the apache had that suzuki gene and tvs never was able to develop their own platforms expect for victor (correct me if i wrong)like bajaj did for the pulsars from scratch without kawasaki's help.The suzuki gene i talked about was that the base platform for the apaches were suzuki's (fiero's unit) which they seem to gave it away to tvs. Yes of course tvs worked a hell of a lot of sweat on that platform to make the apache,the crouching hooligan it is today and that is something commendable and deserves the full due credit. But,have any one thought of what would have been tvs right now if they hadn't got that base platform from suzuki at the first place.my point is that they are lazy and slow in introducing something indigenous like what BAL had done the pulsars,and IN TERMS OF MARKETING,big copycats of strategies for their products(from pulsars). i am not against the brand apache which i repeat but against tvs's approach towards the brand.Every time i have observed what tvs has been doing for the apache brand and was sad to find that it was and still is mimicking exactly what BAL does for pulsar. In short what tvs is actually doing to apache is creating a copycat image.why tvs ? Brand image and marketing seems to be what is driving the tombstone on the apache if you ask me...tvs if you are listening, stop following bajaj, and take risks and plan well and try to act like bajaj instead of following every move by them and with that i mean,be totally different and stay unique like what bajaj has been doing with their pulsars.wishing all the best for tvs and apache.

Even though I am not an Apache Owner, I am not sure about the reduction in vibrations.. the Apache RTR 160 Hyperedge (definitely one of the longest names) still vibrates more than any other bikes out there. I did not feel a noticeable change.

The engine block and externals of the Fiero and Apache does appear same, but internally the Fiero's engine was a long stroke torquey unit whereas the Apache (expecially the) RTR had a short stroke engine and this happened after Suzuki and TVS parted ways..

..therefore one can't really label that the Apache isn't TVS's effort without Suzuki.

apache was a compleat new platform for tvs rest engine was inspired or rebored .....tell me any thing what tvs copied what BAL did.....

May be your friend doesnt know how to maintain his bike, my friend bought a Hyperedge and its butter smooth... i love it... I have a rugged RTR 180 and i love it too...

@payeng
I dont mean to offend you or start a fight or anything but i think you are cribbing too much about the name... o have seen you talk about it too many times(I read your blog) seriously, does anyone call the P220 and "Bajaj pulsar 220 Speedlines"? NO! they just call it speedlines(my friends do) same goes with other bikes.
I'm a great fan of your blog man. Hope you dont take my comment negatively.

I'm also disappointed with the marketing strategies of TVS and their super slow developments...
I dont mean to hurt the sentiments of anybody but the following is just my observation/opinion or whatever... you can ignore it if you dont like it.
I dont understand why people in this forum are so negative about all brands except bajaj. When Honda did a mistake with nuts and bolts and rectified it then a huge fuss is made about it, but when Duke had mileage problems and vibration problems from headlight assembly, every body is like "Every bike has it drawback, you should live with it.... who wants mileage from a performance bike" and what not.

May be my analyzation of the people on this forum is wrong... but i just felt like writing this because people are trying to bring out every issue TVS had with RTR till now... and i just hate the way people complain about vibrations, dont like it dont buy it! Whats the point cribbing about it, hope i dont start awar

Well "Speedlines" is just marketing speak just like the marketing guys give fancy names like "Blood Red / Scarlet Red" to colors.. but "Hyperedge" is printed on the last (expecting it to be replaced by the latest upgrade) RTR 160's tank scoop.


Nah.. don't worry, none taken.

Can't say Much as I don't indulge in history such as these.

Glad that You agree.


This is where I would like to talk. You say that TVS is copying from BAL, in terms of their strategies for their products, I don't know what the hell do you mean? Are You talking about technologies? Then could You tell Me a bike with 160cc and a FI? Can You Mention Me one bike with ABS in 180 cc? Oh and don't forget the Rear LED 's too!
If You are talking about design, then the Scoops, the specialized Split Grab Rails would like to say something too! Plus the white color too!

If TVS is copying BAL, then why is still a 180cc Apache still the fastest in 0 to 60 in a drag?

So, after reading all these points, would You care to mention how TVS is a copycat image of BAL.

And if You are talking about being unique, one might say that BAL is too copying from a foreign company.

No pun or offence intended, just wanted to clarify the doubts here.

Peace.

OT: Can we say the grab rails of the new Pulsar 200NS is copied from Apache??

Just give a thought: wait for the new Apache to officially introduced and see in flesh and we can then comment what IS wrong, please. While most hate the redesign, lets wait a few days to see the actual product!

