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**faizan.ali** · 07-23-2015, 04:11 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by Lingeshsaikumar View Post

All these castings are made from LM24 Aluminum alloy.

Endurance is the one making both forks and alloy wheels, manufactured in LPDC & GDC Casting process. Both forks and alloy wheels are made by the same LM24 Alloy.

All these breakages are mainly because of poor quality alloy (i.e) metal compositions are way out of spec, excess silica content is the prime reason for breakage.

other than that proper quality test for alloy ingots such as fracture test, where the fractured surface should be fine grainy pattern. Spectro test, which very very important to test the chemical composition of alloy, is not even conducted. as there is a huge demand by bajaj, they cut corners by reducing the amount of time spent inspection & quality control and bajaj too accept these poor quality casting, as endurance is the cheapest die caster in india.

other than these poor dross removal process (impurities in molten metal) will also have a huge impact in the quality of these castings.

Remelting process is also not properly governed by most of die casters, mix up of various runners (excess metals after casting) Eg Runner form a ADC 12 alloy casting is mixed with these LM 24 alloy casting runners will also lead to these kinds of very poor quality.

Bajaj should (must) make improvements in its casting and its machining process to prevent these kind of failures

Man how do you know so much? do you work in this industry or is the knowledge out of experience ?

**Lingeshsaikumar** · 07-23-2015, 04:14 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by faizan.ali View Post

Man how do you know so much? do you work in this industry or is the knowledge out of experience ?

i work in die casting industry buddy

**TheArcher84** · 07-23-2015, 05:36 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Another one bites the dust, Its NS now

Now Pulsar 200 NS Alloy Breakage Comes To Light | MotorBeam – Indian Car Bike News & Reviews

**Satellite.kid** · 07-23-2015, 05:41 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Time to do a recall Mr. Bajaj.. what say?

**Omi** · 07-23-2015, 05:58 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

I just hope this is taken very seriously, and due inspection is taken by the safety authorities in Government as well.

The NS and RS breakage seem to be same, also the break pattern is same too.

The pattern seems to be consistent across Duke RS and NS,

Attached Files

**sunilg** · 07-23-2015, 05:58 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by TheArcher84 View Post

Another one bites the dust, Its NS now

The bike is AT LEAST One and half years old. Bajaj stopped the production of yellow NS in Dec 2013. Also there is no explanation provided leading to the cause of the incident. So connecting these 2 incidents doesn't seem logical. looks like someone just dug up an old pic.

Originally posted by Freak inExile

Can you please share other casters in India?

please us PM feature. This is off topic!

Originally posted by Lingeshsaikumar View Post

i work in die casting industry buddy

Your inputs on this thread are highly informative! thanks for sharing.

**Kaushik Iyer** · 07-23-2015, 07:28 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

The baja claim is really a whole load of BS nothing else. But I'm really aghast reading a few posts on this thread!!!

I'm sure a lot of people love Baja Bikes & offcourse the RS200, though I too believe that jumping to conclusions is not correct but I see most jumping to conclusion that "it could be rider's fault & not Bajaj" without even bothering to really do a little observation atleast on the pics attached. I'm sorry to say that, my friends usually say I've a eye for observation!!!

forget about the other pics attached and just focusing on the original set of images here's my bit;

If you just carefully look at the wheel's image -
the rim is perfectly round, the tyres are still in inflated state, There's no sign of lateral deformity - conclusion: its clear that the wheel has not had any frontal impact for sure.
From the other images if we just focus on the wheel doesn't seem to have had any side impacts too since it looks pretty straight from other angles too. hence no side impact for sure. Yes you can see a big scar on the sides but we'll get to that in a bit.....

Now if you see the way the wheel has broken.... right at the rim joints and if you closely observe the image you'll see that all the broken rim joints appear to be of the same height. Which concludes that the metal ruptured almost at the same point from all the spokes. This is highly unlike in an accident/ Big pothole situation where it'll atleast have higher stress on the side of impact. Example... if the guy had hit a pothole the spoke breakages at the opposite end of the impact side would've stretched a little. So this is clearly a metal fatigue at the spoke point and looking at the stock alloy wheel pattern it appears to be the thinnest at that very point, and the consistency of the spoke-breakage on all the spokes seems to be that it broke with a centrifugal force... like keeping the center held tightly and forcing the outer rim to keep moving on a roller.... now if say it was a metal spoke wheel after a certain holding point the wheel would've simply warped, in case of the alloy it just gave away at it's weakest point, which seems to be the thinnest point also in the wheel. Hence as per my conclusion; this wheel is of inferior quality(either metal composition or manufacturing) OR the designer who went from this fancy wheel did not account for the structural fatigue a wheel might go thru in real life OR simply both.

