I am trying to support the RTR lovers here

Yep, but TVS did keep the Fiero alive in the form of the F2 / FX around when the Pulsars were getting the first (UG1) and second (UG2) upgrades. Also the Pulsars ultimately led to the demise of both the CBZ (Classic) and the Fiero.

How did you manage to come to this (pretty innacurate) conclusion? Based on some statistics i suppose??

Almost every (biker and non-biker) friend of mine who's ridden with me has complained about the pillion footpeg vibes on my bike around the 6-6.5k rpm mark. And not a single one of them are part of any internet forum.

The bike has it's plus points. It also has it's flaws. Why not just accept it instead of burying our heads in the sand? And if someone starts the whole short-stroke argument again, open your eyes and look at all the new oversquare short-stroke bikes in the market today...

IIRC, the only real competition to the first fiero was the cbz. There was about a 2-3 year gap between the fiero and the pulsar.

In spite of having one of the smoothest engines in indian history, the fiero lost out to the relatively cruder engined cbz in pretty much everything else.

Wow... that sound is awesome

Ya i agree. At least Yamaha can make a 250 twin cylinder. i am not happy with CBR. its better than all the other bikes here in India but not happy coz I hate the sound of it. its like a big hero Honda.

one of my friend as a old CB200 2win and man its a sweetheart. its a head turner.. the sound is so good. even ninja sound is not that good. they could have released that old bike instead of this crap or at least CB250RS 33bhp model.

one of my customer has it and we did radial valve for it and full restoration. I love that bike. he is not ready to sell it. i offered him upto1.2 still he is not ready. then i decided to go for CBR but not good. Honda has completely drained power out of it for mileage .

CB200 sound
CB200 engine sounds.MOV - YouTube

I would love to. In fact I haven't ridden quite a lot of recent models (R15 V2.0, CBR150R, Impulse, 2012 RTR series).. will try to sqeeze some time from attending to my new born.


The Fiero / Fiero F2 / Fiero FX never flourished in the first place. On the other hand the Fiero has one of the smoothest engine/gearbox on an Indian bike. But apart from that there was nothing else. Styling, features, handling were nothing to write much about.. and therefore lost the battle to the Pulsar (Classic) DTS-i (UG1 & 2) Twins.

The RTR despite it's vibey engine has quite a lot of unique stuff going for it.. tight / compact styling, sporty posture & handling, perky throttle response, quite decent feature list.. in short the Apache RTR (pre 2012 series) had managed to carve its own place (unlike the Fieros).


Making 250 / 350 cc should have promise of good returns. It is a big step / risk for any manufacturer

Right now only Honda has broken the 250 cc (made in India) barrier that too because it was developed keeping in mind the world market, produced simulataneous in India and Thailand and exported worldwide.. so that reduces the risk associated with just making for India.

The profits that TVS makes is thin.. therefore investing resource (precious R&D time, capital) on a category (250/350) which might/might not yield profits.. is well.. risky.

why cant they make a 250 or 350 is it so hard hmm have been waiting for long to see something good from them.

history repeats itself,
fiero was killed the same way.........

Payeng it would be nice, if you tested the bike once and gave a report, I would take that any day. Not to say that I don't respect @Hayaz's views, I respect his point of view too.

I think it might be because of 110 tire in rear. I am also running on 110 now and there s a drop in initial pick up but after that its OK in fact its better. Top end will increase a bit.

Are they tubeless too as in 180 any info on that ?

The gearing has definitely not "messed up". It had even improved the engine smoothness. But what i meant was tvs compromised a bit on the acceleration dept for smoothness. (I think they have put on the front sprocket of the 180 on the 160 for taller gearing, like they did with the rear tyres)

Hmm I see atleast 3-4 guys complaining about vibes when ever i visit SVC (must be that all of them are xBhpians )

Recent conversations are based on "opinion" given out saying that new RTR has taller gear ratios is it on paper or mentioned in their site ? until then we should stop bashing new RTR
Still i dont believe TVS messed up gearing.

Strongly agree on this point

I never bought a RTR but appreciated how (the older ones) it had its own USP among the plethora of 150 cc plus bikes.

The RTR stood managed to stand apart because it had a USP as a Compact Sporty Bike.. everything else in the 150 cc Plus category tries to be "Definitely Male".. very "Xtreme".. a "Hunk" or "Lord of the Streets".

The RTR managed to stand out as it was kind of opposite to what the other bikes were trying to be.


Many of my friends who got the RTR are of short-medium height and bought it as the RTR as it was easy to manage by them. Also most guys outside xBhp / cyber space discussions do not complain / notice the "vibrations" too much.

The instantaneous throttle response (because of the short gearing) made the (older RTR) stand out from the ther bikes and only added to the delight factor and the character of a "spunky compact bike".

Why changes? Was there any issue with the existing ABS?

is there any change in the abs system in the newer model ?