Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Though I dont have any products from any of the houses but I presume the kits from motozone will be better than semi forged quarter(term invented by a fellow xbhpian ) forged or whatever forged stuff from RC


Sent from my GT-I9100 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

I think I should come here. Anyways Shv18 journey with his RC Fz-18 has ended in retrospect and what I feel about him is he is bit jumped the gun. Right from the day he met Joel and thought the only adventurous and enthusiastic tuner in India and if you turn back the pages in the whole of xbhp forums (I don't know if some of them got deleted) you can see his praise for the RC team. Even Novice and I were inspired to hot rod our babes because of Shv18's confidence and trust in RC products. Atleast he met the person and saw the products in bangalore and had even spent a good time with him but as for me and Novice it's all first time experience and we didn't even know what Hot Rodding is.

And when I had the first issue with RC guy Shv18 was indirectly in bashing mode and he wanted to stay in neutral and he even recommended RC tooner's false options like remove the Decomp lever and so on but I was on the lucky side that I had not great mechanics and my conscience never made me to take false steps. I thank Mr. Mic and Luke who were once my adversaries but turned my greatest help in my journey of hot rodding.

And Shv18 understood what we went through and the pain only when he experienced things with his own bike with the RC products installed. One thing I surely learnt from Shv18 was it's bad to tinker with the setup which got adapted with the system and I it really worked for me.

It's 10k kms now with second bore kit of RC I don't have any problems not even a single oil leak and only drawback is the mileage I get only 35 km/l and the awkward tailor stitching sound. Rest all it's the best bike to ride.

And I will tell you the power is only at the low end and mid-end and when it comes to top-end I don't think it's too much far than the stock siblings. I'm talking about my setup.

The difference is Shv18 had best of knowledge and things to happen (by the experiences of other hot-rodders who experienced and shared before he modded his bike) and best mechanics at his side and whereas I didn't have anyone and all calculations permutations and combinations done by own experience and conscience.

Two things I can clarify in accordance to my experience in hot-rodding

Shv18 ---- He did jumped the gun in the beginning but his explanation is very clear but bit lengthy. I think he must start a different thread and just make the briefings short about the consequences of hot rodding.

Joel Race Concepts ---- Why do you cheat people by lying. If you say the truth you aren't gonna lose anything. Anyways Hot rodding is not a genuine stuff. It's like injecting drugs into to athlete's body and make him perform so where's the question of perfection and reliability. I would have same love and respect for you if you were truthful to your customers of what you are doing.

And the journey continues............

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Ha ha ha...Apart from the NEW forging Technology, there was also the tall claim that the BB kit BORES were actually CAST as per the Part Supplier's Specification...I had queried in the R15's mod thread ," How come there is 135cc letters cast into the 165cc bore's outer ?." . ... there were many members wanting to have bores cast for their use at the Part Supplier's Casting Foundry...Alas There were no answers, but only dead silence...of-course the thread came to a dead end.
Till date I could not understand the logic behind the 165cc bore branded as 135cc...
Thank God For my Abysmal Ignorance.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

This thread is really helpful and eye opening

I was also the victim of this expert "Tooner"...or let me put a better and suitable word from him "CHEATER"

I had ordered a Free Flow exhaust from him which got delivered after many months of making the Payment. I had to make calls to him endless times and every time got a standard reply "YOU WILL GET IT SOON. I WILL DISPATCH THIS WEEK I WAS BUSY WITH RACING"

FFE was delivered in a pathetic condition without any box packing, it came with just plastic wrap and two big dents and minus the decibel killer. Initial impression of the performance was good but within a few days the exhaust rusted badly from the under side. When i approached him regarding this he assured me that i will get a replacement which i NEVER got. I kept on calling him for full ONE YEAR and finally gave up. The "Tooner" / "CHEATER" always said ill give you the replacement but

I also had planed to go for the BB Kit at that time but god saved me. The tooner/cheater himself made it clear that he is not trust worthy.