Now coming to the scar marks on the side of the rim in the pic.... What I think has happened is: rider breaks hard while riding maybe at a certain speed, the wheel gives away, hence the front grip and rigidity is lost, bike impales out a bit to the left side making the bike & rider along with the wheel hanging between the forks.... while going down the left forkend scrapes on the edge of the rim, bike & rider contact the road skidding on their left side... hence you can also see the tyre-scrape marks(whitish patch) on the wheel-pic & the bike is mostly damaged too left as well & I can guarantee the the riders have also injuries on the left shoulders, hands and hips.

That is my conclusion from this.... I know many might cringe at reading this but while I love bikes I'm not going to blindly accept that good bikes & companies don't make mistakes and that every other fella is out there to just badmouth a company and blame it after an accident. So I rather like to use my observation and arrive at my own conclusion than believing stories by anyone Company or Rider.

**nadz11.ns** · 07-23-2015, 07:52 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

[MENTION=75833]Kaushik Iyer[/MENTION].. close observations and quite valid points too.

**madNS** · 07-23-2015, 09:08 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by Kaushik Iyer View Post

The baja claim is really a whole load of BS nothing else. But I'm really aghast reading a few posts on this thread!!!

I'm sure a lot of people love Baja Bikes & offcourse the RS200, though I too believe that jumping to conclusions is not correct but I see most jumping to conclusion that "it could be rider's fault & not Bajaj" without even bothering to really do a little observation atleast on the pics attached. I'm sorry to say that, my friends usually say I've a eye for observation!!!

forget about the other pics attached and just focusing on the original set of images here's my bit;

If you just carefully look at the wheel's image -
the rim is perfectly round, the tyres are still in inflated state, There's no sign of lateral deformity - conclusion: its clear that the wheel has not had any frontal impact for sure.
From the other images if we just focus on the wheel doesn't seem to have had any side impacts too since it looks pretty straight from other angles too. hence no side impact for sure. Yes you can see a big scar on the sides but we'll get to that in a bit.....

Now if you see the way the wheel has broken.... right at the rim joints and if you closely observe the image you'll see that all the broken rim joints appear to be of the same height. Which concludes that the metal ruptured almost at the same point from all the spokes. This is highly unlike in an accident/ Big pothole situation where it'll atleast have higher stress on the side of impact. Example... if the guy had hit a pothole the spoke breakages at the opposite end of the impact side would've stretched a little. So this is clearly a metal fatigue at the spoke point and looking at the stock alloy wheel pattern it appears to be the thinnest at that very point, and the consistency of the spoke-breakage on all the spokes seems to be that it broke with a centrifugal force... like keeping the center held tightly and forcing the outer rim to keep moving on a roller.... now if say it was a metal spoke wheel after a certain holding point the wheel would've simply warped, in case of the alloy it just gave away at it's weakest point, which seems to be the thinnest point also in the wheel. Hence as per my conclusion; this wheel is of inferior quality(either metal composition or manufacturing) OR the designer who went from this fancy wheel did not account for the structural fatigue a wheel might go thru in real life OR simply both.

Now coming to the scar marks on the side of the rim in the pic.... What I think has happened is: rider breaks hard while riding maybe at a certain speed, the wheel gives away, hence the front grip and rigidity is lost, bike impales out a bit to the left side making the bike & rider along with the wheel hanging between the forks.... while going down the left forkend scrapes on the edge of the rim, bike & rider contact the road skidding on their left side... hence you can also see the tyre-scrape marks(whitish patch) on the wheel-pic & the bike is mostly damaged too left as well & I can guarantee the the riders have also injuries on the left shoulders, hands and hips.

That is my conclusion from this.... I know many might cringe at reading this but while I love bikes I'm not going to blindly accept that good bikes & companies don't make mistakes and that every other fella is out there to just badmouth a company and blame it after an accident. So I rather like to use my observation and arrive at my own conclusion than believing stories by anyone Company or Rider.

