Engine Oils

[vipin_s]

The most important thing to note while going for an oil is to first check if it is JASO MA2 compliant.Second is to choose an oil grade closer to recommended grade..and considering our hot temperature conditions it is better to go for thicker oils.Old ZMA had 20W40 and ran well.Present recommendation is 10W30. The problem with thinner oil is under REPEATED heat stress , the oil becomes thinner ,and a thinner oil has lesser heat carrying capacity and hence lesser cooling effect.So it is better to stick to 20W40.A W 50 will be better but will make the bike to rev sluggishly.
Also choosing a smaller range ie.,20W40 10 W30 is better than choosing a wider range like 10 W40 because the Esters added for the value stability is more and it deteriorates faster with heat..just my thought

I agree with your lines, but 10W30 is a multi grade oil and will have 'multi' viscosity at different temperatures. I don't think a Honda backed company would compromise heat carrying ability of the oil - just my thoughts. 10w30 is fortified with some chemicals/modifiers so that there are more benefits, one big one being drain period which saves environment (saves on money too). I still feel for an avg HH bike 10w30 is superior than 20w40. BTW, I want to try 20w40 on my achiever next time and see how smooth it becomes

I had bought a pre-owned ZMA with 21,550 on odo. It came with stock HH oil which was changed only 1.5 K kms before and looked black.

I guess your the zma might have been loaded with old HH idemitsu 20w40, the original color itself is darkish blue, at draining time it looks like 'tar'(after use).

[vipin_s]

any other oils from company's like castrol,shell etc?any grade or something for 2s engine oils?

Castrol will have any oil for any vehicle, but I guess Savita's 2T Ultra is best one it's made to Honda specs just like 'HH Idemitsu 10w30' for HH - which is again made by Savita. It's easily available oil for Kinetic Hondas..

[Pinaki]

Don't know about 10W40,But 20W40 is good for cbz,many had used gulf pride plus 20W40 in their cbz without issues..

Any 20w40 JASO MA/MA2 oil is best for cbz/karizma(all versions, they have the exact same engines all) in summers in the indian plains ( i.e 30-55C ambient temps daytime) . You can use the 10w30 in winter , for better cold starts . Both gulf prides 10w30 & 20w40 are the best mineral oils in those grades as per my experience . Elf moto4 10w30/20w40 is just as good . No mineral oil remains as smooth as I like it for more than 1500kms in any of my bikes . So I keep changing at 1500k instead of looking for better oils or spending too much on synthetics , sorry jairam ramesh'jee .
Engine protection and smoothness , slick gear shifts , engine cooling will be better and engine noise ,fuel efficiency, rev-ability(maybe a bit of the top-end even) little bit less with 20w40 compared to 10w30 .
@ Vipin ...it's the opposite ; the more additives / viscosity modifiers an oil has , the less actual oil in it . Engine oil does lubrication & cooling of engine parts,modifiers & additives don't do that at all, the oil does . So low range oils like 20w40 is always far better for the engine than a higher range oil like 10w30 / 10w40 / 15w50 . You should choose the lowest range oil (with the least modifiers & additives) that your engine can use effectively at your ambient temperatures .btw , how hot does it get in bengaluru in summer ?
Thermal conductivity of a material is directly proportional to it's density . This is a law of physics . Unless Honda or whoever has found a way to avoid the laws of physics .... .
It's true that the HH 10w30(bpcl) turns black & watery in 1000kms and the engine sounds rough and heats up too much . I got so scared on touching the engine casing for a moment, when I stopped for a smoke on a longish summer noon ride , that I promptly changed to 20w40 yamalube (mineral SL) . Wayyy cooler and smooooth now even at 1500 . Will change again shortly , same oil or gulf maybe .
Also keep in mind the miles your engine has done . An older(or abused) engine with more wear will have loose tolerances and do better with a bit heavier oil , say the 20w40 even if it is specified for 10w30 by the company . With the heavier oil you can keep riding it for say 25k kms more , before your pistons seals etc start leaking oil .

[Aneesh@4GHz]

Castrol will have any oil for any vehicle, but I guess Savita's 2T Ultra is best one it's made to Honda specs just like 'HH Idemitsu 10w30' for HH - which is again made by Savita. It's easily available oil for Kinetic Hondas..

Ok bro,I will check here for its availability.Thanks for the help.

