Engine Oils

[madhav krishna]

sir, I used to think that this sulphated ash deposits will only occur if oil gets burned.. Or am I missing something?? And is there any benefit of having sulphated ash in engine oil? Thanks in advance!

The sulfated ash provides a much superior protection to the piston rings. Its helps the engine in the long run. Maybe PSR'jee can shed more light on this.

[muztariq]

Thanks Muztariq! Actually the usage was less until a few days back... From now onwards it is going to be pretty high.. Which engine oil should I go with then?

Another small doubt .... as the recommended engine oil for P135 is 20W50, would Motul 7100 not be a better choice over Motul 300V??

You can use any xxW50 in place of 20w50 oil. 300v is the best. is costlier by 250 rs than 7100 which costs around 750 INR

The sulfated ash provides a much superior protection to the piston rings. Its helps the engine in the long run. Maybe PSR'jee can shed more light on this.

Sulphated ash is nothing but the amount of residue which will be left if you ignite any compound much above its flash point. oil companies add ZDDP and other inorganic compounds to oil.. if you ignite oil, the inorganic mass which would be some heavy metals, zinc and phosphorus compounds and other dissolved impurities in oil will constitute the sulphated ash.

In JASO standards there is a limit for sulphated ash. One just cant keep adding ZDDP and other stuff to oil otherwise the oil will fail in this test.

[madhav krishna]

You can use any xxW50 in place of 20w50 oil. 300v is the best. is costlier by 250 rs than 7100 which costs around 750 INR



Sulphated ash is nothing but the amount of residue which will be left if you ignite any compound much above its flash point. oil companies add ZDDP and other inorganic compounds to oil.. if you ignite oil, the inorganic mass which would be some heavy metals, zinc and phosphorus compounds and other dissolved impurities in oil will constitute the sulphated ash.

In JASO standards there is a limit for sulphated ash. One just cant keep adding ZDDP and other stuff to oil otherwise the oil will fail in this test.

[/QUOTE] This should be not surprising as Mercedes was among the first to differentiate oils according to longevity (1980s to 1990). In personal vehicles is a general oil change interval given by oil specification: 228.1 – 15000 km, 228.3 – 30000 km, 228.5 – 45000 km. (Similar rule applies to the MB 229.xx) Oil certified for the longest change interval also had the best antioxidative properties and stability. Certain BP Vanellus oil certified for MB228.5 standard had sulfated ash content around 2%, thus providing superior piston ring protection as a side-effect. Such oils were originally marketed for heavy trucking use (100000 miles change interval) and other "long life" oils are likely to be of similar grade. [/QUOTE]

Motor oil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

BTW just came to know that ZDDP was actually invented by castrol.

[jenimu_kanna007]

Best oil for pulsar 200ns

[mayank.travadi]

No, you can change to FS anytime after 1000 kms. If the usage is less than 4000 km in 6 months, just use SS oils like Motul 5100 15w50 and change every 2500 kms/4 months. That would be enough.

If the usage is extensive with frequent high rpm rides.. nothing can beat Motul 300V 15w50 in performance.

I beg to differ...A new bike shouldnt be used with FS oil so soon as 1000km on the odo...it prolongs running in...its too slippery for all components to set in...
Everywhere i have read...shift to FS only after some good kms on the odo...

[ynike99]

I want to change oil in my duke.Thing is, bajaj semisynthetic oil doesnt last more than 1-1.5k and motul is expensive because my running between drain intervals is just 2-2.5k kms. suggest me some oil with specs (20w50,api sg, jaso ma1/ma2).Mineral/semisynthetic/synthetic doesnt matter.Should be available in mumbai.Thanks.

[muztariq]

[/QUOTE]This should be not surprising as Mercedes was among the first to differentiate oils according to longevity (1980s to 1990). In personal vehicles is a general oil change interval given by oil specification: 228.1 – 15000 km, 228.3 – 30000 km, 228.5 – 45000 km. (Similar rule applies to the MB 229.xx) Oil certified for the longest change interval also had the best antioxidative properties and stability. Certain BP Vanellus oil certified for MB228.5 standard had sulfated ash content around 2%, thus providing superior piston ring protection as a side-effect. Such oils were originally marketed for heavy trucking use (100000 miles change interval) and other "long life" oils are likely to be of similar grade.

Motor oil - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

BTW just came to know that ZDDP was actually invented by castrol. [/QUOTE]

Sulfated ash is a chemical test. I know it much much better than many people here. Any chemistry student will tell you what it is. It is not an XYZ amount of substance added in oil to make it better.

This test not only applies to chemicals etc. This is a vital part of the medicines you buy and use routinely.

