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Thread: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

  1. #1
    Rusted N-o-v-i-c-e's Avatar
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    Icon6 The POWERHOUSE Fz18

    Hello guys.....So here i am writing about my hot rodded bike. Please do excuse me for my poor literature skills.

    The story begins in the nearby past.....I bought a FZ hoping it would be a beast to drive.

    Although it never disappointed me in ANY aspect other than Power....It felt underpowered for its own robust chassis.

    Then began the quest for MORE power...How nice it would be if the bike could have all the power it can really handle..

    I didnt want to part with my bike after having it for more than 3 years...it was almost like selling one's own limb...

    That is when it occurred to me. How about i can keep my bike and have its power bumped up too.
    Had been following all the stories about the mutant FZ's being created by the dark arts specialist 'Joel'.

    Finally took the plunge last month(August)....ordered some goodies from the master....

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    Sorry for the bike quality. Took the pics on the night it was built and took for a small ride.
    Will post some clean bike pics soon.

    By now you all seem to be familiar with the parts offered by Joel. Nevertheless i will write briefly about them for the sake of this thread.

    1. Bigbore kit.

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    It comes with the race piston and the cylinder block. Very robust quality i must say. The sleeve work and piston finish were upto the mark.

    2. FFE.

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    The exhaust was sparkling as a jewel to my eyes. Never was i ever so mesmerized by anything chrome.
    It comes with a db killer. But my advise would be to avoid it atleast until the run-in of the bike.
    Coz we wont be ripping the bike like hell during run-in, so the noise levels would be minimum.


    3. Hotter camshaft.

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    This is a mild lift camshaft. i.e. less than 1mm lift. Retains the valve opening for a tad longer than the stock one.
    Which results in better fuel intake and hence more power available to you.

    4. Stock replacement air filter.

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    This is the high flow stock replacement air filter. Note the porous mesh in the first pic. Will need frequent cleaning than the stock one.
    But definitely breathes better than stock filter.

    5. Altered geometry for the Head.

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    Alteration to the ports. And some other tricks as well. Can say only that much.


    The Experience of modifying:

    I have zilch knowledge about modifying an engine. So started to spend some time at my friend who eventually helped me build it.

    So after getting the parts it took another week to get some free time to get the bike fit with all the magic parts.

    I must add that the parts are truly as Joel would say PLUG and PLAY.

    Really man. There was no need to alter or modify any of the stock parts at all. The parts fit perfectly as stock ones.

    Although you have to get some gaskets and stuff before installing the new parts, these are NOT major headache.

    They are easily available at your nearby Yamaha SVC.

    I apologize for not having taken the pics during the installation as promised to some of the my friends here.
    I was so excited in getting my hands dirty with oil that i totally forgot about the pics.

    THE RIDE:

    Once the built was done i fired the engine for the first time.
    The sweet bassy sound of the exhaust filled our ears and for a moment there i couldn't hear anything else.

    I took her out for a ride.
    At first it felt nothing special. The rpm meter was hovering around the idleing mark of 1200rpm.

    But as the rpm rose to 2k rpm i felt something had changed drastically. Yes, the next instance the meter was on 4k rpm and climbing.
    The burst of power was unbelievable. And here i was thinking what just happened.

    The beast had awakened now and truly worth being called the Lord of the Streets.
    I rode her sanely below 4k rpm for the next two days. Actually it was only a small 20km ride.
    Didnt get time from work to truly belt her out.

    The third day i thought of taking her to the highway.
    So i went to start the bike and at the first crank the bike felt as if the piston half revved and stopped.

    I didnt get it. The battery was replaced during the installation of these parts.
    So called up Joel. He said the it is the tight, high compression piston at work.

    After some cranks the bike started and i took her to the highway. This day it was a bit different.
    The bike started breathing intermittently in the rpm range.

    Even then the bike touched 100 in no time for first time after the build.
    Although it was for a brief moment and i immediately brought down the speed.
    This was when i realized for sure that the magic has worked. And the bike wasnt even WOT.

    There are a few adjustments to be done before it rages like a Bull.
    But till then i am happy to have had a moment of nirvana.