My hard earned Rs. 8,000 went down the drain and i threw the exhaust in scrap and reverted to stock

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Ya I saw the thread and it was abhijeet's bike that bore the 135cee cee mark. .. I was ready with cash worth 40k just for the mods from race"the engine sieze " concepts but luckily my bike crashed while cornering and nearly totalled itself and was repaired from the money saved for mods ya I say I was lucky because atleast I rectified the bike with genuine stuff and now its still alive and kicking then after some time again the bug bit me and I started sabing for mods but luckily this time I had talks with senior members like psr sir abhimanyu sir shv18 and our xbhpian next door mr bibhu( a fellow xbhpian invented the term quarter forged and I followed suit and invented pint forged nip forged 60ml large peg forged on the rocks forged and so on)... they advised me not to go for mods madly and read before attempting any mod ya I had the opportunity of knowing a fellow hotrodder ( no he doesnt have a shop or tuning or tooning firm just for hobby) mr bibhu but the intricacy with which he sets up his ride is stupendous
Not the plug n pray marketing stint advertsied by RC
So the result was the money which I saved was invested in getting another well known performance bike (albeit old one)
Ya I don't say I will quit from doing mods but will do it sensibly such that the engine internals dont get blasted to smithereens
Cheers
Sent from my GT-I9100 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

I Beg to differ in certain opinions raised in this regard, so let me try and clear the air. I hope my comments below will be taken in the right spirit :

1) 2 years back, right from the moment the project was conceptualised and taken upon, i was an amateur hot roding enthusiast just like you.

2) I too was drawn into the possibilities of hot roding, "Bullet Proof, better than stock" set ups and testimonials from people in Mumbai and in other cities just like you did.

3) I believe you were not forced/pressurised by anyone to purchase these kits. The decision was solely yours.

4) My visit to blore gave me an impression that the seller knew what he was selling which later turned out to be false.

5) When problems cropped up in your kit, based on whatever recommended troubleshooting steps were mentioned to me by the Tooner, the same was conveyed to you without any addition or omission.

6) In my later posts on this thread, i have always encouraged readers to have a look at the earlier statements made by me in order to understand where i was, who i was and where i am now after this project. Thanks to senior riders and the exposure to hot roding and performance tuning books available online, i gained a considerable knowledge and same has been shared with everyone on this thread.

7) There was no bashing my friend, rather a difference in opinion regarding how you analysed the issue in hand and instead of taking steps you kept on sending PMs and later gave up.

8) After i went ahead with the project, when problems started cropping up, as mentioned at the beginning of the thread, the agenda here was to log my experience so that we all can get to the bottom of where exactly the so called performance kits from the seller stand in terms of:

* Performance
* Reliability
* Claimed FE
* And the real deal of ownership i.e. living with it.

So whether posts can be considered blabbering or something valuable i leave it to the readers.


The difference between the approach taken by you and mine was when things started going south, i decided to take the matter into my own hands and approached senior riders for help. Just for the record Senior rider @psr ji lives in Chennai, I am based in Mumbai, MadMik and Luckyluke are based in Vietnam. I haven't had exactly the opportunity to meet them in person. All the conversations took place via the same means available to you as well Vis a Vis PMs, with exception to senior rider @abhimanyu31 who was very kind enough to help me get by the whole process and assisted me with problems as in when possible.

There is a plethora of information in some of the older threads right here in xbhp which i started going through and simultaneously started looking for alternative tuning houses in Mumbai who may have done such work but are not much active in public or in social media. Once, i realised where I was going wrong, i decided to open up in and admit my naivety in public. At the same time, whatever i learned in the due process was shared with everyone and thanks to many of the disgruntled riders for coming forward and sharing their experience, kit pics which made me change my opinion completely about Tooner.

I share the same thoughts you have about the person in question. Though by now i have made my peace with the money that parted away from my wallet in consolation with the knowledge i gained from this project. In a way, even if by a small margin: i feel have achieved something like the guys behind the Russian Rocket motors who never gave up and always took the approach of learning things the practical way thus in the process ended making the most powerful close cycled Rocket engine, way ahead of anyone which now even the Americans openly admit as shown in the documentary below :P :

Soviet N1 Moon Rocket Documentary Part 1 - YouTube





Hopefully my posts and experience will help others in understanding hot roding better and at look at it from a different perspective: not negative but rather understand how things go behind the scenes of the engine case.

