Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Have been away for a long time now.. Let me share my story too

Its been more than 20,000kms with big bore.

33mm Carb & Simota air filter have been lying idle for a few months now. Have wrote it off as a loss.

Have reverted to stock exhaust since FFE is rusting badly at some areas, mainly because the battery acid leaked on that portion The low end grunt from stock exhaust has been quite a help in my off roading stint these days and no annoying backfiring like in FFE which always irritated me!!

Performance wise, I have no issues now. Getting a FE of 35-40kmpl for sane highway riding (< 100kmph). Riding consistently above 110kmph drops the FE to 30-35kmpl.
The engine oil consumption is minimal *touchwood*! It is a known fact that RTR consumes FS oil, so using semi synthetic these days and the level has been the same for 2700+kms.

Found a good mechanic to take care of the regular needs of the bike. Feeling a lot relieved after I gave up on hot rodding! The amount of hassles involved is simply not worth it, unless you have a trustworthy tuner like Motozone etc. Will have a look at the engine internals in the next service or so, praying that everything would be fine.



It feels very bad that people are rarely who we think they are. Had held that person in such high regard once upon a time and now I am ashamed that I even started a thread praising about the kits!


Anyways, now that Race Dynamics are offering Dyno tests, sab doodh ka doodh, paani ka paani ho jayega! (Translate : Everything will be revealed) They were offering free runs last week but sadly I couldnt make it.


@abhimanyu31 : I never thought he would stoop to this level!! How can someone even think of chiseling a piston??


@shv18 : You have done an amazing job mate! I would suggest you to make a blog with details of your hot rodding journey from day 1 and share the link on your signature. This thread has become too vast for any newbie to read fully and they will simply get lost in the middle.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Damn those love bite marks on the piston top looks eerily similar to the piston sent to lucky luke or mad mik (can't remember properly) by haryono for fz 200cc haryono who was bashed in the modified fz 16 thread and the tooner was praised for his ground breaking research in the field of IC engines ( dude pass me the pot please :banghead: :banghead: )
This proves one thing that both haryono and the acclaimed tooner are 2 sides of same coin and are rip off merchants


Sent from my GT-I9100 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Honestly, a better job could be done at a local ledh or even at home with a file.

I cant imagine some poor guy actually running with this piston. Its a disaster waiting to happen.

Sent from my GT-I9001 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Regarding the advertisement, I would request you to go through the Business Questionnaire in the very first page of this thread and also please read the below line carefully.


at all you are still keen on getting safe but higher performance from your vehicle, the only thing i would recommend will be the Head porting and polishing work and the Street high lift camshaft from Motozone along with their race CDI

Initially Shiv18 was very happy about the set up and he recommended RC everywhere. I had seen some thanks giving posts in FB as well. Also jonahmano had mentioned that he and his friend thought that Shiv18 is the chamcha of RC. So you decide on the advertising part now.

If you are getting your bike into hot roding arena, then you should keep in mind that you are screwing up the reliability of your stock bike. Whether it may be Motozone or RC, no one can give you the reliability of the stock.They can just compete with each other but they can never dream of competing with the stock set up in terms of reliability. Just for that 1 or 2bhp bump in power, we are spending thousands of hard earned money. Instead we can sell the existing machine and can go for bigger ones and have a peaceful mind without worrying about reliability etc.

Thanks,
Puneeth

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18


Oh no..I remember when we met last time i told you and Rakesh i was facing problems with Tooner and the FFE. Still you got into the trap

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

I hardly think he was advertising, he was enthusiastic, like someone who gets a new toy. Whatever he experienced, he laid out in black and white for the world to see. I agree, someone who wanted to go in for a "Plug and Pray kit" might have been minded to do so after his initial reviews, but he hardly asked people to go buy it. I read reviews of helmets, gloves and other riding gears (to give an example). Some are very glowing, some are not. It is up to me to decide what is right for me and then go ahead.
Another example is using HDEO's in gasoline engines. I started using Shell Rimula R4 after reading all the pros (and no cons) about it, not just in this forum, but other forums as well. No one forced me to go ahead with using those, there was a very clear warning stated "Use at your own risk" by senior members.

As for your second paragraph, totally agreed, and that is the conclusion [MENTION=32641]shv18[/MENTION] also posted. The time, money and effort spent in the bike was astounding. At least, he persisted, where others just gave up and didn't come back to these forums to give their feedback.

