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Pulsar 150 - Rebore or new kit (180cc)?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by trace7 View Post
    @FranklySpeaking
    Just plonk the 180 cylinder, head, and piston; you will save yourself alot of time and money...
    Why do you want to change so much of it when it is advisable to just convert it to 180, or instead change the WHOLE engine!!
    It is really not practical to get the 200 or 220, what if it does'nt turn out to what you want it to be? I advise you to go for the 180 option, its just my opinion. Cheers!!
    Thanks for your opinion. Changing the cylinder-kit, head (which includes valves as well, I think) will cost at least 10K if not more. Even then, I dont know how it will perform. I am not even sure how it differs from what would have to be done in case I choose 200/220. CDI as well?

    Before getting replies on this thread, I was thinking that I will just have to change the cylinder-kit which costs about Rs. 2000 only, but now the story is a bit more clear.

    I am taking my Pulsar to Ladakh in a few days (hopefully ) and I will think over these modifications only once I am back. I may even just consider selling this off for now and buy something more powerful sometime later when I have money; may be something 250cc+.

    Comment

    • #17
      1 question, will plonking a P180 cylinder in place of the P150 cylinder too require a head change? I am not talking about the DTSi one.

      I feel this swap is easily possible. Another thing to be done is adding extra clutch plates. Carb can be swapped from a totaled bike. It should not be too costly then.
      Your biking tells a lot about the person you are!

      Comment

      • #18
        Originally posted by abhijeet080808 View Post
        1 question, will plonking a P180 cylinder in place of the P150 cylinder too require a head change? I am not talking about the DTSi one.

        I feel this swap is easily possible. Another thing to be done is adding extra clutch plates. Carb can be swapped from a totaled bike. It should not be too costly then.
        Yes, you seem to be right here. I wonder why the mechanic talked about even changing the head. I did not give it a second thought once he told me that the head itself would cost around 5K (the one with 2 spark plugs).

        If it is possible to simply replace the aging cylinder-kit of Classic 150 with that of Classic 180 and the valves (Rs. 500?) without changing the head, spending under Rs. 3000 to get better performance seems ok to me. But the question still remains, if it will improve the performance or not.

        Pulsar 180 Classic used a different carburettor? What about the ignition? Also, is there anything else that I am missing here. Because when I spoke to the Bajaj guy on phone about doing this, he said it would not improve the performance at all.

        Comment

        • #19
          Originally posted by abhijeet080808 View Post
          1 question, will plonking a P180 cylinder in place of the P150 cylinder too require a head change? I am not talking about the DTSi one.

          I feel this swap is easily possible. Another thing to be done is adding extra clutch plates. Carb can be swapped from a totaled bike. It should not be too costly then.
          I went back to the earlier page (post #8)

          Quoting from undefineme3's post:


          "Bore + piston change gives only low end torque. Unless you work on the crank, it is difficult to achieve mid range. Other alterations are clutch mods and an even cheaper mod is a large pitch 38T rear sprocket to get your mid range. But clutch ware would be more."


          One more question:

          Can more clutch plate(s) be added to the same setup? I recently changed the clutch plates (4 in number)
          Last edited by FranklySpeaking; 06-29-2010, 01:07 AM.

          Comment

          • #20
            Originally posted by FranklySpeaking View Post
            I went back to the earlier page (post #8)

            Quoting from undefineme3's post:


            "Bore + piston change gives only low end torque. Unless you work on the crank, it is difficult to achieve mid range. Other alterations are clutch mods and an even cheaper mod is a large pitch 38T rear sprocket to get your mid range. But clutch ware would be more."


            One more question:

            Can more clutch plate(s) be added to the same setup? I recently changed the clutch plates (4 in number)
            Y did you change just 4 plates? why not the whole assembly? (read: all 12 plates)

            Yes extra clutch plates can be added (to be precise only 1 and not a pair of clutch plate and pressure plate. Just the clutch plate.). It makes the clutch harder but the bike gives better response.

            EDIT: Another thing you can do is to drill holes into the clutch bell.
            Last edited by undefineme3; 06-29-2010, 07:43 AM.

            Comment

            • #21
              Originally posted by abhijeet080808 View Post
              1 question, will plonking a P180 cylinder in place of the P150 cylinder too require a head change? I am not talking about the DTSi one.

