Thanks joel.
eagerly waiting.

Joel i am sorry if this question was asked already but would i have to change anything in the engine after installing the exhaust like the AFR or any setting? The bike in question here is a stock R15 .

^Nothing needed.

Hey Joel you are a legend mahn!!!!
Your name is on every bike lovers tongue....
i hope that after 15-20 years there comes a time when "Joel auto Ltd." are leading bike manfacturers in India...
btw what mod could you do to a Karizma Zmr if i were to bring the bike to you?

Surprising that the responses for performance goodies are only average, even considering that they are gonna cost only as much as their OE counterpart. The bigbore alone bumps over 15% power and costs as much as the stock block and others as well. More performance for the same cost and still Indians find it expensive and out of reach. Surprising indeed!

Yeah we sure are funny!

I am planning to get a second hand RTR now, hope you can do your magic on it as well!

Not just surprising its also extremely irrational.... leaves one speechless and aghast ... at one end of the spectrum I have seen guys spend thousands on useless cosmetic things for their bikes but when it comes to performance its usually the road side mechanic that they approach with their so called 'precious' machines... at the other end I have seen guys spend huge amounts on parts from abroad with negligible gains to show for their money.

Come on guys ... where is your support????... I ordered an big bore kit from Joel and let me tell you that I am one pleased customer... it is as good as anything I have bought from abroad... (and believe me when I say I have spent lacs on my bikes over the years, come to think of it... my helmets cost more than what he is charging)... the quality is exquisite... the guy's knowledge and talent is unrivaled (you can take that to the bank)... imagine the man-hours that he must have spent to develop this knowledge... if he is sharing it with us today, we should consider ourselves very very lucky indeed and grab the opportunity with two hands... so lets see some support in terms of orders and not just empty words on this forum...

+1, Infact I did my running in on a brand new big bore from him in a single rajasthan trip.... I would have thought twice as much even on a stock part, but the day I say the attention to details on the stuff, I was simply blown away.
Infact thats the ONLY reason why I have rejected an offer from someone for buying my R15 cause I know with the stuff he could provide, it would be a different machine altogether. That asides, I am already thinking on a fairly advance stage of plan on a touring setup on the RTR. Hence the lookout for the second hand RTR! The current monster is waiting for some parts, and then it would be an offroader... and the next would be a potent touring tool!
I kinda have a reputation to be not nice with my words and call a spade a spade and even an effin stupid spade at times!! lol especially with the whiplash to auto manufacturers when it comes to stupid claims! So you can take a cue on what this stuff is all about!!!


Here I am looking at retaining a bike, and buying another one BLINDLY relying on this magic man! and yet people end up getting ripped with the K&N+Iridium+Red Cable 'power' mods!!!!

(Though I personaly envy seeing other mutant bikes around, but what the heck.. the man deserves it and I am just being jealous!)

Its not like that man. The thing is your performance upgrades are limited to only the R15 & a few others. If you can extend your range to a few 125cc's then i would be more than happy to get it done by you.

BTW do you have anything in store for the 125cc's (yamaha gladiator)

Joel, I don't know about others, but just that I'm gone for a couple of days doesn't mean my words will remain words and never change into actions..like I said, I had my exams, which're now done. Will meet you soon, in person(like I said again, at your place).

I'm still confused as to what I should be going for in my first step. Big bore? Or else, ECU+exhaust? I dont think my budget will permit me to go for all three at once, can confirm that after we talk about prices. I'm not very keen about low end torque. As long as it's revvy and generates more power, I'm happy. And, I can change the cam only once, cant change it once for stage-1 and again for stage-2.

Also, another doubt: You say the 165cc kit improves fuel efficiency. Does this mean it gives more kms to the liter than the stock 150cc kit? If yes, it's truly confusing! I mean, isn't it supposed to be burning 15 more cc of mixture per cycle? If you think it's time, let's take the price-talk over PM, and also.. do let me know about your schedule in the coming 45 days, since I dont expect you to be free all the time due to the new WTR-ten10 collaboration.

joel, it indeed is surprising for a person like you, but one major fact is that, half of the xbhpians are students, take for example my case. I m following all your threads and works be it bikes or cars and so interested in getting it done by you, but what hinders me from doing that is the freedom we enjoy as students and we have to depend on our parents for all money matters. They wont approve of something like this as everyone just thinks that loud sounding bikes are equivalent of racing, even if we ride at 10-20kmph. I ll be completing my engg in some 6 months , the first thing in my priority list is getting my RTR to you as i ve already started saving money for a few months. If i get a job somewhere in chennai ,can also enjoy the fruit of the works in some good trackdays every now and then. Hope you ll be available in india then also !!!

Joe just wait for 6 more months, you would be getting an order for a RTR180, I would have ordered now but its just 25 days old

+1
Students' life is hell..All books and no kits!

Anyway,Congrats Joel for this ultimate engineering marvel...Every time I read your thread,your skills,knowledge,mods et al,my head goes down in shame.Being a Mechanical student I know nothing,even though I am very much interested in engineering and bikes

You are awesome man,I would like to learn a thing or two about bikes from you..

Okay,time not for lumpy throats.So Joel,when is the RTR kit coming? I am waiting for that eagerly..I am student but I will sure do some 'jhol' and get that kit.Please launch it fast...

PS: Do you enroll engineering students for summer internship?? Please??

Joel's Custom Big Bore Kit Review (My R15) n Big Bore + Exhaust Review (Uday's bike)

Before I begin I'd like to say that during the week spent in Bangalore, a few hours a day at Ten10 I realized that while the response is low online for these kits. Offline more people are upgrading their bikes. 2 R15s were kitted up when my bike was brought in for the works. RTRs etc were waiting outside to be worked upon. I came across R15s with just 8K+ on the odo going in for upgrades. I feel Joel's work on my bike needed to be fully appreciated, therefore I've tried to write down all the important details from this build.

