Engine Oils

[Vykier]

Re: Engine Oils

Can notchy downshifts, vibration and in general a feeling of not-refined be caused by a bad choice of oil/old oil losing viscosity over time? My Gixxer has all these symptoms when riding in extreme stop-go traffic but not when the ride is a mix of both stop-go and "free-road". I don't feel any significant heat near my legs (may be my jeans shield them well).

What compression ratio does your Gixxer engine make? 13:1 if i'm not wrong... You'd need premium high octane fuel right? unless the gixxer has a compensator component like the Hayabusa. Does it? What fuel do you use? What model is your Gixxer?

Hope it gets well soon.

Cheers.

[Divya Sharan]

Re: Engine Oils

Pls help guys where can I find those type of stand in mumbai for impulse

Tej, see this - Paddock stand - Mumbai - Motorcycles - Scooters

What fuel do you use? What model is your Gixxer?

Hope it gets well soon.

Cheers.

Gixxer in this context = Suzuki GS 150R.

[ashwanth.r]

Re: Engine Oils

Castrol Go is API SG 20W40 oil (as mentioned on their website). Are you using the same? If so, you are bound to face heat, vibrations, hard gear shifts.

Why so?, 20W-40 is the recommended grade. Sometimes SC fills 10W-30 which makes things even worse.

Hope the one you are using is genuine. Switch to better oil from Shell, Motul, Gulf.How much does the oil cost? How much quantity is required to fill the sump?

Forgot the cost - was in the 200s. Sump requires 1L without filter change.

Hope it gets well soon. Cheers.

Gixxer in this context = Suzuki GS 150R.

Sorry for the confusion - It is GS150R.

[devils_friend]

Re: Engine Oils

Why so?, 20W-40 is the recommended grade. Sometimes SC fills 10W-30 which makes things even worse.
Forgot the cost - was in the 200s. Sump requires 1L without filter change.

The oil you are using is Mineral oil. You are bound to face heat, vibes, cluncky gear box with the use of same. How many kms on odo?

Cheerz!!

[maadyy]

Re: Engine Oils

Why so?, 20W-40 is the recommended grade. Sometimes SC fills 10W-30 which makes things even worse.




Forgot the cost - was in the 200s. Sump requires 1L without filter change.







Sorry for the confusion - It is GS150R.

If your recommend grade by your manufacturer is 20w40 castrol is the one you may go with.

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[ashwanth.r]

Re: Engine Oils

How many kms on odo?Cheerz!!

9k.

If your recommend grade by your manufacturer is 20w40 castrol is the one you may go with.

I once used Servo 20W-40, that one gave off after 2k kms too. If am not wrong, I can go with any xxW-40 oil, right? xxW-50 would be too thick!

[B7ACKTHORN]

Re: Engine Oils

You are right, it doesnt have that symbol. But oils made in India are not carrying that symbol. The reason is that Indian consumer does not look at that symbol but the US consumer selects oils based on that symbol. Secondly, oil companies have to pay a royalty to use that symbol. Indian industry is full of competition and no one wants to spend on a useless symbol (in Indian context).
Just go to any oil shop to buy an oil with that symbol, if you are lucky, you would get an imported oil having that symbol or else you would come back empty handed.

If you are buying an oil from a good manufacturer - Mobil, Motul, Shell, Elf, Total etc etc just mark their words on API classification.

Coming back to the oil. ELF Performance 3D 15W-40 is very easily flowing oil and is kind of thin w.r.t Mobil Delvac 1300. It has no characteristic of a Diesel engine oil except smoothness. The oil was behaving more like a 10w40 motorcycle specific oil. The feeling was like a person using 20w40 shifts to 10w30. Positive point is that the bike has started accelerating quicker than before. The downside is that at high rpms the engine feels less protected. I would explain more about this word feel.
On delvac, the internals of the engine were feeling heavy, like its on a thick oil. But on this oil there is no heaviness. Imagine a thin film vs a thick one.