    Truly the bike has changed to the meaner and faster.
    I thank you all for joining me in this quest and helping me out.

    Cheers...

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    Thread Approved and Moved
    Advice is a form of nostalgia.
    Dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than it's worth.

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    First of all, congrats buddy for your new meaner and faster ride, do update us after when the run-in period will finish about the things....

    Missing those installation re-bore pictures....

    Enjoy & ride safe...
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    An IT Engineer by profession and a rider by soul.


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    Default Beginners Questionnaire!



    EDITED (30-12-2013): Based on popular request...



    STATUTORY WARNING:

    To all the readers especially NOOBS: It has been observed that a lot of new riders, in pursuit of more power tend to get carried away by the marketing gimmicks of a certain company and a person in question. Even after being routed/guided to this thread, most of the readers just go through the initial pages and then naturally assume that the so called performance kits in question has provided the respective users a great bundle of joy and happily ever after scenario without having to face any repercussions.

    Unless you read and go through the whole ownership log, you will not understand the nature of mods how it led one from bad to worse in a very short span of time!

    I donot wish to spoon feed anyone here
    and expect the reader of this thread to go through every log and understand the result of getting drawn into marketing gimmicks by a certain someone without asking valid questions at the first place and later regretting the decision financially and mentally..

    As you manage to finish half the pages of this thread, you will also realise the vast amount of data and knowledge shared by a lot of senior riders which i hope will enlighten one about how an engine functions and what things are needed to be considered before jumping and straight away purchasing free flow exhausts, Performance air filter etc. and at a later stage also understand how the snake oil products are still getting sold to the unsuspecting customers..

    Keeping in line with the history of this thread, the original pages have been left untouched/un-edited so that one understands how the initial enthusiasm turn sour later with huge bills and financial losses in the pursuit of more power. At the same time one will also understand what the thread starter and the one writing this post gained in return.. So unless you go through all the pages properly DONOT MAKE ASSUMPTIONS AND REACH TO A CONCLUSION QUICKLY!!


    NOTE:
    Bigger fonts have been deliberately chosen so that none of the lazy readers miss the instructions mentioned above clearly...





    Quote Originally Posted by shv18 View Post
    Hi N-o-v-i-c-e,

    no need to keep it hush hush mate . Anyways to keep it simple for the Noobs and inquisitive members i will chime in and hopefully experienced riders like Lucky Luke, MadMik, Abhimanyu31 and other senior riders will also put forward their expert perspectives on the same. If someone is more inquisitive regarding the technical aspects of the power up kit and things related to it.. please do visit this thread for more info: http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/pit-stop...tech-talk.html It is very informative for the serious riders and also Noobs can understand their build better.

    The initial worry which every new rider, who is keen on getting his ride hot rodded has :

    1) Are the FZ power up Kits from Race Concepts reliable? Would you recommend Race Concepts Kits to anyone?

    ANS: Yes if the installation is done correctly. There has been a major debate going on about this on xbhp. Some are saying that the kit fails in 5000 kms and there are others who swear by it and have already clocked over 25,000 kms without any glitch. Personally as per my experience yes they are reliable. However, to avoid any confusion and unnecessary debate on this especially in this thread, i would request the members, Noobs and visitors to kindly hold onto their horses and let N-o-v-i-c-e and me post our ownership experience as we continue clocking more miles with the RC build and would periodically update this thread with our 'story so far' with the build.

    Would we recommend the kits to anyone? Well the answer is bit complicated then a simple YES or NO. It purely depends on what are you looking for:

    a) If you are the type of rider who wants a lot of power without losing out on factory warranty, reliability, doesn't like to tinker around with his bike at all and has a very limited budget: then our recommendation is to save money and opt for a bike with a bigger motor. Hot roding is purely about greasy hands! working with your bike, tuning etc. as per your requirement: pushing the boundary of a stock bike's limitations to its maximum.. so definitely not your cup of tea if you fall in this category.

    b) If you are the type of rider/enthusiast who wants to have the current underdog bike with lots of power hidden inside, is willing to spend money, time and effort to get the maximum out of your bike's engine and would first like to consult before beating the drums when troubleshooting a problem then a big YES!! You may choose to get into this world of madness!!