Any 20w40 JASO MA/MA2 oil is best for cbz/karizma(all versions, they have the exact same engines all) in summers in the indian plains ( i.e 30-55C ambient temps daytime) . You can use the 10w30 in winter , for better cold starts . Both gulf prides 10w30 & 20w40 are the best mineral oils in those grades as per my experience . Elf moto4 10w30/20w40 is just as good . No mineral oil remains as smooth as I like it for more than 1500kms in any of my bikes . So I keep changing at 1500k instead of looking for better oils or spending too much on synthetics , sorry jairam ramesh'jee .
Engine protection and smoothness , slick gear shifts , engine cooling will be better and engine noise ,fuel efficiency, rev-ability(maybe a bit of the top-end even) little bit less with 20w40 compared to 10w30 .

Not sure whether gulf is available or not,seen a gulf dealer here,need to go and check ,anyway if i get it ,i will try and will post the results.Thanks for the help sir.

[akatl]

@PSR
@PINAKI
are u telling changing grade is not a problem? then why manufacturer strongly recommending a specified oil grade?

[kasperrmat]

@PSR
@PINAKI
are u telling changing grade is not a problem? then why manufacturer strongly recommending a specified oil grade?

From what i understood,the specific recommendation is under standard conditions... and the choice should be made based on the environment temp,duration of ride and the age of bike....if you go through the following link and look at the unicorn manual's oil section posted by rider60....you will definitely get an idea.....

Unicorn Monetary Value & Other Questions... - Page 2 - Team-BHP

[akatl]

which grade recommend u for my cbz xtreme? now here is max temp- 30-36C. after 1 month form june its come down to 25-31C due to rainy season in kerala.

[elangoas]

Hello ppl,

I have a ZMA R 2009 Model. completed 32K kms on the ODO so far..I replaced the bore & piston rings under warranty juz when i was abt to complete 30K kms. I believe the reason behind changing the piston rings so early is that either the service center guys didn't top up the engine oil during intermediate service interval which i didn't pay attention then (or) engine oil 10W30 is def not good for high speed riding. I used to commute 70kms a day mostly 80 - 110 Kms on the speedo consistently for atleast 20kms in a stretch one way. This has eventually led to the pistion rings wear too early than it would last around 50 - 60 Kms. and more inmportantly i have never pushed the bike beyond 110 Kms.

Now i am serious abt the engine oil being used in my bike. I have gone thru the Engin Oil thread and more inclined towards Fully synthetic oil as i believe it gives more protection to the engine wear / tear. Choice is between Motul 300V FL 10W 40 and Castrol power 1 racing 10W 40.Budget isn't a constraint. I want this postion rigns to last for atleast 50K kms from now on.

Given that i have done 3K kms after chnaging the bore/ pistion rings, is it a good idea to switch to Fully Synthetic oils.I haven't changed anything else in the gearbox. Kindly receommend.

Thanx
Elango

[kasperrmat]

which grade recommend u for my cbz xtreme? now here is max temp- 30-36C. after 1 month form june its come down to 25-31C due to rainy season in kerala.

1)If i am not wrong the recommended is 10w30.......go for 20w40 in high temps season.....in south especially in summers the temps soar like hell.....remaining time switch to 10w30
2)If you want a oil that caters to all season blindly stick to 10w40..it is similar to 10w30 in thickness but thinner than 20w40....I have a good experience with veedol super swift if possible get it.....

[Pinaki]

Hello ppl,
I have a ZMA R 2009 Model. completed 32K kms on the ODO so far..I thru the Engin Oil thread and more inclined towards Fully synthetic oil as i believe it gives more protection to the engine wear / tear. ...... is it a good idea to switch to Fully Synthetic oils.I haven't changed anything else in the gearbox. Kindly receommend...
Elango

Run with mineral for a little more , say upto 5000-7000kms before you switch to fully synthetic . They say that a good real synthetic oil (not trick synthetics like the castrol hydrocracked petroleum oils) shall almost freeze(halt/stop) your engine's wear & tear cycle at that point . i.e almost no further wear to internal parts . For the kind of use you do , best to use good quality 20w40 mineral only and change every 1500km ( ensure it , don't leave it to the service centre jokers ) . That would be far better than running costly synthetics for longer mileage/periods IMHO .

@PSR
@PINAKI
are u telling changing grade is not a problem? then why manufacturer strongly recommending a specified oil grade?