Finally, this thread was very very informative, not just because of the information shared, but the way it was presented, everything was laid out in such a way that even a layman could understand the drawbacks of this kind of engine modification.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

@Puneeth max and @Team Torque: Before commenting anything on my behalf, i would first request both of you gentlemen to go through the pages of the thread see the report logs properly. If you would have taken the time reading some of the recommended books on the "proper way of hot roding" on this thread, you wouldn't have made the remarks earlier.

Gas flow porting/Head Porting and Polishing is nothing but the process making the flow of the AF charge into the combustion chamber better. The video links below should give you an idea of what exactly is done in the process:

Cylinder Head 106 - Casting & Porting Tech - YouTube


Classic Car Porting Heads for Power - YouTube



As the video links above suggest, during the process of sand mould casting of an an engine head, a lot of excess metal/ casting marks are left out inside which is not cleaned due to cost factor and mass production. With the process of Head port and polishing based on the nature of the build, the tuner gets rid of these extra metal bumps inside the head and based on calculations tries and improve the flow of the AF charge, thus making the engine volumetrically as efficient as possible. The whole game here is to make the flow AF charge as better as possible.

In Noob terms, imagine a group of riders going from from point A to point B and riding on Yamuna express highway or a butter smooth road where one can really throttle hard to reach the destination as quickly as possible and in another case a group of riders taking pot holed riddled roads to reach the same destination point B.

Now who will reach their destination faster? Here:

* Riders are the AF charge
* Head porting reflects the butter smooth highways.
* And the destination is the combustion chamber

So in theory, better the flow of charge = More fuel and air inside the combustion chamber = more power and more efficient engine. However, the trick here is to get things right. A wrongly ported head will reduce the speed of the of the AF or even block it thus starving the engine of fuel and air mixture. As a result, reducing the overall power output and efficiency of the engine.

My experience of first The Race Concept's ported head:



Pic 1: RC ported head.

In very basic language, if you look at the image above, one will notice the quality of work done is same as the valve recess marks left out on @abhimanyu31 's shared piston image. The intake and the exhaust ports also had uneven surfaces and the amount of metal that was shaved off was done without calculating the rate of flow from the carburettor to the intake port. Thus, as some of my earlier pages would reflect no matter how many variations of bigger jets were tried on my vehicle, the spark plug would always show a leaner mixture, knocking was predominant and the engine heat was quite evident.

Finally when we bolted on Motozone's version of their prototype ported head, without any alterations done with the jetting or the fuel requirement, the AF charge to the cylinder improved drastically and it also reflected on the spark plug colour after plug chop tests were conducted. All this information along with data has been logged in the earlier pages of the thread. I don't know whether both of you gentlemen consider this a clear evidence but common sense tells me that the latter tuning house knows what they are doing in comparison to the Tooner.

For a street build; If done correctly, a combination of head porting along with a good street cam will improve the performance without compromising on the life and reliability of the engine; something which the parts supplier has no experience of.

Coming back to my recommendation of a certain combo of ported Head + Cam + CDI. It is purely based on my experience with the quality of work that was observed at the installation, during the usage of the product on my vehicle and finally honestly reflected by the Motozone team in letting me know what can i expect and what will i lose out on in comparison to the stock set up.

These kits are also backed up by their after sales service and support which if one checks out the history, is non-existent with RC.

In the end, my recommendation for Motozone kits are specifically for a hot roding enthusiast who understands a thing or two about what to expect out of such work, the cost for per bhp increase and what is the nature of the build he is looking for. For a simple street build without altering anything by installing a BB kit or anything else, this is one of the simplest mods one can start with which doesn't hamper the life of the engine. As the earlier pages on the thread suggest: It is not a marketing campaign for Noobs to go ahead, purchase kits in the pursuit of power without spending much from their wallet. But I do hope after reading this thread most of the Noobs by now know a thing or two about proper hot roding, how a carburettor functions etc.

I am not putting a gun on anyone's head to force them and make a purchase of the same. In reality as per my experience, i now know that there exists a proper tuning house instead of a parts supplier who know their job and don't fleece their customers. Hence, the same has been shared on this thread for anyone interested in taking the route of hot roding without getting their hands dirty and letting a professional take over the job knowing that they won't be fleeced like in the case of the Tooner with the state of the art (read FART) semi forged pistons developed inhouse which blow up in a very short span..

