everything is right but you cant compare a legend like splendor with bikes like 4s champion and boxer...my 10 year old splendor still starts on the very first kick but i saw my neighbor used to give it choke every day...he was fed up of cold starts and finally he sold out that bike. I agree caliber was a good bike and very good attempt by bajaj but its not good to compare a bike which is selling from more than 25 years with a bike like 4s champion and boxer which lasted hardly 5-7 years.

I am not a hero fan boy but a respect them as a business house and a company which introduced bikes like splendor, passion, cbz, karizma etc which were trend setters in industry. you will not be able to find good service staff and all spare parts for a bike like cbr250(recent product) but you can easily get spares for bikes like cd100, joy and cbz classic(which have been discontinued) easily. This is called trust and reliability which comes with lesser profits and quality products not with over prices products like cbr150 and claiming 20-22% operating profits.

Very True! I bought Splendor NXG, Was bit worried about spear parts avilibility, later find its available everywhere.. I am driving this bike from last 8months.the only problem occur Mile meter wire. which i replace outside with 22/-(inner only not the cable,Cable cost 70/- ).and service is awesome. i go for service 3times. very hard to find unsatisfied customer in Customer Lodge.

As some think, customers are not fools; they are really wise. The targeted audience for these bikes doesn't care about LED blinkers or the extra spark plug. All they need is a reliable engine with good mileage. The engines of these bikes were optimized for balanced power, fuel efficiency, and reliability long back. There is nothing that you can improve in the engine department. Hero is committed to offer best of engine technology and it is evident in giving the new 109cc engine with great performance and fuel efficiency.

People are not just buying the hero products just because someone said they are reliable; they see people using Hero products since generations with satisfaction. Reliability just doesn't come by words.

And, in commuter segment, any advanced technology should result in fuel efficiency and reliability. As long as there is no bump in FE and performance, any customer in this segment doesn't care. They don't buy bikes by looking at brochures with advanced technology written on it.

The decision-makers at the company doesn't think in the way we think. They think in terms of what the targeted customer requires/wants in pure business terms.

I don't have any bubble that you can break and laugh. Your post clearly proves maturity doesn't always come with age and riding experience. I was not just referring to some college-going members, but also some like you.

Bibhu, if you apply a little logic you would understand. Honda has entered Indian market separately and being in collaboration with its competitor in the market, it will try to restrict the Hero to gain the market. Being in collaboration with a competitor Hero's hands were tied, and the inevitable eventually happened; the split up.

The information posted by Sibun is an internal matter which the companies will not publish for us to post as source.

I Do not know much about the profit margin of companies so I will not comment on it. Also, I have never said that splendor is a bad product. What I have said is it is basically the same product used over and over again. The loyal customers of Hero deserve better than that. About reliability, well my friend has a splendor which is very temperamental and refuses to start on colder days. Reliability also depends on maintenance and type of use. In the garage I get my work done, I see complaints of customers of hero honda as well as other manufacturers. Every motorcycle needs repairs in the hands of people who do not know how to maintain them, unlike informed motorcyclists.

I do not think that passion and splendor qualify as a trendsetters. CD 100 and CBZ cl yes. Passion and splendor no.

Regarding service, well that is another issue that is relative. If I start talking about it it will never end.

Spares.... We have been looking for a petrol tap and float pin for a Karizma for 2 weeks now.

I will not enter in to brand bashing as it is not helpful to anyone.

However here is a retort to your remarks. I never said that customers are stupid, I said they were misinformed and lacked the expertise to understand technical information. I have said that due to their lack of knowledge they are paying to buy decades old technology without even realizing it. If you think that a 97.2 cc horizontal single cylinder two valve engine is the pinacle of perfection then I will keep my silence.

After 29 years they came up with a new commuter. This it self is evident of their negligence towards the masses and profit raking motive.
Mind you I did not say anything about led or extra plugs. I said minimum essential technology like a disc brake and digital ignition.

As far as taking somebody's word goes, I am sorry, I can not do that. The reason I wanted the source is because more information is always welcome. But that information has to be verified. I just wanted to enlighten myself. Purely selfish motive.

What general people think that they want a reliable engine with very less maintenance and a manufacturer who provides parts with lowest cost than others. And a company which provide both of these is Hero.