    What Race Concept offers are ready made kits which fit directly in your FZ/Fazer's engine without any machining, sleeving or any other expertise required from a local mechanic to get the build done right which is not the case when say you intend to plonk in a piston from a Pulsar 200 onto your bike in your pursuit to get more power.

    Rest: the ownership experience shall be covered in the later posts.

    2) Are the power up kits truly "plug and play"?

    ANS: Yes they are indeed plug and play. HOWEVER, an important thing to keep in mind is some parameters and protocols are needed to be followed step by step when the installation is taking place.. Same shall be covered extensively later to help Noobs understand that if they have ordered the RC parts and want to get the installation done locally by a mechanic; they can follow these steps and ensure that the build has taken place correctly as the engine has a lot of moving parts it is imperative that the things are screwed up tightly with correct measurements.

    Things to note:

    1) Due to the high compression nature of the kits: if you are living in cities and towns where premium fuel quality of minimum RON 91 is not available then chances are you may experience engine knocking. The same has been found to be absent with the riders who are based in B cities and Metropolitan cities like Mumbai, Bangalore and Delhi.

    2) As of now the Throttle Position Sensor(TPS) which is present in the Stock BS 26 carburettor, currently cannot be made to work with the BS 29mm nor the 33mm CV caburettor offered by Race Concepts. Thus, one has to lock it on full mode in order to get maximum power. As a result: the engine warning light will remain glowing constantly! It is not a problem though many riders are divided over this. More on TPS functioning and things pertaining to it has been covered at later posts.

    The only headache/problem that everyone is bound to face is with tuning specifically, the BS 29 carburettor as people living in different cities at different altitudes and temperatures will change the way the tuning needs to be done to make the fuelling work just right. So it is recommended to acquire various jet sizes from your local automobile spares shops or taking help from the members of xbhp to get the tune set right. More on this shall be covered in the later posts.

    3) What is the expected gain in BHP? Can we have DYNO Figures as a proof?

    ANS: The expected power gain is 4-6 bhp based on the condition of the base engine. As much as N-o-v-i-c-e and the group of crazy hot roders (includes me as well ) would love to do a dyno run, there are simply no dynos available in Mumbai/ Pune to do the runs on. Me and Abhimanyu31 have literally exhausted our breaths looking for Dyno shops and tuners garage in Mumbai who would let us folks to do a run and put an end to the so called debatable power output claim to rest once and for all. But to our disappointment none of them have it.

    So Gents, if any of your rich uncle owns a DYNO in Mumbai/Pune and would allow us to do a run in our respective bikes (we will pay for it!!) let us know please. until then, one will have to wait for the Dyno data.

    Alternative option is to use GTECH PRO RR FANATIC data logging kit which is similar to RACELOGIC VBOX data logging unit; an industry standard equipment used by all the magazines like AUTOCAR, TOP GEAR INDIA, OVERDRIVE, TOP GEAR UK MAG & TV SHOW, FIFTH GEAR TV SHOW UK, Car & Bike TV shows etc. both internationally and in India to show true speed, gear ratios etc. (Whatever extra geeky stuff one gets to read on those mags and TV shows!!). Both the Units use minimum of 9-10 GPS Satellites at a bandwith of over 10HZ to measure the variables accurately. GTECH PRO RR FANATIC unit provides data GUI in Graphs of Horse Power at the rear wheel, torque, 0-100kmph acceleration figures, 100 kmph -0 deceleration figures, Gs pulled during the run, elevation from the sea while the run/the record was made, track lap data and other parameters. The data is 100% accurate.That is the closest quantifiable data that can be provided by us for experienced users and Geeks as well.

    I would let respected senior rider Abhimanyu31 to talk about such geeky stuff as i am not well versed with it and the gentlemen has a nack for explaining complex stuff into simple language understandable by people who have attended english medium high school atleast !! Ofcourse as in when time permits him to fill in here for sure.

    4) What are the power up kits for Yamaha FZ provided by Joel, Race Concepts? What is the cost/price?

