike, it would be mine already.)

As for smoothness, I don't think any particular brand will have a huge edge over another. And reliability was mentioned with the comment when maintain properly, that also includes taking more care if required by that particular motorcycle.

The prime reason for FI is better fuel efficiency, no choke fidgeting and the better throttle response. If that means I'm having to go for a bike that is potentially a tiny bit less smooth than HH, fine by me. (Sorry guys, this foreigners point of view is that here in AMD HH just doesn't cut it, due to the language barrier displayed at all times I've taken the time to go talk to them.

)

And yes, I know most motorcycles here are atleast somewhat outdated, but I have to make do with what is available.

All said and done, I think I'll go with my own feeling that is to get a P220 when I do get around to it (unless some thing spectacular happens with one of the other brands).

**MavericK46** · 02-09-2009, 05:20 PM

Originally posted by Andante View Post

Sorry guys, this foreigners point of view is that here in AMD HH just doesn't cut it, due to the language barrier displayed at all times I've taken the time to go talk to them.

We get the picture sir

All of us here : Hydro, Praful etc are just trying to put the various options into perspective for you sir. Praful for example is the owner of a P220 and one of the harshest critics BAL could've imagined

So..
Without fear of starting a 'brand war' or a 'flame-fest' you can share your comments with us and everyone will reciprocate

Cheers..!!

**Praful** · 02-09-2009, 05:29 PM

Ok, I'm getting the drift of what you are looking for!

And sorry to burst ur bubble, but you really need a 200+ from stables of Honda.

Compared to the competition, with 220 what you get :-
-A very responsive bike through the gears
-Fantastic throttle response
-Large enough size to accommodate an alien
-large spread service backup
-tantrums that you need to take care of
-weird issues that might sneak up to you in the middle of no where
-a very fun to ride bike
-brilliant lights
-decent braking

what you don't get
-a completely reliable bike, agreed the newer lots are virtually problem free, but still its not a bike that you can 100% rely on
-a good corner carver
-nimble light footed bike to cut through traffic
-high levels of refinement
-the need to drop gears to blast past the smart alec's in traffic

and loads more.......

Since the R15 and RTR are not sized to your liking and the HH brand at large doesn not appeal to you, then the 220 is the only way to go. Unless Kawa-BAL decide to magically sell the Ninja at lower than 1.5L

**v_310** · 02-09-2009, 05:35 PM

@praful - chill... wrong choice of words to express what I felt! my apologies

@andante - welcome to our world

... we've been waiting for such a bike for too long now...!

**Praful** · 02-09-2009, 05:38 PM

Originally posted by v_310 View Post

@andante - welcome to our world

... we've been waiting for such a bike for too long now...!

+1

This andante is the story for quite a few people around here (me included!). The need is to actually make compromises that hurt you the least and learn to live with that!

**Andante** · 02-09-2009, 05:42 PM

Originally posted by prafultripathy View Post

And sorry to burst ur bubble, but you really need a 200+ from stables of Honda.

You are so right! However that won't happen any time soon, I dare bet.

As for the "tantrums that you need to take care of" and "weird issues that might sneak up to you in the middle of no where", I'm not planning to go out of the city too much. And since I'm technically inclined myself, I'm sure I would be able to sort out minor issues long enough to get to a service station.

I'll bear with the issues should any arrive, every thing is a trade off at the end of the day.

And all of you thanks for the info, this is a great community even for a stubborn mule like me!

Oh, and for those that call me "sir" and all that, please don't. Unless you were being sarcastic.

**payeng** · 02-09-2009, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by Aparajith View Post

I would say look no further than the 220. Its been around 2 years since the 220 was launched and not many problems are cropping up in the newer models. BAJAJ have really done a good job in that aspect. Look at the ownership thread if u want some proof. Yes, the ZMA may be a bullet - proof engine, but its remained the same since its launch. No upgrades nothing.

I agree,

During the intial months there were some niggling issues.. but after 2 years of launch, the current batches seem to be virtually glitch free.. Squealing rear discs which needs to be kept clean and not so effective Rear View Mirrors do remain an irritant. But apart from that I haven't come across any major issue of late.

Check out the P220 ownership thread for details..

Originally posted by prafultripathy View Post

Ok, I'm getting the drift of what you are looking for!

And sorry to burst ur bubble, but you really need a 200+ from stables of Honda.

Compared to the competition, with 220 what you get :-
-A very responsive bike through the gears
-Fantastic throttle response
-Large enough size to accommodate an alien
-large spread service backup
-tantrums that you need to take care of
-weird issues that might sneak up to you in the middle of no where
-a very fun to ride bike
-brilliant lights
-decent braking

what you don't get
-a completely reliable bike, agreed the newer lots are virtually problem free, but still its not a bike that you can 100% rely on
-a good corner carver
-nimble light footed bike to cut through traffic
-high levels of refinement
-the need to drop gears to blast past the smart alec's in traffic

and loads more.......

Since the R15 and RTR are not sized to your liking and the HH brand at large doesn not appeal to you, then the 220 is the only way to go. Unless Kawa-BAL decide to magically sell the Ninja at lower than 1.5L

I agree here too..

**MavericK46** · 02-09-2009, 06:01 PM

Originally posted by Andante View Post

As for the "tantrums that you need to take care of" and "weird issues that might sneak up to you in the middle of no where", I'm not planning to go out of the city too much. And since I'm technically inclined myself, I'm sure I would be able to sort out minor issues long enough to get to a service station.

I'll bear with the issues should any arrive, every thing is a trade off at the end of the day.

Since you're forewarned and prepared to face minor niggles, the P200 will do nicely then

The 220 will surely be a hoot to ride around town..

Originally posted by Andante View Post

Oh, and for those that call me "sir" and all that, please don't. Unless you were being sarcastic.

I wasn't being sarcastic in the least. Its just that im 21 and it'd do me well to call most people sir

**46wannabe** · 02-09-2009, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by Andante View Post

All said and done, I think I'll go with my own feeling that is to get a P220 when I do get around to it (unless some thing spectacular happens with one of the other brands).

There, a decision finally! Well, all the best buddy. The P220 ain't bad then.

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