A middle class family people who earns 10,000 to 15000 for a month, and they hardly manage to bear their expenses cost in their livelihood such as, food, cloth, rent, bills, child expenses like paying their fess buying books for theirs. So u can't even think of how they manage every month in this rapidly increasing inflation world.
They dont have enough time to leave their work and look for a bike maintenance or to go for a another new bike every time. If they leave how they will eat. They are not as free as we are.
So all in all, they want a decent strong bike, the price which they can afford for. A bike which doesnt need to look every time. A bike which is light in weight and easy to ride in crowdy market place and any age of man can ride it. A bike which provide better mileage, less problematic with less labor charge.
And all these things they get on Hero only. Therefore, they trust and go for it and they know they dont need to change his bike in its lifetime. because u know affording a bike in every 3-5 years is not easy for a lower or middle class type people.

Therefore, general people thinking is different from what u guys think.

and how Ignitor sells better in Mumbai where 48% people travels by train everyday. The roads are so con justed and if all the people who travels by train come to drive on road then u'll not able to reach your home u know for sure. Its true 6.6 million people in Mumbai travels by train everyday, then how a sales increase there!!

I am still confused,why you quoted me?? According to the bold part,I dont even belong to that group.
Any ways I am not offended but ,Let me tell you about my Biking portfolio first, HH Dawn(2002,still with me), Tvs Star city(2006, still with me) Yammy Gladiator(2007 Sold 3 yrs back and got an RTR 180. Yes I know,HH/H doesnt make product for the enthusiasts. Hence I never repeated them. But I would still say,the Dawn was the most reliable bike in the pack(even the switch gear are stock after 10 years and more than 1.5 lac kms.Had to change my gladi's left switch and rusted Silencer,RTR's both switch gears,within 3 years of usage. Thats why I respect them,not believe blindly...

1 thing I dont understand,why the old members,are get into fierce war with each other?? What can you expect from youngsters then? Mods are enjoying I guess.

Karizma was also a trend setter in performance segment infact it was first bike in india with full DC system, 223 cc engine, 17 bhp and 18+ nm torque, alloy wheels, best console of that time, quarter fairing etc....

You may feel what you wrote is a retort, but I don't. I don't want to dwell deep in here, but I put a few points. Could you please explain what kind of misinformation customers are getting from Hero regarding their products? And what superior engine technology other competitors are offering in the same category. Disc brakes and self-ignition are there in variants in the needed segment, in case if you don't know. How old is the technology is not important, how good is the technology is what is important. If a manufacturer starts a bike with engine this year does not mean its latest and innovative. Hero got a perfect engine long back than other competitors, so they don't need any more perfection.

As I told you before, reliability and fuel efficiency are the driving factors in commuting segment. As long as they get them in a product, they don't see how old is the product or how old is the engine technology.

Even as we argue, lakhs of people out there who bought these bikes will happily be riding with satisfaction.

Point taken. Quote removed. Regarding bashing, bhai sune, Ethi kehi bada sana nahanti. All bike communities have bashing. Hogs dont like japs. Japs dont like euros. Goes on and on. Part of Biking culture. btw, Where are you located in ctc?

Honestly I can not argue with that. However I still stand by what I have said.

@Ravi@17bhp: I have said that the average population lacks understanding of 2wheeler engineering thus are misinformed. I didnt say that hero was misinforming them. Their decision to purchase a bike is based on limited information.

I am fully aware of the of the features of current hero bikes. Thank you.

What is this ? The thread seems to be turning out in brand war . Respect other bikes guys don't post anything just because you don't own it .

Thank you for letting know this .

Two lines in same reply one saying not said ...... & other saying said .........

So i guess its the reason for your deleted post .

Paul must be super drunk when he typed the long post.
People have been using bajaj bikes for almost lakh kms. Our ex mod aryan had a classic which he used that long. The fact that you said engines are crap and led blinkers and attracting girls shows how much you know about all the stuff you talk about.

If your friend hit a stone on his P150 and got a bill of 10000, it was definitely not for the "digital". The console costs 4k the sensor cable costs 200 and the sensor at the wheel costs another 200 bucks. Learn what is called what and then post. You shouldn't post baseless bullshit like this. Pulsar engines smoke at 15-20k? I think you must be smoking some crazy weed because my bike ran for 40k kms without any engine work whatsoever. Only the clutch plates were changed once.
A moron who is sitting in jamshedpur cannot and should not comment about the sales numbers of bikes in Mumbai. People use bikes a lot in Mumbai. Come see for yourself. Don't go around talking half baked crap.
If you want to argue, atleast learn to argue using facts. Not bullshit. This was never a Bajaj Vs. HH war. Just that some facts about late adaptation of features by HH.