    ANS: Joel at the moment provides the following build:

    * 182 cc Big Bore Kit: 182 cc Semi Forged piston, piston rings, Big Bore Cylinder,

    * Mild Lift Camshaft

    * Altered port geometry of the cylinder head (One will have to ship it to Joel if they are doing the build outside his workshop) for better flow of gases inside the cylinder for volumetric efficiency

    * Carburetor options:

    a) 29mm CV Carburettor: A must upgrade along with the BB kit to allow better atomised fuel in the combustion chamber.

    b) 33mm Semi Flat CV Carburettor: An extreme update which allows one to beat other exotics to dust because of the aggressive nature of the way it pushes the fuel to the combustion chamber (More on this later)

    * Air Filter options:

    a) Simota Stock replacement air filter: It fits directly inside the AIS Box and definitely assists in engine breathing better to generate more power.

    b) Simota 50mm Conical air filter: A mandatory upgrade along with the 33mm semi flat race carburetor to give your ride the punch!! (More details on that later folks!!)

    * Free Flow Exhaust: With extra power comes extra gases. free flow allows the exhaust gases move out of the engine efficiently and doesn't restrict it like the Stock pipe. Engine revs like crazy and also increase over all bhp gains.

    * Stiffer Racing Clutch Springs: Reduces Clutch transmission losses and good for aggressive blipping of the clutch.

    * Programmable CDI: This allows the user to select 8 different settings for controlling the ignition spark. (It is still in development stage at the moment!)

    For pricing details please contact Joel at: joel@raceconcepts.in or the facebook link:Race Concepts | Facebook

    5) Ok so now i have purchased the power up kits from Race Concepts and did the installation as suggested on this thread. How should i do my run-in? Can i follow Motoman technique?

    ANS: In the golden words of rider Aargee, you are free to follow "Motoman, Patlaman and whatever man you may choose...", just don't come running back to Race Concepts complaining about engine seizure due to your acts of experimentation with your bike and then ruining the kit. Not that Motoman technique is not right.. I would say leave it for the pros. Unless you know how to correct things should something go wrong with your ride don't do it.

    General principal for Noobs and people who have absolutely no idea about souped up/tuned/modified engine; In a Big Bore kit, the tolerances of the Piston rings are very tight. So it is wise to follow a simple and yet company recommended style of break in for your now souped up engine:

    * Ground '0' - 500kms - Revs under 4,500 rpm:
    First warm up the engine for atleast 30-45 seconds and then commence with your run in ride.One should constantly modulate the throttle, do gear changes constantly to put the engine through various load. At times, very gently take the ride all the way to 7000 rpm and then leave the throttle. In this way you are introducing the engine to various stresses but within a limit. Make sure that in this stage that you do warm up the engine properly before commencing for a ride.

    If you are really trying hard to finish the run in fast, say 300 kms in a day.. take a break and let the engine cool off for about 10-15 mins after every 100 kms. Will be good for your butt too!!

    * 500 - 1000 kms - Revs upto 6000 rpm:
    Same as above, keep on modulating the throttle and do gear changes to put the engine through various loads. Do the engine oil change at 1000 kms. Mik, Luke and Muztarique have already had a good discussion regarding the engine oil change during run-in period so noobs and other readers will have to do a little bit of hard work and check out the FZ ownership thread regarding the same.

    Same as above; first warm up the engine for atleast 30-40 seconds, keep the engine under 4000 rpm for first 2-3 kms. Once, engine warms up then you can take her upto 6000 rpm.

    * 1000 - 2000 kms:
    You are free to ride her all the way to red line. However, i would suggest that keep the hard acceleration under control and let the engine get used to the conditions more often.
    Same as above: Warm up the engine and then go ahead riding her at higher rpms.

    * Post 2000 kms:
    You have the right to go insane!!
    Same as above: Warm up the engine first and then...well you can belt the daylights out of her now.

    HOWEVER
    , Noobs please bear in mind that just because you have an semi forged piston doing the duty in your engine now, it doesnot mean that you can just keep her on the redline WOT (Wide Open Throttle) for over 20+ kms nonstop. The engine life will get reduced just like it would on a stock engine. Besides that do whatever you like. If you follow these pointers, the RC BB engine will be bullet proof and will provide you miles and miles of happiness.