I was used to the engine heaviness on delvac and after shifting to this oil, I will have to get accustomed to the engine response, as its smooth and light and I can't use the sluggishness in engine to control the bike. The bike is responding faster to throttle.

I then read about CI-4 classification. What is there in it which is making this diesel engine oil behave like petrol engine oil. There are in total 15 tests which are performed in these oils:

The new tests or existing tests with new limits are:
• Mack T-10 (EGR) (Ring, Liner, Bearing Wear, and Oil Consumption)
• Cummins M11 EGR (Ring, Valve Train Wear, Filter Delta P, and Sludge)
• Caterpillar 1R (Piston Deposits and Oil Consumption)
• Mack T-8E (Soot Dispersancy)
• Sequence IIIF (Oil Oxidation and Oil Consumption)
• Low Temperature Pumpability for Oil Containing five percent Soot
• High Temperature/High Shear Viscosity
• Elastomer Compatibility
• Volatility
The six remaining tests in the category are in the existing API CH-4 category and are carried into API CI-4, making a total of 15 tests. API CI-4 is a backward-compatible category. Simply, if the requirements of API CI-4 are met, oil companies can claim API CH-4, CG-4, and CF-4 without running any further tests

Source: SN CI-4 Diesel Fuel Feature

If you have time go through the whole article. Its quite informative.

Remember my posts where I cautioned lower cc engines to keep away from Delvac? Primarily because the oil appeared quite thick(like a 20W50) in the engine. This oil can easily be used in those engines. But now the problem.. It costs 280rs/litre. I doubt that anyone would be interested in this oil when AX7 sells at around 330/litre. And 10w30 gulf synth (as mentioned by Pinakiji) trades at 300 odd rs.

The benefits of CI-4 oils are Low Piston Deposits, Low Oil consumption, More soot dispersant, better protection from oil oxidation, easily flows in low temperature even with 5% soot content, High shear/High temperature protection, Less volatile and Compatibility with common elastomers used in seals etc.

But frankly, the more closer you get to the most recent API spec oil the more you will have to pay. Why CI-4 are better is given in this very informative source- http://www.hddeo.com/ViscosityModifierPart2.html

First off an excellent compilation Muzz. I was intrigued by your point about the bike performing little "fluidic" for a lack of better term, from Delvac to the Elf and it's a good read. Two questions, first off, the article was all about EGR and the combined effect effect in reducing emissions, and it was an excellent loop from alkaline neutralizers used to reduce the sulfur produced during the EGR recirculation, what effect does this have w.r.t to the fluidity of the engine that's number one.

And number two

API CI-4 oils are pivotal components in maintaining diesel engine durability using cooled EGR. API CI-4 is a higher quality oil than the previous diesel oil categories, so it will provide engine protection for both existing and new EGR engines. Ultimately, consumers of these high-quality oils are the real winners

What difference does it make w.r.t to API CJ approved and particularly the term "real winners"does it in anyway mean API CJ is inferior. I am jus trying get my head around the "fluidity" part. I understand all these 9 tests which are beautifully tabulated in accordance of the needs, i.e. fluidity, viscosity and shear resistance etc. But what's in the pudding w.r.t to the high speed fluidity, all these articles just represent a simple term "multigrade" if I reckon correctly, so your thoughts would be appreciated.


Cheers!
VJ

[Vykier]

Re: Engine Oils

Gixxer in this context = Suzuki GS 150R.

Hahahaha.... so sorry for the confusion guys... leave my comment out of the picture... thanks DS... lol

Cheers.


And also just changed my CBR 250r oil from factory synthetic to Shell Advance Ultra...

Already experiencing smoother gearshifts for certain... and there's a slightly different feel to the way it revs around the 6k rpm range... The bike seems happier - so, I am too.