In the end, without failures one cannot achieve success.

All in good faith...


LOL... though i am not sure whether this was related or directed to this thread but i would like to post an interesting press statement made which cropped up on the social media right after i had posted the real story behind the origins of the kit:





Pic 1: really Really tall claims all over.

Sorry folks but i simply couldn't resist!! The bullet proof reliability, inhouse systems etc. i leave it to you what to make out of it..

Again my friend the real thanks should go to everyone, right from the readers to senior riders and moderators for participating, keeping the thread clean and willing to listen to my constant blabbering patiently.


Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Thanks god Atlast the tall claim of bullet proof reliability has not been made in the provided snapshot :thumbup:

Sent from my GT-I9100 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18


Yes the credit goes to you and all other contributing members of xbhp.

That FB post of the "CHEATER" makes me sick.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18


The correct word you are looking for is Tooner

Lighten up mate...

Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

@A@shIsh : You are the only one now. Now when I have a ffe too, its lying in my balcony, doing nothing.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Shiv18 first of all congratulations ...for making the part supplier confess in the first two lines Itself....

People had been relentlessly sending him PMs, e-mails, SMSs and Phone call but never managed to extract such a comment, leave alone the parts for which they had paid their hard earned money...
All your complaints of the kit had confused him so much that he is now going around in circles....



Here is an account of the effort in Development...


Shv18 your entire BB kit and parts have been designed exclusively, and MADE ABROAD to his spec...and so are the P220 and R15 135cc ...oops 165cc



and look at the list of what is in progress....my head is spinning...



I wonder how a person who is yet to understand a single cylinder engine , had started tampering with Four Cylinders of a CAR....Surely belongs in "The Hilarious Thread".

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Sir,

He cannot even handle a single cylinder engine... god knows what is going to happen to the 4 cylinders and 6 cylinder car motors. In comparison, it is still cheaper to repair a motorcycle engine than the one for a 4 wheeler. I feel really bad all those who are getting sucked into this new marketing scheme. BTW rider MadMik had already pointed out that his so called "state of the art" (read FART!! ) performance kits for stock NA motor for Honda VTEC city are nothing but parts imported from other countries. Whatever needs to be developed has already been developed abroad.

If one still wants to spend money on such performance kits from Mugen, Magnaflow, turbos etc., there are better after market tuning houses in India than our Tooner's like: Red Rooster, N1 Engineering, even Motozone for a fact who have recently finished building one of the most tricked out Nissan 370Z currently on the streets.

If i am correct, on the race track Tooner's prepped car hasn't even managed to complete two laps before blowing up the engine many times over!

Regardless coming back to 2 wheelers, i believe this thread has exposed all that needs to be said in public.

I only hope anyone still looking at the subject of hot roding will stay away from this Tooner for their own good. I am happy to see that a lot of people are slowly coming forward and sharing their experience on this thread. I personally believe one shouldn't feel ashamed or bad for being taken for a ride. It is a part of learning process. Expensive?? Agreed!! But well worth the amount of knowledge one has gained.

I am still a firm believer that there is a scope for extracting better performance out of a stock motor but just not with the list of "quarter forged" (have i termed it right??) kits from the Tooner. In my next build i will be covering the "correct" way and shall document the whole process on xbhp.

Until then...