Do you think electric starter is a fancy item? Think about the 50 year old commuter who has to kick start his splendor everytime hurting his knees. Do you think alloy wheels are fancy items? You are wrong. Alloy wheels don't need spoke settings and you can use tubeless tyres with alloy wheels. These make a bike more reliable. HH could have implemented these in their bikes long ago. But they did so only when other manufacturers started providing those. Same goes for disc brakes. Alloy wheels, disc brakes and electric starters don't attract girls.


And yes, HH has introduced many trendsetting bikes. The original CD100, the CBZ and the ZMA were all fantastic bikes for those eras. But the fact that the ZMA and the CD100 engine are still being used is wrong. There have been so many innovations in engine technologies and HH could have adapted those to improve their bikes even further getting more and more customers. But they went ahead and used the same old stuff. Even if for some reason, they couldn't do any changes to the engine, they could have provided useful upgrades to their good bikes which they didn't.

Ravi and naveen, the above stuff was only for Paul.1911 who thinks he is a friggin genius but doesn't know shit.


Naveen you are absolutely right. The ZMA was a legendary bike. A trendsetter. Full DC, 223CC, Half fairing were all first introduced by HH in the ZMA. But the problem is that the first ZMA and the latest ZMA have the same everything, except a few minor changes. They could introduce such an awesome bike once, then why not again? Why not kick competition's ass? That'd be a situation where everybody wins. The customer would be happier, sales would be higher.

Ravi, fine your point is somewhat valid that they mastered the engine long ago. But then the sticker upgrades weren't justified right? It took them so many years to introduce disk brakes, alloy wheels and electric starter in the passion. This when competitors like TVS and Bajaj started providing these necessities long ago.

You guys are getting it all wrong. We don't hate HH. HH has the fan base and the cash for making the best bikes that will smoke out all competition. Just that they aren't really doing much about it.

The cost incurred i told is what said by my friend, i've not said by my own.
If they do late adaptation its their problem. U r happy with your bike then u should have no problem with what HH have done
How do we know the fact that happens inside the company.


As other members said Hero was not able to adapt new technologies to improve bikes just because of Honda. They went for the old stuff, they didn't upgrade all that blah blah were restricted by Honda. Therefore, this is the reason for their broke up. As hero wants to do up-gradation in his bikes.

Yes they must have smoke out all competition very earlier if they have broke up that time which they can't because of Honda.

Now, they will do everything about it!

Paul,
If you don't know what costed what about the pulsar repair then better shut up rather than posting baseless crap over here. This is not bloody orkut or facebook for starting baseless arguments. If you claim something, better back it up with facts. Else refrain from posting.
Yes I was very happy with my bike and no it is not right on their part to adapt slowly.
The restrictions on HH were not the reason for no upgrades. If it were so, then how the hell were they able to finally upgrade the passion with disc brakes alloy wheels and what not while still in a JV with Honda?
You still don't get the no bullshit part, do you? What you post doesn't make even half the sense.

pavanchirmade
I just want to let j4zb4 know that HH bikes are not crap. I've HH bike i.e., 9 years old and still looks like new and start on one kick, i love everything of it. Its like a part of my family and if someone say that HH bikes are crap, then it means my bike is also crap.
That what made be angry and to write all these and about that trust they were taking about.
I dont want to argue on anything.
I and many others will still be happy if they dont upgrade too. And we'll still buy it.

You talk about facts...you also dont have fact on that "Honda is much more trustworthy than Hero moto since the breakup." wrote by you.

If u dont like same state of tone, same mileage, engine, chassis, body panels or whatever then its not gonna change if u state those things here. If u want to know the fact why they dont upgrade...go and find yourself or ask to a company directly and tell them i dont like these these things change/upgrade it.

Why do you think HH has such a fan following? It is because they are reliable you say. Who makes the reliable engines that HH uses? Honda. It is the Honda name that inspires trust in the mind of the buyer. So yes Honda is much more trustworthy than Hero Moto SINCE THE BREAK-UP.

I hope you get what I am trying to say. Please work on your comprehension skills and try to understand what someone is trying to say.

This was my last post on this idiotic thread. I cannot deal with any more of your bullshit.
Thank you.