Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?


the question is relevant. you failed to understand the question.

this particular question, or rather a statement is not about product quality but rather about brand value and brand recognition.

A renowned brand is much less likely to play with quality for short term benefits.

and the example of ferrari car being sold on websites is entirely irrelevant, ferrari cars are not sold on ebay or similar website, whereas helmets are.



this is not wrong assumption, it seems you are assuming without even discussing that MT Helmets we get in India meet ECE and DOT certification.

btw, i was raising concern over DOT certification and not ECE certification.




Again, you are wrong, i quoted three major & leading online riding gear resellers, and all of them have "Shark" Brand helmet.

kindly check yourself.

i am not talking about hundreds of other online shops, i am talking about the three leading ones.

kindly check before quoting.


again an irrelevant example, still i will reply.

(1) You can find Dacia Duster mentioned on the website of Renault, where is the mention of Zoan or Shox helmets on MT website??
(2) Dacia has a website of its own, where is the website of Shox??
(3) and Dacia Duster Website is befitting the product well, whereas, look at Zoan Website, you will get the idea.



yes i have heard the term logistics, and know a few things about it. Kindly have a look at the map given on the website of MT Helmets of locations it sells MT helmets in, and plot the manufacturing locations on it. you will understand the logistics yourself.

what is the point in manufacturing at three locations so close by- china, taiwan and hongkong.



i am not speculating about anything, if you let the product representative answer the queries, what seems like broken pieces of puzzle may come together.

[MENTION=29015]Sunnyside_up![/MENTION] it is my sincere request to kindly answer all my queries.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

How did you come to the conclusion about a renowned brand is much less likely to play with quality? From LS2 example?

We are NOT discussing brand value and/or recognition. We are only talking about product quality. What is so difficult about that?

I am not assuming anything. I am simply saying that generic assumptions should not be entered into. I clearly said that if the company and/or distributor is willing to share certification details, there is nothing wrong. If they are not willing to share, there IS something wrong.



I was wrong here.


May be my computer is faulty but I don't see any Dacia / duster on Renault UK site.


How does this affect product quality? Aren't we discussing whether a product quality is as per its claims?

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

How can you find duster on renault uk website if its being sold in uk as dacia duster?? you can find it on dacia uk website.

however, point to note is that dacia has a website and a good one, and renault does mention about dacia duster on renault.com, its global website.

SO,....

can you find the mention of Zoan, Shox or Axxis model on the website of MT helmets.??

or does Shox have a website?

i will now wait [MENTION=29015]Sunnyside_up![/MENTION] to reply to all the queries raised till now.

----consecutive posts auto-merged-----

Ah, btw, i have finally succeeded to access and look at the ECE certification.

just a curiosity, does it not need an actual signature by pen, or is it digitally signed ?

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?



Did I not mention this earlier? Please try and read what I have posted before commenting.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

Ferrari in Cars & Trucks | eBay

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

I really did not get what you are saying.


I guess we are discussing brand new products and not second hand ones....


Now can we discuss MT helmets instead of ferrari and duster dacia..??

Sent from my A210 using Tapatalk 2

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

I had specifically written that Duster is being sold that as Dacia and is not found on Renault website. You claimed that Dacia Duster is mentioned on Renault website. I sent a screenshot of Renault UK site showing that Duster is not mentioned. What is there not to understand?

This is how generalised statements work. You had mentioned Instead of generalised statements, specific questions about product quality would result in much more progress.

I am out of this discussion for good. I am NOT looking at this thread or replying here anymore.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

I think this thread has lost all of its focus and has mostly useless information.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

i had replied to your example of duster dacia related to MT helmets, which according to me was not related.

i said duster dacia is on renault website and not renault uk.

anyway lets discuss MT helmets only .

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

Guys OFF TOPIC,EVEN FORD ECOSPORT WHICH IS A TOP SELLER IN INDIA HAS TWO QUALITIES,IN INDIA WE DONT GET THE TOP NOTCH PLASTIC QUALITY LIKE THE EUROPEAN ECOSPORT EVEN THE KTMS IN INDIA MOST OF THEM ARE LOCALISED,SO ITS NOT JUST THE HELMETS COMPANY'S PLAYING WITH THE QUALITY FOR THE INDIAN MARKET

----consecutive posts auto-merged-----

The discussion we are having here is whether MT helmets indeed are Ece or dot certified,the one we get in India,and they haven't marketed their product with the sharp ratings,if ls2 too wouldn't have marketed their products with sharp ratings,the point of discussion qould have remained whether ls2 indeed are ece approved the one we get here,even Vega nexx who have started their launch are offering 15 percent off on online orders but havent mentioned the sharp rating as the product has got 3 stars,

