Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Thread approved.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Really nice to see that you have research in place with all the basic requirements which you are expecting from your new bike.

Used Bikes:
1. I am assuming you are a college going kid, try staying away from any used Dominar/KTM 200, 390 bikes, since they are high displacement bikes and are known to be abused a lot, so even one small things goes bad on the used bike engine, clutch, sprocket etc etc the service bills can run upwards of â‚ą10K.

2. Also even if you get a very good used bike say Dominar/KTM 390, tehy will give you maximum of 25-28km per liter and their service bills are at high side minimum of â‚ą2.5K after the free service even with 0 extra things changed and can go upto â‚ą3.5k-4k with things like brake pads and other consumables. So you should always be ready to be dependent on parents if bills run very high sometimes, this is upto to you to decide if you ok with that.

I have crossed that path, having to ask money for fuel everyday morning, coming up excuses and reason to explain why service bill became so high, sometimes even getting advised to park the bike and take the bus because getting refused to get money So piece of suggestion.

3. Since you have a limited riding experience as you have said maybe 1-2 years since you are in 20's and assuming you starting riding after getting DL or maybe 1 year before that from 17 years of so, going to 350cc+ bike used/new as of now with limited years of riding experience is not whole heartedly recommend from any experienced rider even if it has dual ABS, even though you can ride the bike, no disrespect but understanding the riding dynamics and situational awareness only comes with years of experience. Probably 250cc is the max recommended capacity of bike if you buying bike used/new.

KTRC/200 no ABS on whichever you'll find in used market and new one is close to â‚ą1.8-2L. Dominar/KTM 390 for above said reasons. CBR250 ABS spares and maintenance issues.

Maybe in the future you can look at used bikes when you start to earn, maybe even a big used 350cc+ bike when you can't afford the price of brand new one, you can take risks then since you'll be pay out of your pocket for unforeseen issues.

New Bikes:
1. Since the new mandatory ABS is rule for all bikes will be enforced from April 1st , all bikes above 125cc+ to be sold with ABS, not all companies have launched bikes with ABS yet as per the rule. Wait for it.

2. The sweet spot I would suggest is to buy a bike of 200-250cc, since you already are riding a 150cc bike and used to its power, if you again go to 150cc you might end up getting bored within 2-3years with the lack of power and it's highway performance since usually 150cc bikes tend to max out at 80-90kmph highway speed and start to vibrate a lot and need revv hard upto redline to reach anything above 100-110+ kmph. If budget is a constraint then choose something in between.

So if you stick with 200-250cc bike you will not get bored atleast for next 5-6years without again having to think of upgrade at the same time have good highway performance if you get into touring and stuff like that. They offer good mileage aswell around 35-40km per liter almost same as that of 150cc bikes. Service bills are descent not too high when compared to 350cc+ bikes.

All available choices upto 250cc range:
1) Pulsar 150cc/180cc - legendary bikes which will never die, very good spares and cheap maintenance, ABS yet to launch by this month, descent power you won't be disappointed.
2) Pulsar 220cc - Clean and simple no nonsense bike, most reliable, yet powerful and decent mileage. You can cruise on highways like a gun, ABS yet to launch by this month.
3) Pulsar NS200/RS200 - Expensive, nothing extraordinary or significant improvement compared to what you get for 150-160cc bikes like you have said, not worth that much money nearly around â‚ą1.4-1.5L.
4) Avenger 150/220/Intruder 155 - Are you even looking for these kind of seating position bikes?
4) KTM 200/250/RC200 - Nope. Not yet and expensive side.
5) FZ25 - Perfect bike making 20ps+, suited for city and highways right on sweet spot mpre suited than the NS200/RS200 even though it makes less power, only downside â‚ą1.4L and no ABS yet, LED headlights are decent.
6) R15 - Nope. Expensive.
7) Gixxer 150/SF/NS160/FZs 2.0/Fazer/X-Blade - Decent bikes but not suggested over the Hornet/new RTR 160. They both outshine the others.
8) Hero 150cc bikes/Xtreme 200 - Meh.
9) Hornet 160 - This has right balance for both looks, bulky tyre, adequate power, easy on pocket to maintain and fuel because it's a Honda and has ABS.
10)TVS new 160/new 200/old 180 - Pick either one, they offer the most power in their segment for the price you pay, adequate for all purpose. TVS 160 is the most powerful in the 150cc segment, has everything one needs.

So final to picks:
1) Pulsar 150/180, TVS old 180, TVS new 160, Hornet 160 for price of â‚ą1L-1.2L, there is nothing that can go wrong with these bikes pick either one once ABS comes on the rest, the last 2 being my personal picks
X-blade is just a old wine in new bottle, I din't like the design it's quirky, Hornet looks more matured, if you like the X-blade that's fine too personal choice.

2) Pulsar 220, RTR new 200 for â‚ą1.2L-1.3L, gunners! if you like the classic look of 220, lacks modern tech but engine is the only charm here go for it, wait for ABS. RTR 200 even comes with slipper clutch, costs less than FZ25 and makes exact same power has Fi too!