I hope this clarifies everything.


Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Shv18..save your latest post, since I have a feeling you may have to post it again later...

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Sir,

I have decided not to reply or entertain anything else after this post. This thread is an open book, has everything in it : experience, logs, data and technical explanation for all those who are interested.

Every person has been gifted free will, an ability to think and have the decision making capabilities. I have already acknowledged my earlier mistakes in public and i sincerely believe i don't have to keep on justifying anything anymore..

I hope we do get to see more riders sharing their long term experience with hot roding and in that process if collectively we are able to share and learn from each other, i would be glad to contribute more.


Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

I agree with the content and spirit of what you have posted.

We live by our choice and decisions.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Thank you @stefanm for sharing your experience.

Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

I am very much aware of the risks involved with modding Puneeth. I have spent close to 1 lac till date on my FZ JFYI . I have had my bad experiences as well. I am not denying any of those either. The line that you have quoted me was in fact said by shv18, NOT ME . I realised the for the fact that in greed of more power, I was indeed ruining it even worse.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Hello guys. I am back from my hot rodding hiatus now.

Have read all the posts since my last post on this thread. I thought now i ought to reply lest being branded an absconder.

First thing first, I was away coz my right eye got injured and as I am typing this, at this very moment, I am partially blind.
Had a small work accident but it left a big scar on my life. My fate just loves to hit and hit and hit me.

Mind you, please, I am not writing this for you people sympathies but to clear the air about my absence for such a long time. PERIOD.
Especially when all the senior riders have jumped in and shared their stories. Also coz of a new development at my end which
shall be revealed later.

I too need to conclude about my side of the story.

It was nice to read more people had come out of the closet to share about their tragic losses w.r.t a certain tuner(tooner as the accepted word now).
Also it was heartbreaking to know that the number of people being duped by this tooner seems to be endless.

Before starting this thread, I too got excited whenever I got to read about the tooner's bullet proof reliable kits doing wonders in various threads.

So I said to myself I too need to get those kits and enter the big bad world of hot rodding.

Then the journey started. I initiated some e-mails to the tooner who would be ever busy in his races and tours.
He wouldn't receive any calls and would ask to only e-mail, if he did take a call then it be a great favour and would keep the conversation very very short.

All this didn't ring any bells in my head at that time coz I was blindly in his faith and just wanted to be another one of his beautifully scripted stories. -- ALARM 1
The desperation then leaded to interaction with those other riders and the faith being reinforced.

Then emboldened by those reviews I took the plunge and asked him for the way forward to receiving his goodies.
He said first the full money and then only the goodies. Like all right minded persons I said half before delivery and half later.
For this he agreed and after the first payment he sent me only some of the parts that were cleverly of lesser value than my first installment.
And said he would be sending the rest of the parts soon, as he was busy in the races but I was asked to not delay the remaining payment. -- ALARM 2
And indeed the rest of the parts came only after the remaining payment was made. Obviously duffer(means Myself).

So forward I go ignoring those two alarms. So all this process of starting a dialogue with Mr. Tooner and me receiving the goods took almost 5-6 months.
In between this our playboy shv18 (sorry couldn't resist) jumps in and starts preparing for his journey into hot rodding.
Then I get them assembled with all precautions and precision about which I had interacted with our senior riders like abhimanyu31, psr ji and others as well .

Then it was that dreaded camshaft stitch noise era. It had started. The tooner asked me to get the decomp unit out so that the noise would slowly subside.
Off goes the decomp unit but not the noise. But our tooner assures me it would go away with time and so did his assurances. -- ALARM 3
Still not suspicious of his marketing skills I went about town happily riding with that irritating noise as onlookers took me for a fool and a cheapo FZ owner.

By now the reverse crank also became prominent and I brought this to his notice and was assured these would be happening very less frequently and not damage
the engine in the long run. So all was hunky dory again to with your stupid protagonist. -- ALARM 4

All this time I was on my stock carb. So the tooner told me to get the 29mm CV carb from him and feel the bike fly more freely.
I said yes and yet again sent him exorbitant money for the normal bajaj pulsar ug4 carb which came with a 112.5 main standard jet.
But our tooner sent kit needs a main jet of size 117.5 or more in his own words. Yet he sends the carb as it is. -- ALARM 5

And the story goes on with never ending alarms, above being the most prominent ones. Then through greater interaction within me and shv18 we
sensed something was not right. But by this time we had already put 35k and 40k worth of hard earned money into this deep s**thole.