Buddy, dont go by the looks of the engine. The RTR internals are totally different, right from the clutch assembly to the transmission they are different. The Fiero [I still have one] had one of the weakest clutch, on my rebored Fiero I have probably changed the clutch plates a dozen times. The RTR on the other hand has one of the strongest clutches can take hell a lot of abuse. They are different, let us give TVS credit where they deserve.

My only wish is the top management at TVS should go else they better sell their R&D unit to Hero, they will lap it up and then we can see the real stuff. TVS has a confused management, they launched a liquid cooled 150 in Indonesia around 6 months back and here they sell the same old engine.

Also a word on their design team, for god sake please outsource it to some european firm else give it to some young boys here at xbhp they will do a better job. How do they approve such poor designs

What i have understand is , xbhp was bajajpulsar.com in past .
So obviously almost all members at that time owning a bike from .....
Now with xbhp these guys also become older ( or call them as senior )
When any other manufacturer bike is making some heat , i don't know what happens to them but they starts pointing all negative thing in that bike or manufacturer & prefer to compare it with ......
Or if they won't then some new guys who owns bike from that same manufacturer starts posting negative things, then the senior guys neither report nor ask those guys to stop posting useless things .
Mods , Admins are late to take action on it .
Which results in a brand war & most of guys view towards xbhp chages .
As "people in this forum are so negative about all brands except ...."

And interesting thing is one of upcoming bike even without testing or ownership they claiming as much more refined & VFM . But no other brands owner have any problem with it , but we are more happy & excited to welcome it . But which won't happen from these guys for other manufacturers bike .

What you did not understand is back in 2008, xBHP server had crashed and 90% users were deleted. How would you explain it now?

Also, I am a Junior Noob too. But I joined a long long time AFTER the name change.

@Saipranav look around outside, on non xBHP platforms and check how is their response to this new Apache.

I don't mean ALL guys owning bike from ..... has that attitude , as i myself have one previously from same manufacturer & i have some friend on xbhp currently owning bike from that manufacturer but don't have that view towards other manufacturer.

But still if you consider yourself as from those guys posting negative things then reread my post above or check below .

BTW i don't want to go further out of topic as this topic is for new Apache RTR & i am waiting to hear the official words from TVS on changes & new things . New product from any manufacturer is always exciting for me .

But how will you explain the following my friend

^^^ Suzuki Fiero Owner
^^^ Hero Honda Karizma owner

^^^ RTR Fi owner

^^^ RTR160, Ninja 650R owner

^^^ RTR160 owner

^^^ Honda CBR250R owner

^^^ Pulsar 180 owner
^^^ Hero Honda ZMR owner

^^^ Hero Honda Karizma R owner

The above is a very small sample set. But most brands have been covered in it. A small sample is also taken from a platform which was not Bajajpulsar.com in the past. So it is not just ..... bike owners who have a problem with this new Apache. So If you do not want the thread to go off topic, I would suggest you to stop making baseless blanket statements.

AND I rest my case.

Is anyone post a time of press conference or whatever it is when TVS is stating official word .

OT : antz.bin make yourself clear & reread my first post in this thread & tell is i mentioned any perticular manufacturer name ? Instead of quoting number of post by different peoples .
I mentioned how most of the peoples here are negative about other brands whose bike is making heat & they feel the position of bike they owning may loose to it .
So first understand the base & then call anyone's comment as baseless.

BTW i already mentioned i don't want to stretch it against anyone personal & go off topic . So please don't invite me in off topic stuff .

They both copied CBZ Xtreme

Dude I don't understand whats the problem with you. In each and every thread you have to blame Bajaj and Bajaj fans.

And people asking question why not Bajaj why TVS/Hero etc. In one liner simple answer the truth & reality is that TVS/Hero just not have done anything big to prove themselves and their flagship bikes are not technically advance as Bajajs. Also global presence wise they are nothing like Bajaj. Please learn to appreciate to praise if Bajaj has done something right. See the awesome lineup of Bajaj bikes. They always correct their bikes. Just everytime. Never have come with such funny upgrades to their flagship bikes. I don't understand why people gang up against Bajaj even if TVS or Hero had done something wrong. I feel sick seeing such attitude.
We bash Bajaj also if they do something wrong. But when they are launching bikes like P200NS why to bash them and why you people(esp @below_all) can't appreciate their efforts is out of my understanding. You guys hate Bajaj just because you see your favourite TVS/Hero not able to catch up with the Bajaj bikes