3) FZ25/RS200/R15 - If you can stretch close to â‚ą1.4L-1.5L, you won't get bored for the next 5+ years, the point which I mentioned above. Rs200 delivers for every rupee you pay, but is more tame and humble to ride than the KTM 200. FZ25 can perform and matches 80% of KTM 250 and costs cool â‚ą80K less. R15 the whole knows about this bike, no need to explain why, Yamaha are you listening ABS? R15?

4) Wildcards - KTM 125, Austrian tech, USD forks, big tyres and swing arm, 4 valves, DOHC, ABS, looks, funky! makes exact power compared to Hornet, costs only â‚ą15K more at â‚ą1.4L.

Test ride all the bikes back to back, don't buy any bike without test riding it or go just by power numbers on paper sometimes lesser powered bikes on paper perform better than higher powered bikes.
Try getting insurance from outside agent or policy bazaar, you can save upto â‚ą5K for 5years, dealers usually charge higher.

Hope it helps.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Try apache 160 4v and upcoming fz v3 ( launch on 21st january) you'll love them. These modern bikes have balance of both economy and performance. BDW, i own 2018 hornet abs, you can try hornet/xblade too.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

I'm in a similar situation. I'm 20 and I have Apache 200 which I convinced my parents to buy after a lot of struggle.

What I suggest is take rides of as many different bikes as possible. See what good and bad things you see in each bike. Then decide on a bike. If possible, take test rides. It is better to take a ride in a well maintained bike owned by a known person with 2k+ kms on odo than a TD bike in a showroom for obvious reasons.

First decide on budget. Tell your parents how much will the bike cost, the service and spares cost. Better not to go for a used bike. Mileage also is a factor but you'll sometimes have to manage out of your pocket money. Make sure that you won't skip services or the bike won't lie idle for weeks together. Don't go for anything above 250cc.
[MENTION=59090]kiran2508[/MENTION] has said almost everthing on choosing a new bike. I'll just mention a few points that I differ from. Whatever I say here is ignoring the cost factor. Take a decision based on the budget.

All 150-160cc bikes offer almost similar performance. They offer the best balance between performance and mileage. You'll be able to get 45kmpl+ in most of the cases

The 200cc bikes offer 35-40kmpl and a bit more power. The 200cc KTMs don't have performance out of the ordinary. They just have an abrupt throttle response and power delivery that can scare new riders. It is nothing that you can't get used to within a week or two.

You can go for the R15 (R15s or R15 v3) if you can spend for the bike and services. Also make sure that you can live with the aggressive riding position.

The FZ25 behaves like a bike running on a lean carb – it offers good mileage but has distinct vibes and uneasy at higher RPMs. The Duke 250 has a performance similar to the 200 but it is also more refined and has a less aggressive power delivery.

For a bike that has both carb and FI variants, go for the carbed one. The advantages of FI are not usually worth the extra cost.

For more info about a particular bike, post in the ownership threads.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Since brothers have already put up good info with explanation up there, I'll keep mine short.

1) Since you already have Pulsar 150, upgrade to atleast 200-250 cc.

2) I have Pulsar 220F that I bought on Diwali, it has really good headlight, wide and bright. I went for it as Bajaj spares are easily accessible and very affordable. And it's an old classic. Plus you get a powerful faired bike at a very good price. Maintenance is easy and even in case you find trouble in the way, it can be repaired by any small town mechanic.

3) Since you already have 150, I won't suggest Apache 160 4V, but NS/RS200 and Apache 200 4v are good options.

4) Also, get a new bike. As that way you wouldn't have the hassle of a pre-owned bike, repairs and all that. And you never know how well the bike was kept.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

First off, thank you all for the detailed responses. I have quite a few solid contenders on my list now.

I admittedly did not account for service costs for the higher end bikes and did not expect it to be that expensive either. This rules out all the 250cc+ options, which I'm perfectly fine with. And yes, I only have a year of riding experience, so you make a good point.

As for the budget, I will be covering the full upfront cost, maintenance and fuel for the motorcycle myself. My luck has been good in that I have stable income to pay for my passions. This means that my parent's opinion is limited to only two factors: safety (in the form of ABS, I suppose) and pillion comfort. As long as these two conditions are reasonably satisfied, I don't have to do the whole song and dance of convincing them. Just gotta save up, of course. This is also why my budget is quite flexible. However, I also do not want to exceed 1.4-1.5L since I plan on moving abroad in a few years and do not want to sell at a huge loss.

I've spent the morning researching all the bikes listed by @kiran2508 and I've shortlisted at least a few of them. However, I'm starting to lean towards the Apache RTR 200 and to a lesser extent, the 160. Given that the Hornet costs 1.25L with only single channel ABS and is far from the performance of the RTR 200, I'm no longer as allured to it.

Also, I had no idea the Duke 125 was launched in India, and now that I know, it intrigues me to no end. While there is no doubt it is expensive (even more so than the RTR 200), I'm really attracted to its premium build and look. The huge tyres are also a massive plus as that's what drew me in to the Hornet at the very beginning. From what I've heard, KTM is the Apple of motorcycling and I'm starting to agree with that sentiment. However, there is one thing I'm curious about. Will the maintenance costs of the Duke 125 be significantly higher than other 125/150/200 motorcycles? Furthermore, given that I'm used to an aging 150cc Pulsar, will this be a sidegrade, downgrade or minor upgrade in terms of raw performance?

