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**GP_freak** · 07-27-2009, 11:32 PM

Originally posted by Joel View Post

you are saying the opposite. For better corner grip, u need a slightly lower pressure. But the trump card is in knowing what pressure is the right pressure. On a hot day and cold day, tire pressure will vary.
Your tire pressures were way too high from what I read. You rode an R15, I guess?

Dude, actually I have typed it wrongly, i just came to explain what you have told above. Yes, only after wonderboy told that i am very high on tyre pressure, i actually came to senses. Only then i understood the reason for the rear to slip just like the road was buttered

. But that also had to do with my very late braking in to the corners.

What should be the optimal cold tyre pressure for a rider of 78 Kg without the riding gear. (Humm... every body would be thinking me as an uncle due to my weight. I have read how you guys comment on uncles testing bikes.. )BTW, how did you guess i rode an R15 ?? What is the best lap time in chennai race track for a racer with near my weight ? I just want a Goal to be set and i require your advice..

**whizzkid_ram** · 07-28-2009, 12:40 AM

Originally posted by karthik_R View Post

I saw more cameras than bikes..so where are the pics?

Dude rest of the pics should be posted by saicheeco...waiting for more pics from his side..

**GP_freak** · 07-28-2009, 08:34 AM

@ Whizzkid - Did you guys happen to time others ? I think the other guys in R15 should have done pretty good lap timings. I was even surprised when over took me every time in the first and second sessions. It was a bit embarrassing.

@Punisher - I am looking forward to the next track day. Let tail each other and get to know our mistakes.

Who was the blue R15 riding behind me when i lost my rear in C10 ?

I was in the pretty early stage, i mean that was my third lap in the halp loop and i wasnt getting hold of the correct corner entry speed. Also since i was not blipping the throttle, the rear got locked up easily... Anyways, thanks for not crashing in to me. I think you reacted quick enough.

@All - I shot out of the track 4 times in C2, 2 times in C10 and Once in C12. He He..pretty bad to hear.Isnt it ?

**wonderboy_tm** · 07-28-2009, 09:39 AM

@gp_freak : Products like the r15 are well researched when it comes to the track conditions... With a stock r15 our sajiv does 2:21s.... SO it is quite obvious that you have a lot for ground to make up before you think the capability of the bike has to be altered.... For a heavy rider even the hardest of the suspensions is going to twitch a lot on the track... From the racers i have spoken to... The sucessfull ones atleast... First point the finger at themselfs before they point it towards the bike.... I do NOT see the requirement of a hardened suspension on the r15... If there something the r15 requires, it is more power towrds the lower rev range.... For that you should get in touch with Joel....

**GP_freak** · 07-28-2009, 11:53 AM

Originally posted by wonderboy_tm View Post

@gp_freak : Products like the r15 are well researched when it comes to the track conditions... With a stock r15 our sajiv does 2:21s.... SO it is quite obvious that you have a lot for ground to make up before you think the capability of the bike has to be altered.... For a heavy rider even the hardest of the suspensions is going to twitch a lot on the track... From the racers i have spoken to... The sucessfull ones atleast... First point the finger at themselfs before they point it towards the bike.... I do NOT see the requirement of a hardened suspension on the r15... If there something the r15 requires, it is more power towrds the lower rev range.... For that you should get in touch with Joel....

agreed buddy.. Am not blaming the bike. its just that i am not accustomed to the feel of the bike. Riding a pulsar every day to office and jumping on to 15 on t track was a bit tricky. Especially when i had just put in a week in the 15 , that too in city condition where its hard to rev beyond 6k. If i am correct, what i am telling is similar to the comment what you made regarding the position of the gear lever in one of the R15. Its not that you were not able to ride t bike, its just that you will feel more at home when you do it.. In the next track, i am pretty sure i can shave off another 5 seconds of the lap timing i did this time. If you had seen my last few lap, you would have understood how much i had improved from the first time you saw my rear locking up. I really want you to tail me the next time, just for your criticism :-). i did have a busy night thinking over all the mistake i had made..
Btw. How much do you weigh ? Whats your best lap time on the 15 ?

**sajiv** · 07-28-2009, 01:03 PM

2:22s was during the race and we just used a mobile as stop-watch to measure the timings. I can safely say that 2:25 would be my consistent lap-timing.

Guys, need your inputs on the line to be taken in C10. I normally brake as late as possible and try to apex late too. Is that the correct way?

Also I have the tendency to use my rear breaks at times(only in left hand corners). I dont do it consciously though. It had not caused a problem till now but not sure if its good. I changed my rear brake pads just days before the trackdays. The rear brake was having better bite than before. With my tendancy to use the rear-brake on left handers, I guess I should have panicked on carrying more speed in C10 and used the rear brake. This might have caused the low-side.

So should the rear brake not be used at all? I have read that I could be used on the to make subtle adjustments to your speed mid-corner. But does that hold good for the R15 around the chennai track?
Experts, please shed some light on the usage of rear brake on the track.

**Camille1198R** · 07-28-2009, 01:26 PM

Personnaly i am doing something like that : http://www.camille-st.fr/C10C11.jpg

apex near the end of C10 turn

I am around >60 (speedo) in c10 and around ~70(speedo) in C11.
but possible to take it faster... because i can lean little more.
I don't know exactly where i start to turn in C10 because not same point of view when i am on my bike ...

**Samyaza** · 07-28-2009, 01:50 PM

Originally posted by sajiv View Post

Guys, need your inputs on the line to be taken in C10. I normally brake as late as possible and try to apex late too. Is that the correct way?

