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Helmet minus ISI mark? Be prepared to pay a fine

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  • #31
    The below info is taken from a Google Document provided by a government related site which is http://www.aerb.gov.in (now extinct). It explains Crash helmets as per the Indian Government requirement for the standard ISI 4151:

    Reliability, I'm not sure about, but it shouldn't be fake. Who'll fake all this info up and for what reason? Anyways, the source is below so you can check it for yourself:

    Google Docs Source: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...2dejx8WctKv5lQ
    ---
    Brotherhood, Rules, Freedom. Xbhp.
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    • #32
      Talk is good, but we should bombard the Mumbai Traffic Police facebook page and also their feedback form:

      Facebook पर पोस्ट, फ़ोटो और बहुत कुछ देखें.


      Mumbai Traffic Police

      I have already posted/sent feedback to these links. I don't live in Mumbai, but I find this rule silly.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Samarth_M View Post
        Also, if someone could please post exactly what specifications ISI 4151 (for crash helmets) requires, I'd be grateful. Googling hasn't turned up anything and I'd like to compare it with what's given for DOT and Snell, which is available online.
        Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post
        Also i guess when the ECE/DOT uses a specifically pointed metal object to test Visor penetration ISI uses a pen ball point!
        We should really document these points and approach the Govt.
        Smoke rubber,not tobacco.

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        • #34
          it was announced in crystal clear words that we should use helmet,and should only use the helmets that have isi standards

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Samarth 619 View Post
            The below info is taken from a Google Document provided by a government related site which is Atomic Energy Regulatory Board (now extinct). It explains Crash helmets as per the Indian Government requirement for the standard ISI 4151:



            Reliability, I'm not sure about, but it shouldn't be fake. Who'll fake all this info up and for what reason? Anyways, the source is below so you can check it for yourself:

            Google Docs Source: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...2dejx8WctKv5lQ
            If you look carefully you'll see that the list of features is incomplete. It only refers to those as being 'salient features', and therefore the implication is that the list is incomplete. I'd already come across this particular doc but it's not comprehensive.

            Anyway, DNA has done an update on this issue:

            ISI-marked-helmet diktat leaves superbikers stranded
            Akshay Deshmane
            The traffic department's recent crackdown on motorists, who do not wear helmets certified by the Indian Standards Institute (ISI), has left the superbike riders worried.
            Ever since the drive began, the superbikers are facing the ire of traffic police as their imported helmets, which have been certified by the American Department of Transportation (DOT), do not bear the ISI logo and the DOT logo is often not recognised or understood by them.
            The superbikers are now planning to approach senior officials of the traffic department to seek a solution for their problem. "Even after spending thousands of rupees for buying these helmets, we are being seen as violators," said a superbike owner.
            After Mumbai Police Commissioner Arup Patnaik issued a circular directing the traffic department to crackdown on motorists for not using ISI-marked helmets, the traffic department began a drive on November 29.
            At least, 1, 247 riders have been booked for not wearing helmets, while 643 have been booked for wearing helmets without the ISI logo.
            Debashish Ghosh of the Harley Owners India, an informal group of Harley Davidson riders in the city, said: "Ever since the drive began, I have been told by many riders in the superbikers community in the city that the traffic officials are not aware about the DOT standards and thus treating them as violators. Many have had a hard time dealing with the cops."
            Amit Bajla, another Harley Davidson rider and a resident of Worli, said: "The initiative (of making better quality ISI helmets mandatory) is good and we support the use of good quality safety gears, especially helmets, by the riders. However, if they can allow foreign-made bikes, then why not helmets? Riders are spending lakhs on superbikes and also invest tens of thousands for purchasing imported helmets. They should not be seen as violators."
            It could not be independently verified if the superbike riders have been penalised since the drive of November 29 began. However, the supebike riders say that the officials should treat those having DOT or other imported safety certifications on their helmets, on par with those having ISI certification.
            Vijay Jain whose racing unit, Wheelieboy Racing, organised the "Ride for Safety-Helmet Ride" of over 150 superbikers , concurred with the riders. "We welcome the police's efforts at ensuring that quality helmets are used by riders. Superbikers today promoted a similar message in the rally. However, DOT is a better standard than the ISI and it should also be accepted by the police," said Jain.
            DCP Nisar Tamboli, the official spokesperson for the Mumbai Police, said: "Our officials will go by the local laws. If they feel they are being penalised for a wrong reason, they should meet the DCP Traffic."
            ACP(traffic) Brijesh Singh said, "I cannot comment on this issue without studying it in detail."