Manufacturers have other concerns.... 1) It is a fantastic logistic solution for them if they can get away with one single oil throughout their whole fleet of bikes from kashmir to kanyakumari through summer and winter . 2) it is also beneficial for them to recommend the only one oil that they sell and also prohibit you from using anything else through warranty conditions. 3) I also suspect that they stand to benefit if your bike wears out faster . I can not believe that the same oil can suffice for your bike both in jaisalmer-summer and kashmir-winter IMHO .
Most of the better and more responsible car companies do not make any oil recommendations . They just print a chart of what grade to use under what conditions . There also seems to be some cultural variations to oil recommendation , like in wines .Apparently, the U.S. operations of all of the European marques (MB, BMW, Volvo, Saab, etc.) advise an oil viscosity which is designed to optimize fuel mileage(mobil1 0w40/rotella 5w30 are the most popular), while in Europe car owners are advised to chose an oil to enhance the life of the engine(10w-30, 15w-40, 20w40 etc) . Also don't go by the max temperature given by weather-stations , they use a meteorological cage for measurements in shade , daytime street temperature is much higher in summer here , even the air gets so hot .

[elangoas]

Run with mineral for a little more , say upto 5000-7000kms before you switch to fully synthetic . They say that a good real synthetic oil (not trick synthetics like the castrol hydrocracked petroleum oils) shall almost freeze(halt/stop) your engine's wear & tear cycle at that point . i.e almost no further wear to internal parts . For the kind of use you do , best to use good quality 20w40 mineral only and change every 1500km ( ensure it , don't leave it to the service centre jokers ) . That would be far better than running costly synthetics for longer mileage/periods IMHO

Thanx Pinaki.

currently i use the HH oil 10W30 on the bike. The engine sound is good like unicorn until the first 1,000 Kms after oil change. But after that, the engine seems to be rough...

I will continue to use the Mineral oil for the next 7K kms.. From this time iam not leaving it to the service center jokers. Once i hit 40K kms on the ODO, i will switch to Fully Synthetic Oil...

[Pinaki]

Yes , I had exact same experience with the HH oil . Dunno how they are asking us to run it for 6000Kms .... anyone here actually done that ? works ?

[sandeepcf]

Run with mineral for a little more , say upto 5000-7000kms before you switch to fully synthetic.

why?
my friend said some cars come with fully synthetic oil from factory. Taken from team-bhp---The master of automotive engineering - Porsche - was the first car manufacturer to factory-fill its engines with synthetic oil before delivery.
So if synthetic oil hinders the run-in process why Porsche factory-fills their cars.
is it Fact or Fiction?

Choice is between Motul 300V FL 10W 40 and Castrol power 1 racing 10W 40.

I used both the above oils in my Unicorn. First used CPR4T for 8000km with 50ml of Nulon engine oil treatment and very much satisfied with the results.
Filled Motul 10w40 and the engine has become rough compared to 8000km old CPR4T and not revving smoother. Motul is now 2100kms old and now there are leaks from starter motor area, clutch area. I'll switch back to CPR4T after this summer because of obvious reasons. so even if MOTUL is superior in its technology I found CPR4T better than MOTUL.
Also MOTUL is JASO MA, CPR4T is JASO MA2 so better clutch performance from the specs.

[arjunb25]

Guys give an advice. I am going to use moto 4 gold 20w50 for summers with Nulon engine oil going to mix this with my bike seriously she needs care. lately noticed her performance has come down along with the millage.

Well riding a pulsar 180 ug4 any suggestions always welcome.
shall try motul 5100 15w50 in winters not in summers.

[akatl]

Manufacturers have other concerns.... 1) It is a fantastic logistic solution for them if they can get away with one single oil throughout their whole fleet of bikes from kashmir to kanyakumari through summer and winter . 2) it is also beneficial for them to recommend the only one oil that they sell and also prohibit you from using anything else through warranty conditions. 3) I also suspect that they stand to benefit if your bike wears out faster . I can not believe that the same oil can suffice for your bike both in jaisalmer-summer and kashmir-winter IMHO .
Most of the better and more responsible car companies do not make any oil recommendations . They just print a chart of what grade to use under what conditions . There also seems to be some cultural variations to oil recommendation , like in wines .Apparently, the U.S. operations of all of the European marques (MB, BMW, Volvo, Saab, etc.) advise an oil viscosity which is designed to optimize fuel mileage(mobil1 0w40/rotella 5w30 are the most popular), while in Europe car owners are advised to chose an oil to enhance the life of the engine(10w-30, 15w-40, 20w40 etc) . Also don't go by the max temperature given by weather-stations , they use a meteorological cage for measurements in shade , daytime street temperature is much higher in summer here , even the air gets so hot .

thanks for the details,
which grade recommend you for me? just 20w40.
or can use 10w40. which is better for my extreme? in my area available oils are,
castrol, shell etc.