Cheers,

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

SHOCKED!!!
My reaction after visiting this thread today.. What the hell went wrong here. I did had a feeling long back that the gain in power after these mods would not be significant. But its shocking to see the results here.
I still dont understand why we need to mod a bike when we have so many options available. an RTR 180 is same priced as a Fazer 150 which is as costly as a pulsar 220. When we have so many options available why touch the engine.
When we are not taking chances with the aftermarket chainset in our bikes.. just to gain a little bit of power we are installing pistons which look good but have not gone through proper quality checks. Remembering a fellow member's (@nand_15) trip where his after market 14T sprocket came out and he was stranded and searching for the nuts to fix it back. This is what happens when we alien/foreign stuff in our machines.
I am glad that no one got hurt in these experiments/experience. Please take good care of yourself guys, these set backs are a big learning for all of us. Lets not play around with the core.
When I bought Fazer, the cost was 85K and R15 was at 1.15K. This 30K difference was giving me dual disc, fuel injection, full fairing and more importantly speed. But I ended up buying a Fazer primarily because I would never ride a bike at more than 100 km/hr and the high tech bike (R15) will leave me stranded as most of the roadside mechanics will not understand the technology (Now after 3 years, I think things have changed immensely and R15 could also be repaired by some roadside mechanics)
The prime requirement from any machine is safety and reliability. By doing all these mods you end up jeopardizing both.
When I was in delhi, ppl kept asking me to covert my car to cng as it reduces fuel costs by more than 50%. Believe me guys, its better to be safe for 1 lakh kms than risking your life by saving 1 lakh rupees in these 1 lakh kms.
I dont know why we kept trusting this guy even when there was enough proof of his misdeeds. Also, we kept the cost of his services/stuff as a national secret!! I haven't seen anything as closely guarded as the cost of race concepts performance upgrade stuff.
I was also astonished to see posts like CBR250 modded!! R15 Modded.. its a race out there and then the modded bike start 'smoking' its siblings!
A tip to new members - Start enjoying your rides rather than getting into thoughts of improving its performance.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Thank you for your kind words parvez. But I am no hot-rodder, because hot rodding takes a lot of skill and I am no where near it. I just do what is best for my bikes. Setting up a bike properly, in stock condition, maintaining it as good as factory finish; that it self takes a lot of effort. Many of us don't have time, knowledge or will to do even that and later blame the machines when they fail. Modding an engine properly, even for the simplest things, like getting the jetting right, getting the needle position right, getting the proper air filter, takes days or even months. In amateur hands it takes months at end to set up and finish a moded build. So expecting to just plonk something in, without any understanding of how it works, and riding past everyone is not the right approach to power-tuning bikes.

Some advice from me; when you do decide to mod an engine, keep some things in mind.

1. Make sure that its not your only bike, I have heard horror stories of a guy saving money, buying a used r15 and giving it to race concepts for tuning and ending up with a lemon. Don't be that guy.

2. If you do decide to build a modded set up, do it from the ground up. Make sure every component of the engine is up to the mark, Then put in modded parts and make it a complete build. Not a half here half there one. EG; Don't put in a big bore without a properly modded combustion dome. Do it properly, or let your ride live. don't mutilate it in the name of tuning, You are not going in to a science fair with it. Your life, literally, depends on the reliability of that machine.

3. Make sure the rupee/power ratio is good. Don't spend tens of thousands of rupees for a 1 bhp bump. Its not worth it.

4. Make sure (Absolutely, positively sure) that the parts you are going to put in are compatible with your set up. From air filter to exhaust, everything.

The problem is, the lack of willingness of people to learn, to walk before run. Some guy comes in and starts shouting, my product does this and does that and people immediately jump on that bandwagon without realizing that what's being promised is impossible to deliver. The "tuner" in question here is not the first guy to do this, neither would he be the last. The people who jumped in wont be that last either.

Shv18 also jumped in, with blind faith, that what the guy promises would be true. But it didn't pan out that way. Why I respect him so much, is because most guys in his shoes would have just given up but he didn't. He carried forward his desires to mod and on the way got help from some good people.The only part I feel sad about is the amount of money he lost during this ordeal. His posts should be regarded as a guideline as to how modding is done properly.


Or else, There is always the "quarter forged" piston you can get from me.

Re: The POWERHOUSE Fz18

Bibhu....You have used the Most Appropriate words . I had been sharing the same thought for many years ,and the members who went in for these Quarter,and Half cooked ideas,thought I was not in the know of things....Time had proved who is what. Life is a great Teacher ,and those who are keen to learn WILL learn and move up. It is the un-initiated who are prayed upon by unscrupulous sham operators.
Let us hope the Sham stops, and better council prevails.