    6) But the above style of break in is so boring!! Do i really have to follow that? Joel said that the run in is only 500 kms?

    ANS: Joel has indeed mentioned that the run-in is only 500 kms. However, this is a precautionary measure especially for the Noobs, so that none of the souped up rides read FZ/Fazers ever remotely have a chance of running into any trouble and then later start hate threads without questioning why it happened, how could i have adverted it, what is the next logical step to be followed etc? Recommending it just as a safety measure so only good for you and your ride.

    7) Ok i have followed everything till now. But the big question remains 'Maintenance', Do i need to take any special care or maintenance? Can i service this bike in a local mechanic's shop/SVC or do i have to go to Race Concepts for the same?

    ANS: No.. no special care or maintenance is needed. You can service your souped up ride in any local mechanic's shop/SVC like you would with your stock bike. The only thing you have to keep in mind are the "Valve clearance" measurements/ Tappet settings are slightly different than that of the stock bike. Race concepts will provide you the details on the same. Besides that there are no special service intervals. care etc. required for servicing or anything.

    However, an important thing to keep in mind is with much tighter tolerances compared to stock block, it is recommended to start and let the engine idle and warm up properly for atleast 45 seconds to a minute whenever the engine is cold. This is to ensure that the engine oil gets circulated across the engine internals and also the engine reaches the operating temperature quickly.


    More on maintenance shall be covered in the later posts as we both cover more kms on our respective bikes.

    8) Sometimes when i try to crank the engine to life.. It takes longer to start? Why is it so? This never used to happen with my stock bike? Is there any problem with my ride?

    ANS: Please remember you have a completely souped up/modified ride. If you have gone for the Mild Lift camshaft, then this may be more evident. Nothing is wrong with your ride and nothing to worry. All you need to do is to apply a little throttle when cranking the engine to life. Post 1st service at 1000 kms the cranking thing will become less evident.

    9) Which engine oil should i use in my souped up/Joelled/modified ride now?

    ANS: You may use the same engine grade oil as specified by the OEM manufacture. i.e. Yamaha. However, to witness better high revving fun, i would recommend shifting to Semi Synthetic oil or Fully Synthetic oil. Motul is my personal favorite as they are known specifically to manufacture engine oil for bikes only so would highly recommend the same.

    * Mineral Grade: Motul 3000V 4T 20W 40
    * Semi Synthetic Grade: Motul 5100
    * Fully Synthetic Grade: Motul 300V 4T 15W 50 Double Ester or Motul7100 4T 20W 50 Single Ester

    FS oil is a better bet and recommended with the RC kits as the tolerances are extremely tight.

    10) I have heard a lot about the "stitching noise" complaints from the current FZ/Fazer RC kitted bike users which is made due to the mild lift camshaft. Is it true? Are there any problems from it in the future?

    ANS: Yes with a hotter camshaft being used there will be noise emitting from the engine bay. The Race Concepts mild lift camshaft does generate a "Stitching noise" as one goes to higher revs. To eliminate/minimise this, Joel usually recommends removing the decompression unit and setting the valve clearances to 0.06mm inlet and 0.08mm exhaust.

    However, the reports so far haven't been very positive in this regard even after following Joel's recommendation. Some riders have experienced the noise dying down to a negligible level whereas as some have witnessed the sound emitted to remain prominent even after repeated valve clearances. More on this shall be covered later.



    Please excuse the pun.. extensive punching the keys and now my fingers hurt from writing so much.. Will write more and update this post in the next lot.. till then Ciao! Cheers,
    Last edited by shv18; 12-30-2013 at 05:22 PM. Reason: Updating and adding more info as when i remember
    A quote by a toilet, " use me well, keep me clean, i would never tell anybody whatever i have seen.." :P

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    Hey Novice,

    can you describe about the run-period? How it must be followed? of what kms? and what RPM range?