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            • #36
              Originally posted by RanjithMN View Post
              Also i guess when the ECE/DOT uses a specifically pointed metal object to test Visor penetration ISI uses a pen ball point!
              We should really document these points and approach the Govt.
              Both the DOT and Snell specifications run int 700+ pages. Assuming what's posted here is the complete ISI specifications, it's not even 2-3 pages.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Digital_shubhi View Post
                They keep finding new ways to earn money...
                +100... Totally agreed.

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                • #38
                  Ignorance or misplaced pride can create one hellova mess.

                  For one, the notion about public safety by police would be laughable, considering they don't wear helmets.

                  It should be no surprise that lawmakers are ignorant about international safety standard as it very likely that they are also ignorant about safety of ISI as well. Being aware of the name ISI does not count.

                  I hope the law comes about with a solution soon as both my helmets does not bear ISI markings. And I'm not prepared to purchase a poorer quality helmet just to avoid getting fined. That is akin to riders putting on helmet when people approach traffic signals. Currently I have no confidence in ISI standard as I have seen some helmets where the quality is so pathetic that it begs the question whether they are actually passed though quality checks or rather the standard is so low. To be fair, I have also seen pretty good ISI helmets as well. Though the quality range seems to be so huge that one wonders.

                  Apart from safety, the looks counts as well. And currently there is very little to choose from helmets with ISI markings. Maybe, if push comes to shove, and apparently I will loose in this case. I might as well pick up the cheapest and smallest ISI helmet available on the market. Use it while crossing traffic hotspots, and change them after crossing
                  Last edited by kaynmantis; 12-05-2011, 12:00 PM.

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                  • #39
                    Guys,
                    I guess you are critisizing the police too much. The commissioner who passed this diktat, did so with good intentions in mind. He may not be aware of the fact that there are few people who buy expensive imported helmet which confirms to the same safety standard which an ISI approved helmet does. I guess, it will be better if someone sincerely tries to approach this police officer & educate/make him aware of this fact too.

                    The govt should ban the sale & manufacture of these local helmets which doesn't confirm to the BIS regulations.
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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Samarth_M View Post
                      If you look carefully you'll see that the list of features is incomplete. It only refers to those as being 'salient features', and therefore the implication is that the list is incomplete. I'd already come across this particular doc but it's not comprehensive.


                      DCP Nisar Tamboli, the official spokesperson for the Mumbai Police, said: "Our officials will go by the local laws. If they feel they are being penalised for a wrong reason, they should meet the DCP Traffic."
                      ACP(traffic) Brijesh Singh said, "I cannot comment on this issue without studying it in detail."
                      The specification is not only incomplete, it is outdated. The BIS first helmet specification was introduced in 1987 (if my memory is right) and thereafter it was revised in 1993 (what is listed). Subsequently, the specification was revised in 1998. The specification along with supplemental changes are available at the BIS website (BIS Home Page) for download for a payment of Rs. 300/-

                      DCP Nisar Tamboli should select his words carefully. If he claims that the officials will go by the local laws, let him and his officials first ensure that each and every traffic rule is observed in the town. The traffic in this town is a mess!!!


