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**inflammable** · 09-21-2009, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by Bunny View Post

I am not really surprised seeing such kidding and immaturish replies here about the upgrapde. Most members here seem to find fault with every new bike / new upgrade , overlooking the good things.
Having ridden and thrashed the new Karizma, i can safely say it is indeed a step in the right direction. How can you guys miss the fairing, rear disc, better suspension, better rear lamp, fully digitial console et al? Just coz its almost got the same power or what? Dont miss out the FI, oil cooler and stuff. And obviously, dont judge the bike without riding it or better still, picking up our October issue

Peace!

Bunny.. I would beg to differ with you.. rest of the features have been in existence for more than 2 years now...

The Better Suspension.. HH is late in coming out with one. It Doesnt need 6 years to get Gas shocks.. It could hve been added couple of years ago. Bajaj did that in 2005.. I guess..

LED Lamps... Again Pulsar started the trend in India 3 years back. HH is too late again.

FI -- They had to bring.. to charge Royalty.. And it will be for sure overpriced.

Oil Cooler - Both the competitors... P220 & R15 have it.. yes R15 is not Oil cooled.. but liquid cooled. So HH is again a follower than being a leader.

Rear Disc - Apache.. P220... R15 got it long ago. HH was fooling customers by charging good amount for less advanced bike.

All these features were expected.. but with the good design. FZ sells because of good design... despite being priced in range of Apache 180 & P180.

And I have a gut feeling.. if this bike with on-road price of 90+ grands.. I doubt it will do good numbers.

Thats my opinion.

**srini** · 09-21-2009, 04:20 PM

Originally posted by antz.bin View Post

Why do you have to drag a P220 / RTR180 in every discussion about non Bajaj/TVS.. are you intimidated by them.. or just plain scared?

Anyways, back to topic. Much needed upgrade has finally arrived, But it has disappointed me, as a tech buff. I would have loved it too be more like 19.5/20bhp as previously speculated (how hard could it be). The PGM-Fi will make the response crisper, and none seems to notice, the 17.6bhp is @7000rpm, you dont need to keep it in the high rev band to extract the power. I for one, respect all the flagship premium motorcycles of all brands and know for a fact, that all of them, R15, P220, ZMR & even RTR180 cater to different audiences and can never be compared to each other.

Karizma was a vehicle which needed a proper upgrade since a long time ago, when we finally have one, learn to respect. When they put the Oil (is) Cooled under the full fairing, they must have tested the thing a couple of thousand times at least, to check if it is efficient enough to cool the engine under all temperatures/loads/speeds as if HH have one thing going with thm, its the legendary "Reliability".. and they wont want to lose that EDGE to the Bajajs and the TVSs of India. That is the thing that has made the ZMA IMO the most reliable tourer in the country.. and they wont want to lose that badge due to a stupid "Full Fairing with Inefficient Cooling" and "Badly designed clip-on handlebars leading to back pains". Please ride first and then comment about what parts you "Dont Like".

P.S.: I would only want to discuss performance. Least Interested in Looks...

...IMO it looks really nice from these angles...

**Bunny** · 09-21-2009, 04:22 PM

Originally posted by inflammable View Post

Bunny.. I would beg to differ with you.. rest of the features have been in existence for more than 2 years now...

The Better Suspension.. HH is late in coming out with one. It Doesnt need 6 years to get Gas shocks.. It could hve been added couple of years ago. Bajaj did that in 2005.. I guess..

LED Lamps... Again Pulsar started the trend in India 3 years back. HH is too late again.

FI -- They had to bring.. to charge Royalty.. And it will be for sure overpriced.

Oil Cooler - Both the competitors... P220 & R15 have it.. yes R15 is not Oil cooled.. but liquid cooled. So HH is again a follower than being a leader.

Rear Disc - Apache.. P220... R15 got it long ago. HH was fooling customers by charging good amount for less advanced bike.