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    Rusted N-o-v-i-c-e's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antz.bin View Post
    Thread Approved and Moved
    Thanks for the approval. But i really didnt expect it to be moved to this section while ALL other Joel modded bikes are in the Pit stop section.

    I would appreciate it if you are KIND enough to move it back for better exposure to the intended masses.

    Quote Originally Posted by shv18 View Post
    Hi N-o-v-i-c-e,

    no need to keep it hush hush mate . Anyways to keep it simple for the Noobs and inquisitive members i will chime in and hopefully experienced riders like Lucky Luke, MadMik, Abhimanyu31 and other senior riders will also put forward their expert perspectives on the same.............................................. ...................................

    Cheers,
    Hi shv18.
    Thanks for chipping in with the extensive noob and expert gyaan. That would ensure, for time being, all the answers regarding the RC parts.

    I too am searching foe a Dyno. There are Dyno's here in every automobile company in Pune but they just wont let me use it.
    Will let you know if anything works out from my side.

    Quote Originally Posted by jonahmano View Post
    Hey Novice,

    can you describe about the run-period? How it must be followed? of what kms? and what RPM range?
    Hi, the run-in is to be done as in any other new bike.

    Keep it below 4k rpm until 500km and thereafter you can gradually take it to 6-7k rpm up until 1000km.

    From engine safety perspective it would be better if we avoid redlining the bike before 1000km.

    cheers....
    Last edited by N-o-v-i-c-e; 09-24-2012 at 02:52 PM.

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    Default Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

    @shiv: thank you so much for the details, would love to know about that carb and it's working.
    Also if it's possible do some acceleration tests will ya :-D and bless us noobs with videos.

    Sent from my WT19i using Tapatalk 2
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    Riding a motorcycle is like living in a video game where people are trying to kill you.

    Rjays swift riding jacket reviewed in detail || Cramster twister gloves reviewed

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    Quote Originally Posted by N-o-v-i-c-e View Post
    Thanks for the approval. But i really didnt expect it to be moved to this section while ALL other Joel modded bikes are in the Pit stop section.

    I would appreciate it if you are KIND enough to move it back for better exposure to the intended masses.
    Moderators: I can only second that request. I have not even been able to find where it is now???? (haven't searched the whole forum though. I cannot see any logic (for us, simplistic users...) in this thread being anywhere but in the pit stop section. So, please....
    I would even suggest, if n-o-v-i-c-e agrees, that it could be moved inside the "modified FZ16, Fazers, etc... tech talk" one, or in the other FZ18 "Joelled" thread (FZ on steroids by Race Co0ncepts), instead of having everyone who has done something on his bike opening his own thread (my humble opinion...).
    Last edited by Lucky Luke; 09-24-2012 at 06:09 PM.
    When I do something stupid, my consolation is to know that I'll do the worse one only once!

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    Hi N-o-v-i-c-e,

    To start off the thread on a right note, if time permits would request you to kindly initiate the whole scene of how you started your research on the subject. What point you learned from discussing your queries before you started the build. What precautions were kept in mind while you did your build. How long it took to complete your build.

    Also mention about the stock Carb Vs the 29mm carb and Semi Flat carbs.. a little bit of general tech talk would make this thread more productive and such info would help the Noobs to understand the whole process better.

    Don't worry about the vocabulary or the command of english lang.. the important part is that you share your experience.

    @Mods: I would too like to put forward a request to move this thread to pit stop and general biking discussion as that's where all the discussions pertaining to to this topic are taking place. Would appreciate it. Thanks.


    Cheers,
    Last edited by shv18; 09-24-2012 at 07:05 PM.
    jonahmano likes this.
    A quote by a toilet, " use me well, keep me clean, i would never tell anybody whatever i have seen.." :P

  10. #10
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    I don't think this must be clubbed with 200cc modified FZ16, Fazers, tech talk bikes thread. Though it can be moved from Desi bikes to pit stop but I think I and shv and all others who have done with their modds can fill this thread.

    Thanks Novice about the run-in information. If I'm not wrong Shv has suggested me to take the run-in duration till 2000kms.

    Please do tell us about the mileage in the run-in period as this is the only time you will ride the bike sanely
    Lucky Luke likes this.

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