Me not being a good writer, shv18 started writing about our collective experience in a very precise manner. This inflammed our Tooner to no end.
So he starts off with FACTS about how he does all the hard work and all we do is sit and critcize him. By this time all the after sales support had come to a naught.
Even then the tooner had the audacity to ask me to buy a salvaged inline carb for a gracious discounted amount of Rs.5000 and filter extra. (my God why didnt you
kill me and shv18 already for being such fools and blind)

ALL this drama happened only coz of our ignorance about hot rodding and the effort that goes into it. And not into the sham marketing strategy called
RC concepts. We learned it the hard way that there is no easy way to success. No one else is gonna do your work.

All this 'plug and play' and 'bullet proof realiablity' is not possible with even the best tuners. The reason being simple.
You are doing somethig more and beyond what the machine is capable of handling.
The sooner we realised it, we put a cap on the expenses to be done beyond this point.

And hence now decided to not pursue the FZ hot rodding. I am back to the bone stock FZ i had from the start and all those bullet proof parts are lying
in my garage gathering dust and rust. They will keep reminding me of my blunders during hot rodding.

But more importantly they shall remind me of what I have learned from this experience and the correct approach to this whole hot rodding thing.
From now on I am certain that I cannot be wrong in my approach to modifying anything. There could be hits and miss. But the correct way would lead
us to the setination we ought to reach.

During this entire phase I had the privilege of having made friends with many of you good people and would like to thank seniors including but not limited
to psr ji, abhimanyu31, stefanm and others.

And so as a part of my never ending quench for power and the lessons learnt from my above endeavor I upgraded to a more powerful machine. The Duke 200.
During this deciosion making I had kept shv18 and Mr.Vikram from motozone in the loop.

Both of them were happy. The FZ was passed on to my younger cousin who came to legal driving age just now.
And we shall be discussing on how to move on with the Duke.

Of course I would be doing hot rodding even now. But the difference now would be the correct approach and knwoledge first hand.
There would be no unnecessary plug and play parts installed. Coz then there would be nothing bullet proof if I did so.
Everything would be calculated and think upon it twice before doing anything.
We shall start off with small and non harmful mods with respect to the engine.

More on this shall be discussed at a later stage. As of now I am really thankful to all you people who made this thread som uch informative and useful
to everyone alike. Thanks.

cheers...

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Novice ....sad to know of the injury to the Eye and that you had not got the vision in the eye so far.
Thanks for thinking that I was of some use and help in your endeavor of Hot rodding .
As someone active in Xbhp for the past years, I had heard what ever you had posted , many times over.....Still many went for the mods inspite of my warning , only to come back to me for help or would simply throw the whole kit and chalk it up to a bad experience.Many had bought higher cc bikes, which was what I had requested them to do, instead of investing huge amounts of money in modifications that were dubious in their claim.

Glad you had also upgraded your ride ,and have peace of mind.
Good Luck to you
My prayers for your speedy recovery.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Novice wish you a speedy recovery.

There is a some misconceptions regarding concepts of tuning and working of single cylinder engines.

I wont sit and pinpoint them now, but from what I have seen some of the users of these performance parts and their usage, there are some things wrong on their part too.

I also agree with the parts from RC of which the pics have been put up are defective.
But I have also seen many users that, don't give a damn about their bikes, no start up idling, proper scheduled maintenance and all.

Also what Joel has stated is not proper of expecting bulletproof reliability.
But I myself have seen examples of his bikes still running strong R15s and 220s done numerous trips,tours & also of those gone kaput.

Don't expect same reliability as stock unless u are ready to spend a more on maintenance compared to stock bike.

Joel really needs to improve his customer support and parts quality.

Also when you compare price/bhp of hotrodded bikes to stock it will never be the comparable.
But the fun of owning and riding such a souped up machine is completely different.

PS: I know a guy who has spent so much on his RXZ that if he saved all that money up he could have bought a Ninja 650 and accessorize it completely.
There are many like him who do it for the love of it.