Also I have the tendency to use my rear breaks at times(only in left hand corners). I dont do it consciously though. It had not caused a problem till now but not sure if its good. I changed my rear brake pads just days before the trackdays. The rear brake was having better bite than before. With my tendancy to use the rear-brake on left handers, I guess I should have panicked on carrying more speed in C10 and used the rear brake. This might have caused the low-side.

So should the rear brake not be used at all? I have read that I could be used on the to make subtle adjustments to your speed mid-corner. But does that hold good for the R15 around the chennai track?
So please shed some light on the usage of rear brake on the track.

Originally posted by Camille1198R View Post

Personnaly i am doing something like that : http://www.camille-st.fr/C10C11.jpg

apex near the end of C10 turn

I am around >60 (speedo) in c10 and around ~70(speedo) in C11.
but possible to take it faster... because i can lean little more.
I don't know exactly where i start to turn in C10 because not same point of view when i am on my bike ...

This was the line(see attachment) recommended by Killer for R15 guys. Use trail braking when entering the corner, very slowly increase the throttle after touching the apex because of the little camber. Exit is around the middle of the track. By the time you enter C11 you will be faster to go into C12 and subsequently on the SF straight. As you can see Camille's line and this one has the same entry point to C11. But you carry more speed with this i think. The trick, and a particulary difficult one, is the trail braking.

**GP_freak** · 07-28-2009, 02:41 PM

Originally posted by sajiv View Post

2:22s was during the race and we just used a mobile as stop-watch to measure the timings. I can safely say that 2:25 would be my consistent lap-timing.

Guys, need your inputs on the line to be taken in C10. I normally brake as late as possible and try to apex late too. Is that the correct way?

Also I have the tendency to use my rear breaks at times(only in left hand corners). I dont do it consciously though. It had not caused a problem till now but not sure if its good. I changed my rear brake pads just days before the trackdays. The rear brake was having better bite than before. With my tendancy to use the rear-brake on left handers, I guess I should have panicked on carrying more speed in C10 and used the rear brake. This might have caused the low-side.

So should the rear brake not be used at all? I have read that I could be used on the to make subtle adjustments to your speed mid-corner. But does that hold good for the R15 around the chennai track?
So please shed some light on the usage of rear brake on the track.

Man, i hope you saw what happened for me in the c10. I believe you would have surely thought that i would have crashed there . Right ? And by the way, you are spot on about t rear disc. I had just done 60 km in the new pads. I too was feeling it very sharp. Initially i too was feeling the sharpness of t rear brake, hence i started using the front brake for the adjustments. But that dips the front shock and offsets the stability. So even am waiting for the same advice.

**sajiv** · 07-28-2009, 02:43 PM

Originally posted by Camille1198R View Post

Personnaly i am doing something like that : http://www.camille-st.fr/C10C11.jpg

apex near the end of C10 turn

I am around >60 (speedo) in c10 and around ~70(speedo) in C11.
but possible to take it faster... because i can lean little more.
I don't know exactly where i start to turn in C10 because not same point of view when i am on my bike ...

I am not sure whether I apex so late as indicated in the pics. Let me have a look at the pics from that corner again.

Originally posted by Samyaza View Post

This was the line(see attachment) recommended by Killer for R15 guys. Use trail braking when entering the corner, very slowly increase the throttle after touching the apex because of the little camber. Exit is around the middle of the track. By the time you enter C11 you will be faster to go into C12 and subsequently on the SF straight. As you can see Camille's line and this one has the same entry point to C11. But you carry more speed with this i think. The trick, and a particulary difficult one, is the trail braking.

Ahh.. almost forgot abt that thread..thanks bro.. here it is http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/xbhp-off...tml#post169863

**Camille1198R** · 07-28-2009, 02:52 PM

@Samyaza : Yes, i feel little less fast than when apex more early. But thinking better to be totally on left side for going inside C11...
And for the moment i never use brake in turn. For that i need to come more faster...
That is impressive, about killer can do that 20s less than me

, how he is doing

.
Anyway need more more practice.

**Samyaza** · 07-28-2009, 02:53 PM

@Sajiv
And check http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/xbhp-offline-meets-g2gs/6727-chennai-xbhp-track-day-22-feb-09-discussion-pics-thread-10.html#post170087

Tutorial specifically for C10

@Camille
Trail braking requires a lot of practice! That flow...you need that flow to go smoothly from one corner to the next with minimal effort and maximum speed.

**Joel** · 07-28-2009, 03:07 PM

Just a few heads-up on lap times.
Killers best lap time around the long loop at chennai was 2:14. The group B R15s clock 2:04 and the TVS factory RTRs are now at 2:02s.
My personal best in the long loop has been a best of 2:19s(consistent 2:21s) but have not seen the chennai track since 5 months now. next time would like to shave 2 secs off 2:19.

**Samyaza** · 07-28-2009, 03:27 PM

Originally posted by Joel View Post

Just a few heads-up on lap times.
Killers best lap time around the long loop at chennai was 2:14. The group B R15s clock 2:04 and the TVS factory RTRs are now at 2:02s.
My personal best in the long loop has been a best of 2:19s(consistent 2:21s) but have not seen the chennai track since 5 months now. next time would like to shave 2 secs off 2:19.

2:14 when yours is 2:19?!

Now even im wondering how he does it...

**Killer** · 07-28-2009, 03:49 PM

Originally posted by Camille1198R View Post

about killer can do that 20s less than me

, how he is doing

.

I'm well Camille, thanks for asking

Dont worry about the daunting laptimes, your focussed and systematic approach to riding is the right way to go and you will drop times for sure, just keep at it....mail me if you need help, i can be reached through the contact page on my site, i've been quite busy lately and my forum visits arent as frequent as they used to be

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