All these features were expected.. but with the good design. FZ sells because of good design... despite being priced in range of Apache 180 & P180.

And I have a gut feeling.. if this bike with on-road price of 90+ grands.. I doubt it will do good numbers.

Thats my opinion.

Nowhere did i say about HH coming out with 'new' features did i? So i guess this post holds no value!

**riazmomin** · 09-21-2009, 04:28 PM

Originally posted by srini View Post

...IMO it looks really nice from these angles...

naa it still looks fugly..

So totally 5 colors have been seen. White, blue, red, black and yellow. White stands out very good.

it also has link for many more pics of it.

**abhijeet080808** · 09-21-2009, 04:31 PM

Originally posted by Bunny View Post

Nowhere did i say about HH coming out with 'new' features did i? So i guess this post holds no value!

I guess it is precisely because of this "too little, too late" opinion of the members here, that they are not happy with the new ZMR. It is a 6 yrs upgrade. Something substantial, which could be a new selling point was expected. Instead HH behaved as if it was forced to do this upgrade purely due to falling sales.

Edit : the new pics shows that the ZMR looks OK, if not great.

**Bunny** · 09-21-2009, 04:32 PM

A pictorial review

Page not found - Bike India

http://bikeindia.in/reviews/firstride/Back-with-vengeance/

MG · 09-21-2009, 04:36 PM

^^That's quick.I'm already off to that place.

**srini** · 09-21-2009, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by Bunny View Post

A pictorial review

http://bikeindia.in/reviews/firstrid...ith-vengeance/

^^^incorrect link...

...maybe it'll take a while

**spiderweb** · 09-21-2009, 04:37 PM

@BUNNY: U'd like to see this...

orkut -

**Bunny** · 09-21-2009, 04:38 PM

already saw that

I hope the october issue clear a lot of doubts

**fast_ferocious** · 09-21-2009, 04:39 PM

Originally posted by Bunny View Post

A pictorial review

http://bikeindia.in/reviews/firstrid...ith-vengeance/

**2fazt4ya** · 09-21-2009, 04:40 PM

Originally posted by spiderweb View Post

@BUNNY: U'd like to see this...

orkut -

WHat the heck....??

Bunny bro posted that just an hour ago...Its already in circulation in the web!!

And bunny bro....Its showing Incorrect link.

**Bunny** · 09-21-2009, 04:40 PM

^ : server issues! Apologies for that. But some of the members can see it (is what i have been told on gtalk)
i guess u will have to wait for a while now!

**abhijeet080808** · 09-21-2009, 04:41 PM

The power/torque figures are finally verified. So, speculations laid to rest. As I suspected no further increase in either!

From BI -

TECHNICAL STUFF

1.Engine capacity remains same
2.Power : 17.6 Bhp @ 7000rpm
3.Torque : 18.35 Nm @ 6000rpm
4.PGMFI: Fuel injection. One of the smoothest engines in India just got smoother!
5.Sensors for various things like intake air temp, oxygen sensor etc
6.Contact less speed sensor: As per our testing, there is hardly any speedometer error. 60km/h on the speedometer is 59.5 km/h true
7.High output 232 watt 3-phase ACG
8.16-bit ECU providing digital 3-D fuel injection maps

**Joel** · 09-21-2009, 04:42 PM

Originally posted by vipin_s View Post

Where is our "Mod. Doctor" Joel ??

Can Zma cam be made to lift even higher? If so how much and what is the power bump that can be expected ? Is this the first method to increase power by substantial amount ?
My vague guess is close to 1 bhp can be hiked by lifting cam higher (if the design permits) ??!!

The Karizma has a pretty good engine which can allow good room for improvements. Currently I'm working on my Karizma engine which has already been pushed past 23bhp. I'm working on making it produce a few more horses. Will start a new thread once its done.

The new zma figs are disappointing but the oil cooler part is a little interesting. Will plonk a larger oil cooler on my engine soon.

Announcement

Karizma ZMR pictures!

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