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

I seriously pity the genuine contributors of the thread. Loss of genuine information transfer because few people want to stick their heads out and ask for everything under the sun.
@Sunnyside_up! : thanks for clarifying the relevant details. Kindly do not ignore to share some genuine information for the benefit of others, as you have already been doing. On a lighter note, people henceforth might even ask for your IT returns to claim that SPG is associated with genuine stuffs, be prepared

Few things told just for comparison need not be taken to the literal meaning and. People need to understand that not all products be listed on websites around need not be the epitome of Quality and nor the unlisted ones are in abyss of the Quality chart. It takes time, irrespective of the brand to have it on their website(if at all they have one). For example: there are lots of brands(For simplicity, let me use FMCG/Apparel) which you might not find on any prominent websites but easily available in your closest Super Market/Big Bazaar, . Here is where the commercial aspects come into picture. Websites/Multi brand outlets(Like Big Bazaar/Metro) charge a bomb for stocking/Supplying the products, which may/ may not be financially viable option for the manufacturer. It definitely doesn't mean the Quality is inferior. But yeah, appearance on some websites helps people relate to the product. As Vishwas said about the number of Heingeriche/Buffallo/Forcefield products available online(on motorcycle websites) is very less, Comparatively. I have personally seen the Quality of the products mentioned and its comendable. There might be many more products which Im not aware of also but exceed multi folds when it comes to quality. In fact came to know about Force field only few years back when Sunny himself was testing it out and Suggested me to buy one. Also Heingeriche and Buffalo were unheard to me, till few friends for this Forum itself bought it. Same case with Spartan products. Not many knew the existence of the product, now its least a household name, in biking circles in India.

Bothered to write this up, as I have front line experience of over enthusiastic/aggressive customers asking for the best in Quality and for the price of peanuts(Thank God if they even have least plans to buy it). At least its good if the customer buys, than somebody who spends a week in asking from your grandparents birthplace to your great grandchildren's school still doesn't buy the product. Though you might have the satisfaction of introducing the product and highlighting salient features, some times it feels you have not fruitfully utilized your time in the process.

In case you find me wrong in whatever i said/ add something in benefit of the tread, Sunny please do let me know.

So requesting everybody to stay with the actual purpose of the thread, than displaying personal intellect the other way .

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

@princesirohi

Ok, so I haven't even tried on an MT and am no way an expert when it comes to Helmets.

BUT

It's just that the logical fallacies in this thread gave me a massive headache and sorry to say, is a textbook example of an incorrect assumption that 'Correlation = Causation'.

* The website is bad so the product must be bad
* My Grandma knows about Vega helmets but not MT. So logically it must be bad
* It's know by different names in different countries. So it must be bad
* I can't buy it available online from a famous US/UK store. So it must be bad

I don't even...

So anyway,

You laid the burden of proof on SPG to show you documents regarding the legitimateness of the brand and they have come forward to do that. I am really failing to see how you missed that.
If I were you, I'd just go down to the SPG office and take a look at the relevant documents myself.

As consumers we are entitled to these things and SPG is willing to do that. So what's the problem here? If even after that, you're not satisfied just don't buy the product. It's a free market bro!

So, if *anyone* can put stickers and you as a consumer have no means of verifying this certification by yourself, by extension it follows that all the helmets manufacture out there are likely to be fake. Now, take a moment in pondering through your fallacy here.
(This is the one of the reasons that the brands publish their documents for the general public and MT has done that)

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Guess what, DOT works on the honor system where the onus is on the manufacturer to do the tests. It's called a 'standard' for a reason. Standards which companies can *choose* to follow. They, of course, publish the relevent results but there really is no way to verify these tests unless you have the equipment yourself. Someone please correct me as I may be mis-informed with this regard.

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So? Brand awareness != Quality. Given how the thread veered away a few posts back, I am not even going to try and post the innumerable examples that defy this statement.




Or, you know, maybe they don't care about online orders. Hell, I don't even know these helmet brands and that's one logical conclusion that I could come up with easily.

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My jaw dropped to the floor reading this. Maybe the CEO has a close friend in the taiwan factory who saved his life once and he agreed to let the Taiwanese gentleman manufacture the helmet from his factory as a sign of friendship and gratitude. Trust me, I could come up with infinite number of stories but I'd still reserve my judgement on this until I know the truth.