                      Originally posted by rx100.7050 View Post
                      Guys,
                      I guess you are critisizing the police too much. The commissioner who passed this diktat, did so with good intentions in mind. He may not be aware of the fact that there are few people who buy expensive imported helmet which confirms to the same safety standard which an ISI approved helmet does. I guess, it will be better if someone sincerely tries to approach this police officer & educate/make him aware of this fact too.
                      Criticizing the police too much!!!! Errr, I think not!!! We bikers are soft targets. Ever seen a Benz or Audi or for that matter even Maruti Alto being stopped at Naka Bhadi??? Ever seen a car stopped for its PUC certificate??? Ever seen a car being stopped for its insurance certificate??? Most of the time its bikers who are harassed!!! Does the police want to say all illegal activities and their suspects travel by bikes only???
                      Only a biker knows why a dog sticks his head out of a car window.

                      Multum in Parvo - Much in Little

                      "Yes, it is FAST! No, you CAN'T ride it!" - http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/general-...a-300-san.html

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by abhimanyu31 View Post
                        Criticizing the police too much!!!! Errr, I think not!!! We bikers are soft targets. Ever seen a Benz or Audi or for that matter even Maruti Alto being stopped at Naka Bhadi??? Ever seen a car stopped for its PUC certificate??? Ever seen a car being stopped for its insurance certificate??? Most of the time its bikers who are harassed!!! Does the police want to say all illegal activities and their suspects travel by bikes only???
                        With you all the way...and back . I use both car and bike. The discrimination against two wheelers is appalling. Never been pulled up while driving my car. Several times being pulled up while riding my bike. Same dude. Sometimes I take out my car deliberately when there is checking. Besides its not merely the discrimination against two wheelers that frustrate me, it their hypocritical stand of not wearing helmets themselves and has the audacity to say "Our officials will go by the local laws". Bring tears to my eyes. such dedication. .

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by luvufoevaa
                          i have a cross helmet.. its ISO certified.. wanna noe ki still d cops can fine me 4 dis Cross helmets ?
                          ISO & ISI are different standards, yes you can be fined.

                          please do not use SMS language in xBhp.
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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by rx100.7050 View Post
                            Guys,
                            The commissioner who passed this diktat, did so with good intentions in mind.
                            Could be,and if it is then god bless him but...

                            Originally posted by rx100.7050 View Post
                            He may not be aware...
                            there you go,he has no right to pass laws if he isnt aware of the things related to it!

                            the law should be "Meets or Exceeds ISI Standards"
                            Smoke rubber,not tobacco.

                            -Life Through-the-Lens
                            -For HELLA/VALEO [BMW/AUDI/FORD/LINCOLN/SKODA],P220,Aftermarket Projectors,pls contact me!

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by RanjithMN View Post
                              Could be,and if it is then god bless him but...


                              there you go,he has no right to pass laws if he isnt aware of the things related to it!

                              the law should be "Meets or Exceeds ISI Standards"
                              but how to ensure that a particular helmet exceeds ISI standards, just because it is SNELL or DOT approved.

                              that is the problem. different countries don't trust each other in terms of standards, unless the countries have an official agreement.
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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by princesirohi View Post
                                but how to ensure that a particular helmet exceeds ISI standards, just because it is SNELL or DOT approved.
                                Not just because its SNELL (I will not mention DOT as it is a U.S. Government Body Standard), but because the SNELL standard is truly world leading. SNELL is a non profit and non government organization. It has no vested interest in politics, business (helmet manufactures) or bureaucratic matters. It is a truly arms length testing body.

                                As to your question on how to ensure it exceeds the ISI just compare the both the standards and it becomes pretty apparent that its a far superior standard to ISI. Also note that not all helmets from the same manufacturer (for example AGV) are SNELL certified. In fact, SNELL standard is considered one of the most demanding in the world and has been criticized by helmet manufactures and 'experts' as being almost impossible to achieve and impractical.
                                Only a biker knows why a dog sticks his head out of a car window.

                                Multum in Parvo - Much in Little

                                "Yes, it is FAST! No, you CAN'T ride it!" - http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/general-...a-300-san.html

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