Engine Oils

[Raccoon]

Any particular reasons. If I know correctly, 15 vs 20 would matter only at lower temperatures say like below 5'C. Have you or any other member personally seen any issues with the Motul5100. I have read on this forum that its a bit thinner than others, but if it does hold the viscosity for a longer time I guess it should be worth it. Correct me if I am wrong

PS: Anything from the Shell stable that fits the bill?

No, its not quite that simple. Not getting into the details... but will be a technically wrong grade to use. As for having issues, its not at all easy to comment... because the effects will likely be seen in the long term. Also, how would you know that Motul5100 holds its viscocity for longer?? Don't decieve yourself into thinking that you can tell visually or thru touch. Yes, you might comment that the bike runs rough after a point, etc... but again thats not the best way to make a statement. Viscocity alone may not be the factor at play in that case! Best and safest option is 1st to choose a product thats technically right.

As for Shell, as far as I can remember their website, they only have a 20W40 for bikes. Don't know if they have any other grade in the market which isn't on their site. Will try and check at the Shell bunk next time I'm there.

[Aparajith]

Is the Helix meant for bikes or cars?

There are two different oils for bikes and cars. Check this: http://www.shell.com/home/content/in...hellhelix.html

[beowulf]

Viscocity alone may not be the factor at play in that case! Best and safest option is 1st to choose a product thats technically right.

hmm..thanks...still not convinced re. the 15 vs 20 thing, will read up more later today
getting back to the question, which 20W50 should I use?
Going by Raccoon's explanation, we dont seem to have many choices (Castrol xtra,valvoline and Veedol)

All P180/200/220 Avy180/200 guys, what do you use?
Dont go by the BAL/BikeZone service centers, all of them blindly use Castrol Power 1 which is 20w40 or some bulk, unnamed 20w50 which doesnt work too well?

Anybody else have any issues/comments/suggesions
Any good/bad experiences

There are two different oils for bikes and cars. Check this: Shell in India - Shell Helix Products

All products I saw in this link are meant for cars..

[torque_ankur]

The Probiking guys(Khivraj BLR) used to put power1 semi-synth in my P200 initially during running-in which is 15W40. It was very good for first 500Kms after that the smoothness drops rapidly.

Which bike do you have?
How many kms do you run in a month?
Your Budget?

I ride P-150DTSI V1 I ride about 2000 KM per month, have done 62000 KM till date, though Power 1 matches my specification that is w40, but your exp. with Power 1 made me think about what alternatives are available, budget is not an issue for me, my main concern is my engine should work at its best all the time.

[Aparajith]

All products I saw in this link are meant for cars..

Check this: Shell in India - Shell Advance - Products

[HydBiker]

Shell HELIX - please be aware that Shell Helix range is for cars and for bikes they have Shell Advance. Before trying Helix in bikes, pls check Shell's Advance oil section - they have a very good flash presentation there, go through it and then you will never try it out.

No you cant use Castrol Power 1 racing in your 220 because its w40 rating and is lesser then the req. rating of your bike which is w50. Look for oils like Valvoline Premium 4T(semi synth) and Motul 300V FL 15W50 (fully synth), they are of the req. rating.

thanks guys for enlightening me regarding the engine oils....

well i actually wanted to have synthetic oil for my bike....now sine you have given me the names and options of other company oils which I can use.....I am having a small query will I get the same result that of Castrol Power1 racing..!! I mean will it be that much smooth etc.!!

Guys, the engine oil grades are given for vehicles based on heat management abilities of those oils. If an xW40 oil had similar or better heat management (pls refer older posts in this thread for engine oil properties) in terms of Viscosity index at 100 degrees centigrade, flash point, etc in comparison to x50 oils, then you can use it instead. Generally fully synthetic oils have much better heat management abilities than mineral oils. I am not trying to contest the very grounds of manufacturers suggesting xW50 oil instead of xW40 here so please do not try to flame upon my post.

Also, when you get Motul 300V FL 15W50 for Rs 700, you'd want to try the Castrol Power1 Racing 10W40 (costs Rs 750) only if you get it at may be half the price. Trust me, Motul 300V is probably the best oil available for P220 now in India.

my Zma gears had becum rock hard, recently shifted to power1, bcoz of power1 im feeling this bloody hardness, plz tell me wut to use guyz plz!

Heard this fro other ZMA users as well, when they used higher viscous oils. But Castrol Power1 is an XW40 semi synth oil... it is not viscous compared to regular oils...

what is the difference b/w diesel and petrol engine oils. how do the affect if used in wrong engines? i have the knowledge of both the engines and the fuel used in them, but im confused about the chemistry of their engine oils....as diesel engine are meant for heavy loads, and high speed (like racing, and trucks n buses) where as petrol engines are used in light vehicles like cars etc....but if we use a diesel engine oil in petrol engine how do it is going to harm our engine???