Most of the compounds marketted in the world has a limit for Sulphated Ash Value. It determines its purity. There is a book called Pharmacopoeia. US has it, Britain has it, WHO has it.. even India has it!! (though its a ditto copy of British Pharmacopoeia, but neverthless). This book contains nearly all medicines which are marketed in the country and identifies the test which needs to be performed to prove that the medicine is as per the COUNTRY'S standard. Here is an except from the US pharmacopoiea (poor chinese copy of it)

General Chapters: <281> RESIDUE ON IGNITION

Now bring two three medicines you have in your house and read its label.. The medicine name will read something like this -

Paracetamol IP..... 500 mg
Ibuprofen BP ....... 400 mg
Metronidazole USP.... 350 mg

IP BP USP is nothing but Indian, British or US Pharmacopoiea.. If you search a little hard, you may even find my name on some patents of Metronidazole..

http://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2012075015&recNum=4&docAn=US2011062406&queryString=FP:%28dr.%20reddy%27s%29&maxRec=493

I beg to differ...A new bike shouldnt be used with FS oil so soon as 1000km on the odo...it prolongs running in...its too slippery for all components to set in...
Everywhere i have read...shift to FS only after some good kms on the odo...

I would say never use FS if mineral is performing good.. but if someone wants to, 1000 km is sufficient.
Modern cars are coming factory filled with FS oils.. how many kms would the company run the engine to put in FS.
Its a controversial topic.. and we may spend years debating it. my suggestion would be 1000 km.

[psr]

Sulphated Ash is preferably to be maintained below 1% in Gasoline powered engine's oil ...This is because, it can kill Catcon ,and if, get deposited on the Valves , prevent proper valve sealing , and deposit on the exhaust valve, will increase it's operating temperature , leading to damage.While this was not a bone of contention in older engines with lower compression and lower RPM, modern engines with higher >9:1 compression and high revving nature, will not be able operate in safe area of design, with the sulphated ash coating....
Engines, whose design remain the same from 90s will suffer if adequate ZDDP is not present in the engine oil .,esp ., engines with flat shoe Rockers...Rocker arms with rollers like the RTR, CBR etc., are immune to cam and Rocker wear due to lack of ZDDP....
Otherwise the cam and Rockers must have high case hardening process done to prevent wear with modern Gasoline engine oils.

[psr]

Two days back I took the bike on the highway to test acceleration, vibes,and feel of the Rimula R3X engine oil...I must say that I am more than satisfied with the result.
The bike accelerated very well, vibes were attenuated(better than with motul 3000)and touching 90~100 kmph was without any strain...all along the bike never showed signs of any abnormal heating...the clutch engaging and dis-engaging had become sharp,and no slip was noticed even with sudden acceleration,and gear shifts are like never before
It has become easy to find the Neutral,and gear changes are smooth and with a firm click....There is no change in the color of the spark Plug or FE.

I would not advice anybody to draw any conclusion and I am merely sharing the info of my experiments with the Shell Rimula R3X Diesel engine oil in my ZMA

[Aditya N Bharadwaj]

What would happen if two engine oils of the same brand and same grade but different type (like SS and FS) are mixed? Any effects on the internal parts of the engine?

[B7ACKTHORN]

What would happen if two engine oils of the same brand and same grade but different type (like SS and FS) are mixed? Any effects on the internal parts of the engine?

SS and FS aren't that different inherently, and it should do any harm whatsoever! But wrong grades, for example one brand of lower grade with a different grade of another brand, wouldn't stall the engine, but you notice harshness or the engine struggling to make use of it.

Cheers!
VJ

[psr]

What would happen if two engine oils of the same brand and same grade but different type (like SS and FS) are mixed? Any effects on the internal parts of the engine?

Mixing two different types of oil(SS,FS) is acceptable so long as their grades are same...using thicker oils will make it difficult for the internals to move and so acceleration and FE will become lower.
A thinner oil on the other hand may not have enough film strength to keep the moving parts separated .
There is a school of thought that believes strictly in not mixing oils at all ,and then there are moderates who think it is acceptable...
Ultimately, ensure there is good oil of adequate quantity in the engine....it will do more good,than not having it.

[Aditya N Bharadwaj]

SS and FS aren't that different inherently, and it should do any harm whatsoever! But wrong grades, for example one brand of lower grade with a different grade of another brand, wouldn't stall the engine, but you notice harshness or the engine struggling to make use of it.

Cheers!
VJ

Mixing two different types of oil(SS,FS) is acceptable so long as their grades are same...using thicker oils will make it difficult for the internals to move and so acceleration and FE will become lower.
A thinner oil on the other hand may not have enough film strength to keep the moving parts separated .
There is a school of thought that believes strictly in not mixing oils at all ,and then there are moderates who think it is acceptable...
Ultimately, ensure there is good oil of adequate quantity in the engine....it will do more good,than not having it.

Thanks to both! I mixed 300v and 5100, 300v being the one in far lesser quantity, and of course, both of grade 15w50. Planning to use this for about 2.5k more kms by which my engine's settling in will be over.

[vineeshvv]

Best Engine Oil For my 6 year old CBZ Xtreme ???

[B7ACKTHORN]

Best Engine Oil For my 6 year old CBZ Xtreme ???

Shell AX7.

Thanks to both! I mixed 300v and 5100, 300v being the one in far lesser quantity, and of course, both of grade 15w50. Planning to use this for about 2.5k more kms by which my engine's settling in will be over.

Great. Do let us know the results.

Cheers!
VJ