[muztariq]

Re: Engine Oils

First off an excellent compilation Muzz. I was intrigued by your point about the bike performing little "fluidic" for a lack of better term, from Delvac to the Elf and it's a good read. Two questions, first off, the article was all about EGR and the combined effect effect in reducing emissions, and it was an excellent loop from alkaline neutralizers used to reduce the sulfur produced during the EGR recirculation, what effect does this have w.r.t to the fluidity of the engine that's number one.

And number two



What difference does it make w.r.t to API CJ approved and particularly the term "real winners"does it in anyway mean API CJ is inferior. I am jus trying get my head around the "fluidity" part. I understand all these 9 tests which are beautifully tabulated in accordance of the needs, i.e. fluidity, viscosity and shear resistance etc. But what's in the pudding w.r.t to the high speed fluidity, all these articles just represent a simple term "multigrade" if I reckon correctly, so your thoughts would be appreciated.


Cheers!
VJ

I am still learning about the CI-4 grade. What I believe it that this grade has a lot to do with shear resistance, low temperature fluidity when the oil has 5% soot. We all know that when oil gets filled with carbon the fluidity is lost. If the oil has good amount of dispersants this carbon will not agglomerate to hinder oil fluidity.

Rimula R4 is also CI-4, so people using this oil must be experiencing what I have started to experience.

Shell Rimula R4 - India

All the tests are same as mentioned in that article.

Secondly, CI-4 users would be "real winners" as mentioned in the article because at that moment of time (2002) when this article was written, CJ-4 oil was not invented ;-)

I am now searching for oils that are CI-4 approved. There would be some oils which will give the rider a better cost/benefit ratio. Rimula R4, ELF Performance 3D, Valvoline All Fleet Gold, Mobil Delvac MX are some. No Castrol please. There would be some among them which will be equivalent to normal motorcycle mineral engine oil in cost.

[sinnerz2000]

Re: Engine Oils

Ive been checking my oil level every 50km since I changed my oil. It hasnt reduced in the last 200km. The previous oil had reduced to 500ml in 2k km. Now too I see little white smoke when I start my bike in the morning and a puff of black smoke if it is revved fully, could the smoke be of the previous oil which might still be in the combustion chamber? Heres a pic of my spark plug.



AFAIK if the tip is wet with oil then oil is entering the chamber. But the tip is completly dry.

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[muztariq]

Re: Engine Oils

[MENTION=42743]sinnerz2000[/MENTION]

are you using iridium spark plug? If not how long are you running on this spark plug?

[maadyy]

Re: Engine Oils

Ive been checking my oil level every 50km since I changed my oil. It hasnt reduced in the last 200km. The previous oil had reduced to 500ml in 2k km. Now too I see little white smoke when I start my bike in the morning and a puff of black smoke if it is revved fully, could the smoke be of the previous oil which might still be in the combustion chamber? Heres a pic of my spark plug.



AFAIK if the tip is wet with oil then oil is entering the chamber. But the tip is completly dry.

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Oil can't be at the tip of spark plug, else that will stop u from strating your bike since oil is a bad conductor of electricity. Two things might happen
1. Problem in your piston ring.
2. Your bike doesn't support the grade of oil you arw using.

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[sinnerz2000]

Re: Engine Oils

[MENTION=42743]sinnerz2000[/MENTION]

are you using iridium spark plug? If not how long are you running on this spark plug?

Its a g power, using since about 4k km I guess.

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[sinnerz2000]

Re: Engine Oils

Oil can't be at the tip of spark plug, else that will stop u from strating your bike since oil is a bad conductor of electricity. Two things might happen
1. Problem in your piston ring.
2. Your bike doesn't support the grade of oil you arw using.

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Hmm the grade I used when oil reduced was 20w40 motul 3000 which Is my regular grade and brand. Now im on 10w40 shell ax7.

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[maadyy]

Re: Engine Oils

Hmm the grade I used when oil reduced was 20w40 motul 3000 which Is my regular grade and brand. Now im on 10w40 shell ax7.

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I will suggest you to get your piston bore kit checked once feom a good mech.

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