Dude, if you use a diesel only oil in a petrol engine, you will most likely not see much harm. In fact it will likely clean your engine well. But its not recommended as petrol and diesel specifications are different... as needs are different. For eg. a diesel only oil will likely not be able to cope well with low temp. sludge formation. That said, many oils are certified for both petrol and diesel, and those can safely be used in both engines.

Gys, going by the advancement in technology, please refrain from using oils intended for other type of vehicles. For bikes use only bike specific oils that have a JASO MA or MA2 rating. If an oil doesn't mention this rating, don't use it. API classes do not have a provision for classifying motorcycle oils so it is not the correct measure.

Why dont you just use the Hero Honda oil made by Savita Chemicals / Tide Water / Gulf Oil?
Btw, can anybody here tell me where I can get Gulf Oil products in Pune? Specifically, I want the new 10w30 oil they have launched for Hero Honda.

You got the gulf oil contacts, pls call them. Surprisingly, for a Hinduja Company, they are very very responsive! Also, be vary that the HH oil is also supplied by BPCL (MAK). Instead, Honda oil comes only from Savita (idemitsu) but is only 10w40.

Finally, I could get Gulf 10w30 oil. Wrote to Gulf oil, and someone called me next day to tell me where I can get the oil.

If anyone in Pune wants the oil, it can be had from a shop (with a big Exide Battery board) opposite Karishma Apts in Kothrud. Or mail Gulf to know where its available in your area. Apparently they have 20W40 oil also.

Got it for Rs. 200. MRP mentioned is Rs. 209.

Now, 2 issues about this oil.

1) It seems to be not endorsed by Hero Honda... as there is no such logo or statement to this effect on the pack (the way its written on HH oils made by Idemitsu / BP / Tide water). It seems its only Gulf Oil themselves promoting this oil.

2) The pack simply mentions "Extended Drain Interval". No mention is made about how much!!! The Hero Honda oils clearly mention 6,000 km ( with top-ups at 2,000 km ) as the recommended drain interval. So I assume this oil will not last as long as the Hero Honda oils. If true, this sucks!

The good point is that Gulf Oil claims that the oil exceeds API SL and JASO MA2. The Hero Honda oils are rated to be API SJ.

Gulf claims it to be a Synthetic Blend. I wouldn't read much into that as most such claims (by all companies) are just possible marketing tactics; as none of them declare the synthetic component percentage or any other details.

Can't make any personal comments on the oil as am yet to use it.

You'll be surprised at the result and we're eager to hear your feedback.

Guys, this oil is Gulf Pride 4T Plus 10w30 synthetic blend. Fantastic oil at great price. Have no second thoughts, it is great. This 10W30 is running great in my Victor which is a very hot engine compared to the HH's. Yes, the 20W40 Gulf Pride 4T Plus is better than this with the best gear shifts I ever had and lasted for 4000 KMS without loss in voscosity and colour (I had to drain it to open the engine) and I have no doubts that these oils can last more than 6K KMS without any fuss in a Victor. So, they can last more than that in a HH engine.

BTW, the 10W30 oil is available only in 900 ML cans but the 20W40 is available in both 900 ML and 1L cans.

[Raccoon]

hmm..thanks...still not convinced re. the 15 vs 20 thing, will read up more later today
getting back to the question, which 20W50 should I use?
Going by Raccoon's explanation, we dont seem to have many choices (Castrol xtra,valvoline and Veedol)

All P180/200/220 Avy180/200 guys, what do you use?
Dont go by the BAL/BikeZone service centers, all of them blindly use Castrol Power 1 which is 20w40 or some bulk, unnamed 20w50 which doesnt work too well?

Anybody else have any issues/comments/suggesions
Any good/bad experiences


All products I saw in this link are meant for cars..

Yes, I guess you guys dont have many options for 20W50. I dont see any option for 20W50 Shell bike oil on the site.

Not just BAL... but I had the same experience with my Hero Honda dealer. The #@$&% morons there were going to use loose oil from a barrel into my bike, at the 1st service. I asked them what it was and I got very unsatisfactory and evasive replies. I told them to show me the container... the barrel had BP and MAK painted on it. Whats more, it was 20W40... which is not to be used in the new Hero Hondas (Also, MAK had a pretty low API rating, at least at that time, as against HH's recommended SJ). Older HHs use 20W40 though. I brought this to their notice and they, on the other hand started to teach me how what they are using is the right thing! I don't even know if the oil in the barrel was indeed MAK. For all I know it might be something worse... or even adulterated with used oil, etc. In any case, they used that goooo in all the bikes that come to them for servicing... and they were charging more for it than a bottle of premium oil! And to top it all, they were trying to sell the Bardhal Oil additive trash to all customers... and many were buying!!! After having the session with me, they didnt even try to mention it to me, lol!