Nice observations

**bbsrailfan** · 07-23-2015, 09:15 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

I fail to understand how all 8 (or 10) arms/spokes/joints could break off at the same time, and how is it that the mid section (so-called spokes) which comes out so cleanly, leaving the spokeless rim intact? If it's fracture caused by pressure, there should be some irregularity in the breakages, isnt it?

**theironhorse99** · 07-23-2015, 09:23 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by bbsrailfan View Post

I fail to understand how all 8 (or 10) arms/spokes/joints could break off at the same time, and how is it that the mid section (so-called spokes) which comes out so cleanly, leaving the spokeless rim intact? If it's fracture caused by pressure, there should be some irregularity in the breakages, isnt it?

if you break it by force when stationary yes it will break the same way that you assume,
however while its on move the whole force is divided and it fractured at the weakest joints and looking at those joints and i now realize how thicker joints are there on our honda's..

imagine a mixer grinder and the blades breaking due to sudden external force or impact.
or assume the wheel has say 5 spoke.one broke and the whole pressure is now on remaining 4. in a matter of milliseconds the others will fail too when in motion.

**Nithesh** · 07-23-2015, 10:33 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

I wonder if this thing is in any way related to the first few owners here in the ownership threads(esp a guy from Bangalore iirc) who took their delivery of the bike and found something wrong with the brakes. Cannot remember what the issue was but i think it had something to do with the jammed calipers? They went back to the dealership and got it fixed it via the mechanic. Permanent fix or temporary i'm not sure. Didn't follow it up. Maybe the owners who had brake related issues can verify.

**Jon Niranjan Paul** · 07-23-2015, 10:45 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Wouldn't these be tested for a safe working load? If the case is panic/emergency braking, this is an everyday situation each one of us go through! And i did go through the previous posts, and can ascertain that here has not been any lateral damage to the wheel to cause a breakage like this! Seems like spoked wheels are the safest bet now, since there are one too many incidents being reported.

This could also probably be related to metal composition. Maybe the additives during casting made the alloy extremely hard and brittle, sacrificing on possible elastic limits in certain batches?

I've had an instance where my front wheel has rammed a stone from a median, in speeds of 70+. The vehicle jumped into the air, i was almost thrown off, however the rim remained intact! There wasnt even the slightest bend, I had it checked as well, since i was not sure myself. This was with the CBR.

**theironhorse99** · 07-23-2015, 11:03 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Originally posted by Nithesh View Post

I wonder if this thing is in any way related to the first few owners here in the ownership threads(esp a guy from Bangalore iirc) who took their delivery of the bike and found something wrong with the brakes. Cannot remember what the issue was but i think it had something to do with the jammed calipers? They went back to the dealership and got it fixed it via the mechanic. Permanent fix or temporary i'm not sure. Didn't follow it up. Maybe the owners who had brake related issues can verify.

i remember that, it was calliper jammed issue which i responded to and the SVC guys quietly replaced the whole assembly when owner was not there.
organic pads and low quality stuff. got over heated and jammed.

Originally posted by Jon Niranjan Paul View Post

Wouldn't these be tested for a safe working load? If the case is panic/emergency braking, this is an everyday situation each one of us go through! And i did go through the previous posts, and can ascertain that here has not been any lateral damage to the wheel to cause a breakage like this! Seems like spoked wheels are the safest bet now, since there are one too many incidents being reported.

This could also probably be related to metal composition. Maybe the additives during casting made the alloy extremely hard and brittle, sacrificing on possible elastic limits in certain batches?

I've had an instance where my front wheel has rammed a stone from a median, in speeds of 70+. The vehicle jumped into the air, i was almost thrown off, however the rim remained intact! There wasnt even the slightest bend, I had it checked as well, since i was not sure myself. This was with the CBR.

that's why Honda is what it is. i have had potholes at speeds 100+ at times and never had even a slight rim bent. also if you see honda's rims even in unicorn the edges are strengthened. weight saving race in wrong direction and huge cost cutting leads to such instances and consumers become test mules.

ideally even alloy rims can and should bend a bit and should have that flexibility but breaking straight away definitely arises questions on composition and quality testing of the same.

**Nithesh** · 07-23-2015, 11:09 PM

Re: RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

Now going through the RS200 thread, a lot of owners are mentioning that the bike creates an odd thud noise from the front assembly. One owner mailed it to Bajaj and they said they are aware of the issue and a small fix will be on its way. Didn't see any updates from either sides in the thread. Clearly something isn't right with Bajaj's response.

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RS200 Alloy Wheel breaking issue!

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