              I feel this swap is easily possible. Another thing to be done is adding extra clutch plates. Carb can be swapped from a totaled bike. It should not be too costly then.
              Ok, the only differences between the classic P150 and the classic P180 is the bore size and the gearbox. other than that everything is the same. Both of them have the same stroke length. the reason why one finds the classic P180 having more torque is this reason and another reason is the classic 180 gearbox which is out of the scope of this thread. It all comes down to this. P180 has a bigger piston than the P150.

              So yes, You plonk in the P180 classic bore+piston kit, you get all the torque from the 180 but if u need the extra speed it does, you would need the gearbox of the 180 .

              Comment

              • #22
                Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                Y did you change just 4 plates? why not the whole assembly? (read: all 12 plates)
                Well, there were 4 clutch plates and 3 pressure plates which were changed, as suggested by the mechanic. I am not sure which 12 plates you're talking about.

                Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post

                EDIT: Another thing you can do is to drill holes into the clutch bell.
                I will check what it is.

                Comment

                • #23
                  Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                  Ok, the only differences between the classic P150 and the classic P180 is the bore size and the gearbox. other than that everything is the same. Both of them have the same stroke length. the reason why one finds the classic P180 having more torque is this reason and another reason is the classic 180 gearbox which is out of the scope of this thread. It all comes down to this. P180 has a bigger piston than the P150.

                  So yes, You plonk in the P180 classic bore+piston kit, you get all the torque from the 180 but if u need the extra speed it does, you would need the gearbox of the 180 .
                  I would not worry too much about the increase in top speed, which I think will be marginal anyway (stock 150 vs stock 180). The difference would at max be 10 kmph, not more, I think, which is not much of a concern as right now the bike doesnt even go beyond 90 kmph. I will be happy if it does 110 kmph, which my stock 150 Classic could do when it was new.

                  This is what I have gathered till now:

                  1. I can change only the bore-piston kit + valves from 180 and there would be some performance boost over stock 150, although the top speed may not increase. Please correct me if this is not true.

                  2. Gearbox is different in 150 and 180. Now, can it somehow be compensated by changing the rear sprocket, if need be.

                  3. Did Classic 180 use 4 clutch plates like the 150 or it used 5?

                  4. Is the ignition same for 150 and 180 Classic?

                  Comment

                  • #24
                    Originally posted by FranklySpeaking View Post
                    Well, there were 4 clutch plates and 3 pressure plates which were changed, as suggested by the mechanic. I am not sure which 12 plates you're talking about.
                    You open up the right crank case, you would find the clutch assembly. there are clutch plates and pressure plates in them. there are 6 of each kind. so totally 12.

                    Originally posted by FranklySpeaking View Post
                    I would not worry too much about the increase in top speed, which I think will be marginal anyway (stock 150 vs stock 180). The difference would at max be 10 kmph, not more, I think, which is not much of a concern as right now the bike doesnt even go beyond 90 kmph. I will be happy if it does 110 kmph, which my stock 150 Classic could do when it was new.

                    This is what I have gathered till now:

                    1. I can change only the bore-piston kit + valves from 180 and there would be some performance boost over stock 150, although the top speed may not increase. Please correct me if this is not true.

                    Very correct.

                    2. Gearbox is different in 150 and 180. Now, can it somehow be compensated by changing the rear sprocket, if need be.

                    compensated?? in what sense? any given day, if you put in a 180s bore+piston, you will outrun the 150.

                    3. Did Classic 180 use 4 clutch plates like the 150 or it used 5?

                    ok, i dont get this. as far as i've seen, there are 6 in any pulsar. be it the 150 or the 220.

                    4. Is the ignition same for 150 and 180 Classic?

                    yes

                    Comment

                    • #25
                      Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                      You open up the right crank case, you would find the clutch assembly. there are clutch plates and pressure plates in them. there are 6 of each kind. so totally 12.

                      Thank a lot for the reply.

                      Pulsar Classic 150 has 4 clutch plates and uses 3 pressure plates. I am sure about the number of clutch plates and I think the pressure plates are sandwiched between the clutch plates, so they would be 3. I have old clutch plates/pressure plates lying with me. So, I would check and post back.