I'm not at all interested in the Gixxer and R15 simply because of the pillion seat and posture respectively. They're not ideal for my height or use case, as pointed out by @ayrus. Besides, the R15 ABS will be outside my budget.

The 200NS is on my shortlist, but the extra power over the Apache is apparently better spent on touring, which is not my primary concern. Is there any other benefit to getting this? The RS200 (ABS) is once again too expensive.

Test ride concerns

I'll be straightforward. The prospect of test riding terrifies me a little. As I said in my original post, the only riding experience I have is with my 2003 Pulsar Classic. That uses a toe and heel gear shifter, whereas all the ones listed above presumably come with one-down-all-up. The concept seems alien and I don't know whether or not I can adapt to it quickly enough to test ride properly. I do not have any friends with bikes, so I have to visit the dealers directly.

Next, can anyone tell me what the standard procedure for a test ride is, since I'm extremely unfamiliar with it. I imagine that I can only ride the bike within a given area, is that right? Will an employee ride alongwith me at all times? If it is an unsupervised setting, how much time do I have before I have to return? Anything specific I should check/do?

Thank you everyone, again.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Almost everything is mentioned already. My 2 cents!

There will be very few occasions where you'll need all the power of a 150cc+ bike. Specially in a metro. I'd suggest stick to below 160cc and have test rides of Gixxer and
SZ-RR. The former will be sportier and more powerful. The later will be more comfortable and nimble!

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Update: I fell in love with the Apache RTR 200. Paid the booking amount yesterday and hope to get it soon.

Total came out to Rs. 126,000 w/o insurance (Mumbai) after haggling with Hare Krishna TVS, Goregaon. Not the biggest fan of the place and their sales team, but the alternatives are too far away/worse.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Congrats bro, hope you've opted for the ABS version.

Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

In my place at Madurai TN, Non ABS carb costs â‚ą1.20L and ABS one for â‚ą1.35L. FI for â‚ą1.34L

So I think it will be Non abs one.

If it is an ABS one, well and good.

(I’m booking a Carb ABS one tomorrow)

Edit : I missed w/o insurance part. Then it might be an ABS one. Sorry.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Congratulations buddy!

I'm 6'2 and I find the Apaches uncomfortable. I've owned a Pulsar 2004, an FZ-S 2008, a Pulsar 200NS and now I own an RS which may not sound like an upgrade but reality is much different plus I did not have a motorcycle for about past 4 years so yeah I'm happy. I took test rides for Apache, RE, FZ25 and even booked a Jawa but then considering every factor I got an RS 200.
For your new bike, I'd suggest you go through ownership thread and learn a few tricks about maintenance. A motorcycle that looks new after two years from purchase will go a long way in making you proud with its looks, reliability and performance. In case you find the knee recesses on the Apache uncomfortable like I do, try to alter your seating position and ride safe! (Don't forget to have post run-in period fun though!)

Regards,
Kunal Arora

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

I think it's must to get the insurance from the dealer itself.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

No. It’s not a mandatory one as per law.

Dealers can’t make us to take insurance from them.

Also, just now I enquired regarding the same with the TVS dealer (as I’m going to book RTR 200 Carb ABS by tomorrow).

They said, insurance is my choice.

The only thing is Insurance should be mandatorily available at the time of registration. RTO won’t register without insurance taken.

The reason I’m opting for insurance myself is I’m getting nearly 2K lesser for better plan outside.

Dealer insurance - Oriental â‚ą9,500
Period : 5 years (Mandatory by law)
1 year own damage protection and 5 year third party insurance.

Policy Bazar - United India insurance â‚ą7500
5 year own damage + 3rd party

So I’m in the idea to go with United India Insurance.

Re: Need to replace my dying 2004 Pulsar 150 DTSi; confused between used and new

Harry is right here. I'm waiting on the engine and chassis number from the dealer. Once I procure that, I can buy my insurance from any dealer. Then, I submit the insurance letter to the dealer who can begin the RTO process for me.

Sidenote, the policy bazaar price does not include GST. So the price comes to a shade above 9000. Also remember to manually set your IDV to Rs. 1,05,000 (for ABS version of this bike).

And yes, I bought the ABS version. It was a non-negotiable feature for me.

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Thank you! I like the look and feel of the RS200 too, but the RTR 200 was extremely well rounded for the price and couldn't pass it up.

I'm an inch shorter than you and did have some trouble with the knee recesses on the test ride. Moving further back made it pretty decent for me though, and it felt about the same as the NS200 I test rode prior. I plan to study the owner's manual thoroughly to learn more about break-in, etc for this motorcycle. I've been stalking the ownership thread for a few weeks already.

Quick question: The dealership is ready to deliver the bike on a temp number. Should I take it with that or wait for the perm. registration formality to be completed.