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THe only sure fire way is to get the testing equipment yourself and do the tests. But the helmet will be demolished anyways so you'd probably get another helmet of the same type. But what's the guarantee that this particular object has some manufacturing defect and ad infinitum? All tests are done on a small sample. It is possible, however unlikely, that the DOT/Snell/ECE certified expensive helmet you just bought to have a manufacturing defect which wouldn't even crop up until you get into a crash.

I'd like to emphasize that as riders whenever we buy some gear, we take a leap of faith placing trust in these products and that's where certifications come into play. It's a label that says
"A few items of this particular model has been tested and has passed to our satisfaction. We hope that it's true for the entire supply, but there is a 1% probability that some of them may have defects that can likely endanger you."

Take a leap of faith, or just move on to the next brand that you think will likely save your bottom in en event of a (god forbid) mishap.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

It is really sad and unfortunate that the thread has lost its focus.

without quoting anyone, i would like to emphasize that i asked questions which i felt relevant, the company representative could have either replied or said that he does not want to comment since he does not feel it is relevant.

it is really bizzare that ppl have jumped in to counter question, without even giving the company representative any chance to reply.

things have been blown out of preportion by comparisons from ferrari to big baazar. which is definitely not right.

i never asked anybody's IT returns or grandparent's birthday. everything i asked was related to MT helmets only.

So, plz don't try to defend someone, without giving him a chance to answer. each and everything i asked was related to MT Helmets only.

and if i can ask some really hard questions to one brand, i can also ask it other brand also.

i never said that product is bad because website is bad, i was just pointing out a problem.

and i didn't missed any document, initially i was having difficulty accessing it, so i asked, if it can be e-mailed, later on i was able to download it and i have posted it also, so plz read the thread and then reply.

buying a helmet myself and testing it myself is no way to check its quality.

and yes websites are important, in today's age, websites are the face of a company and no good company neglects its website.


infact internet is the biggest medium of knowledge sharing, in today's age.

regarding popularity of a particular brand, what is wrong to accept that a particular brand is not as popular as some other brands, a brand may be less popular but still can have good quality products, but we need to verify it, and that is what we tried to do here.

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Certain things i would like to summarize --

Sunny has shared the ECE certification of MT Axxis Helmet, and we thank him for that.

he has shared weight measurement, to which i will not comment till i get an oppurtunity to measure it myself.

he has also shown the MRP sticker, which is a good thing, and we thank him for that.

I said that MT helmets is less popular brand as compared to some other helmets, and i dont know why ppl have problems with it.

i pointed out that India is not listed on the MT helmets website, to which sunny agreed and said that he would look into it.

I said that DOT certification is of no major value if a particular helmet is not sold in USA. I have already explained the reason for it.

I had asked for production qualification test report, to which sunny denied sharing it online and asked me to come down to his office, which is not practical to me, coz i live in pune. i asked him how to make sure that helmets produced and sold are actually of same quality as certified by ECE, which i dont think is a wrong question, coz we have previously asked the same question to LS2 also, so there is nothing wrong in asking, he has the right to either provide it or deny it. And there is no other way to ascertain the quality of helemts actually mass produced. that is the very purpose of that report.

I was discussing the fact that its manufacturing locations and market countries mentioned on MT helmets does not have a logical connection, however i am ready to drop that issue as it created a lot of controversy.

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Questions which remained unanswered--

(1) Since MT Axxis is sold in India as MT axxis, why it is not mentioned on MT Helmets website. It does not matter in which country it is sold as what, if it is a product of MT Helmets, it should be mentioned on the website..??

(2) How is Zoan, Shox and MT related to each other, are Zoan and Shox - sister concern of MT helmets, or each of these companies are owned by seperate ppl and they source their helmets from common manufacturer?

(3) you mentioned that MT Axxis is sold as shox helmets in europe, and Shox does not even have a website, so i looked on other online stores and found this -->



this is a non-ECE certified, non-DOT approved Shox Axxis Helmet. i found it on ebay, and link is given in previous pages.

I choose this as other websites selling it does not have back side view, they only show side views.

what do you have to say..??

(4) since may 2013, DOT certification label has changed, it should now be like this -->>



link given in previous pages.

why does MT Axxis still carry old label, since its been one year, surely it cant be an old stock. what do you say ???

i would request [MENTION=29015]Sunnyside_up![/MENTION] to come forward and reply to the queries raised in this post.

Plz note that i am not an enemy of MT or SOL or Spartan, in fact when i went to moto-101, i checked some of there products and found them to be of good quality prima facia, but if i have a doubt about something, i bluntly ask it.

thank u.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

Thank you.

Re: MT Helmets - Genuine?

If anyone here has any doubts on the weight of MT helmet, this should clarify