                      Comment

                      • #26
                        Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                        Ok, the only differences between the classic P150 and the classic P180 is the bore size and the gearbox. other than that everything is the same. Both of them have the same stroke length. the reason why one finds the classic P180 having more torque is this reason and another reason is the classic 180 gearbox which is out of the scope of this thread. It all comes down to this. P180 has a bigger piston than the P150.

                        So yes, You plonk in the P180 classic bore+piston kit, you get all the torque from the 180 but if u need the extra speed it does, you would need the gearbox of the 180 .
                        The carb is different. And AFAIK, only the 1st gear ratio is different, rest all same.

                        Originally posted by FranklySpeaking View Post
                        I would not worry too much about the increase in top speed, which I think will be marginal anyway (stock 150 vs stock 180). The difference would at max be 10 kmph, not more, I think, which is not much of a concern as right now the bike doesnt even go beyond 90 kmph. I will be happy if it does 110 kmph, which my stock 150 Classic could do when it was new.

                        This is what I have gathered till now:

                        1. I can change only the bore-piston kit + valves from 180 and there would be some performance boost over stock 150, although the top speed may not increase. Please correct me if this is not true.

                        2. Gearbox is different in 150 and 180. Now, can it somehow be compensated by changing the rear sprocket, if need be.

                        3. Did Classic 180 use 4 clutch plates like the 150 or it used 5?

                        4. Is the ignition same for 150 and 180 Classic?
                        The changes for you -

                        1. New piston/bore
                        2. New carb
                        3. New sprocket (maybe!)
                        4. Additional clutch plates

                        Rest of the parts should be ditto same.
                        Your biking tells a lot about the person you are!

                        Comment

                        • #27
                          Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                          You open up the right crank case, you would find the clutch assembly. there are clutch plates and pressure plates in them. there are 6 of each kind. so totally 12.
                          I'm sorry, its my mistake. the classic 180 has 5 pressure and 5 clutch plates. I apologize for this mistake.

                          Comment

                          • #28
                            Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                            I'm sorry, its my mistake. the classic 180 has 5 pressure and 5 clutch plates. I apologize for this mistake.
                            Hummm.... wonder where you got that from. anyways Mr.undefineme3. I am also looking for ways to increase power in my classic 180, can you help me?
                            HYPERTHRUST CLEARED AND COUNTING
                            5.....4.....3....2.....1
                            sigpic

                            Comment

                            • #29
                              Originally posted by FranklySpeaking View Post
                              I may even just consider selling this off for now and buy something more powerful sometime later when I have money; may be something 250cc+.
                              I like the way you think. Its a good idea, and even better in terms of practicallity!! Just rebore and sell it (saving you a lot of money), we will be waiting for your next bike!!

                              Comment

                              • #30
                                Originally posted by abhijeet080808 View Post
                                The carb is different. And AFAIK, only the 1st gear ratio is different, rest all same.



                                The changes for you -

                                1. New piston/bore
                                2. New carb
                                3. New sprocket (maybe!)
                                4. Additional clutch plates

                                Rest of the parts should be ditto same.
                                Can more clutch plates/pressure plates be added to the same clutch case, without any modifications?


                                Originally posted by undefineme3 View Post
                                I'm sorry, its my mistake. the classic 180 has 5 pressure and 5 clutch plates. I apologize for this mistake.

                                I have confirmed that 150 Classic has 4 clutch plates and 3 pressure plates. Dont know about the Classic 180. If there are 5 clutch plates in Classic 180, shouldnt it have 4 pressure plates then? In my bike, they are used alternatively; pressure plates placed between every 2 clutch plates.

                                CP - PP - CP - PP - CP - PP - CP

                                where CP = Clutch plate and PP = Pressure Plate.


                                Originally posted by trace7 View Post
                                I like the way you think. Its a good idea, and even better in terms of practicallity!! Just rebore and sell it (saving you a lot of money), we will be waiting for your next bike!!
                                I will not even rebore it if I make my mind to sell it off. It runs like a charm with no signs of any major problem; no smoke or anything. The only thing is that it would not go beyond 90-95 kmph anymore but that could be because of aged-valves.

                                I was thinking about making these changes to keep it as a second bike. And, there no new bike in the near-sight for now as I have just spent all my savings in buying a new RE Standard 350 a few months back; may be a good powerful bike, 250 cc or may be even a 600 but that would be after a few years at least.

                                Comment

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