Actually, what most garges seem to be doing is to purchase a single brand of (cheap) oil in large quantities, so that they get it at the cheapest rate... and then use it in all vehicles, no matter if its the wrong grade. So beware!

Shame on Hero Honda!

[Sandeep_K_Ram]

^^

One of the things we can't seem to fix after the server crashed, is THIS ^.

This topic was discussed in SO MUCH Detail... its gone now ...sheesh...feel so sad about it.


Anyway the above two posts are bang on the spot about what service center chaps do.


As for SHell Helix - not its not JASO MA certified AFAIK. Correct me if I am wrong.

20W50 - options are limited - VP4T,Motul 300VFL etc...

280 per litre chalta hai ? Then you can get VP4T - SemiSynth ... very good oil.

What about Hitanshu's Veedol ...wasn't he saying that it was the best ever 20W50 mineral he used ?

[beowulf]

^^

This topic was discussed in SO MUCH Detail... its gone now ...sheesh...feel so sad about it.
20W50 - options are limited - VP4T,Motul 300VFL etc...

280 per litre chalta hai ? Then you can get VP4T - SemiSynth ... very good oil.
What about Hitanshu's Veedol ...wasn't he saying that it was the best ever 20W50 mineral he used ?

Lets discuss it again then

My baby needs 1.5lts so the costs increase for me and I cant change as frequently as the other guys.
@sandeep : any feedback re. the motul5100 or castrol Xtra?

Any other Pulsar guys around?? (And I thought that bike was popular..sheesh )

Beo

[Xenologik]

Actually, what most garages seem to be doing is to purchase a single brand of (cheap) oil in large quantities, so that they get it at the cheapest rate... and then use it in all vehicles, no matter if its the wrong grade. So beware!

Shame on Hero Honda!

well exactly. thye do cheat a lot.. and since most people think that "authorized service is the best" they fall for these schemes.. also you might have noted that they take in 20 bikes a day and only 7 mechanics are there usually.. and they revv the engine hard for what joy i dont know. ! I was stunned

they didn't even change my oil .. they just topped it up and billed me the amount for a the full 900 ml bottle. also my toolkit was stolen from the bike and they denied it.

btw verified the HH oil here. its not made by BP (MAK) , its labeled IDEMITSU and made by savita chemicals. its a good oil


regarding adulteration.. well I HOPE we do not need to worry about that here. because adulteration cannot be verified without a lab report . i hope the oil we get are genuine. sheesh.

[Raccoon]

Well, this Hero Honda service centre (Automark Motors, Paud Road, Kothrud, Pune. Same as United Agency) takes the cake. There are loads other things I can write about it, besides the oil thing. I think a roadside mechanic would be far better and safer than giving it to such centres. What I'm amazed is that the number of customers they get, in spite of the way it functions.

Whats more, they dont stock the Hero Honda oil at all. Now isn't that amazing? Is Hero Honda sleeping? I had to go far to get the Idemitsu can from another HH dealer. Apparently this other dealer was using only HH oil bottles for everyone... they way it should be.

As for revving the bike... why did you allow it? Thats why its always best to be there when they work on your bike. These things will continue as long as people put up with it.

As for your toolkit, its standard procedure at most service centers that customers should not leave toolkits or anything when given for servicing. Best to remember that.

[prajwalkashyap]

If u leave the toolkit in, then make sure they mention that in the jobcard. else it's sure to be stolen.

Prajwal

[beowulf]

Hey...
you guys forgot about the engine oils...
may the toolkit stealing guys rot in hell etc...

lets get back to talking engine oils...

[Xenologik]

Well okay okay let's discuss some Liquid Engineering

There's less to choose in the 10W30 grade,

what I do not get is,
Unicorn and CBZ-xtreme have the same engine config excluding the cam profile. Now Unicorn is fed with the 20W40 Honda oil (confirmed today) whereas my bike is fed with the 10W40 Oil, now why this lesser grade ? it works fine no doubt. But then even the Unicorn should run on the 10W30 Oil.

I do not know whether the Unicorn heats more than the CBZ-x thus requiring the 20W40 oil. can anyone throw some light on this matter?

[Raccoon]

Hey...

may the toolkit stealing guys rot in hell etc...

And while they are there, may the devil fry them in adulterated engine oil...

Frying aside, the auto industry is moving towards thinner oils. I reckon we will see more options for 10W30, etc, in future...