And I felt I shouldn't have waited too long to get this upgrade. Here's why...

I'll begin with the review of my bike with the custom big bore high-compression 165cc cylinder-piston kit setup + reworked head with Altered port Geometry and improved cylinder head flow. It's a little peaky setup and the headwork does add to the overall setup but low-end and mid-range is mostly credit to the big bore as I'll explain in little comparison with my friend Uday's bike later.

Engine Characteristics: It has a noticeable grunt and free revving engine compared to the Stock setup. It felt a bit vibey soon (just a characteristic of the big bore, not any real issue) after assembly but after a lot of running it's very smooth now. Switched to fully synth Agip 5w40 after run-in and it feels smoother than stock now. Gear shifts are smoother and precise and overall the bike has a character unmatched by any stock R15.

Engine Performance During Run-In:

1. 900kms of Engine Run-in (Only 500 required): It was completed on the SL grade Yamalube Mineral oil present in the engine which had already run 1854.8 kms + 900kms including 450kms of Bangalore city commutes and ride to Mangalore. Stock bike was consuming a bit of oil. 870kms of ride on the big bore to Mangalore + 30Kms before oil change, there was no further noticeable drop in oil level.
   
2. Low-End Torque: Significantly improved to the point where the bike didn't feel sluggish when fuel was filled to the brim + 75Kg Rider + gear and minimum of 25Kg+ luggage. I was asked to keep the revs below 6K during run-in and for once I followed what I was told In Bangalore city traffic I never felt the need to go beyond 5K. During my trip back home, atleast 60% of the journey was completed in 6th gear alone.
   
   It has given life to the 6th gear and dose of adrenalin at triple digit speeds. While still running-in the bike pulled easily from 3.5KRPM+ with 75kg rider + 87 kg pillion in 6th gear. There's not much to speak about low gears here because the bike revs so quickly to 6K rpm that you'll be continuously shifting up to avoid going past it as there's no need to ride the bike in lower gears. It has made life easier in the city traffic. Never crossed 85-90kph during run-in.
   

Engine Performance Post Run-In:

1. Initial: I drained the oil over the evening at home and assembled it and refilled it with Agip Fully Synth 5w40 around 11PM. Warmed up the engine for a 5-6kms. On an empty stretch and full throttle from 1-6 gears and I was having an adrenalin rush.
   
2. Revs: Bike revs strongly towards it's rev limiter. Being a slightly peaky setup a slight increase in acceleration was evident around 8.5K-9.5K rpm. It retains a strong pull low-end and top despite being a near-linear powerband. There's plenty of torque for every kind of use.
   
3. Acceleration: It accelerates very quickly. While testing late night, my friend and I decided to drag against his stock R15 with the rider weighing 24Kilos lesser than me from standing still start and poor shifting on my end and partly crouched my bike was neck to neck with the stock and started pulling away when reaching 100Kph in 4th after which we stopped. With my weight it's leaps and bounds quicker compared to a stock bike. How I wish i was some 15 kilos lighter
   
4. Top Speed: This was a revelation but I had low fuel in the bike so maybe that's adds to the lower weight but on a slight decline I was doing 131kph sitting fully upright on the bike and 125 kph on flat surface. It may not have a higher topspeed over stock but it certainly gets there very quickly. Need to check the speeds again as my chain was fully dry with some slack, my air pressure was off the mark and I need to have more fuel in the bike. But nevertheless the bike gets to speed and stays there with ease. I wanted a good touring setup which can have the bike stay in 6th gear easily doing 120+kph upright with my weight throughout the day and I got what i wanted.
   
   At this point I'd like to mention that the distance it takes to achieve these speeds is cut down. Cant tell exactly how much but atleast 15-20% Will do some more rounds of testing soon and post what the best this setup has done.
   

Fuel Efficiency: This was a shocker: During Running-in on a full tank I got Excellent FE in Bangalore heavy city traffic with lots of idling at signals. On my trip back home it went upto 48+kmpl. Now the tank is near-dry and therefore on a full tank it's nearly 50kmpl (My Fuel Reserve Trip reset after some 20Kms) with the last 40kms done with a wide open throttle. During my trip to Mangalore with my friend who was on the P180 I constantly kept checking my tank as my Fuel Indicator never dipped (switched off the bike several times to check if it would correct itself) as fast as it would on the stock setup.

For those of you wondering. My stock bike with 25854.8kms on the odo before upgrade gave me a poor 35.xkmpl enroute to Bangalore without crossing 100kph to Madikeri (~150kms) and after that a decent 110-115kph and about 6 top speeds runs to 130-134kph on proper decline. So for 90kph touring my FE is up by 27%. I saved up nearly 300 bucks on two tank fulls after the upgrade. FYI. I still have some fuel left in the bike, havent filled since monday morning when I was leaving Bangalore. Probably another 10-15kms more to go.

Joy Of Riding:

It's of prime importance to understand that the gains maybe 15-20% over stock but you gain A LOT MORE MENTALLY. The pleasure of riding your bike and the ease of it. My trip in B'lore city and back home, never had me open throttle beyond the 1/4th mark depending on the gear and need to accelerate quickly. Perhaps 5-15% throttle and the bike was raring to go in every gear to 6K rpm. What I spent in upgrading it Im already getting back in terms of savings on fuel. Stock setup was fuel efficient to a certain number of kms and even after 25K on the odo it used to give around 36-40kmpl with total FE conscious riding and touch 138-140kph in terms of top speed fully crouched only on proper declines but at speeds higher than 120kph the fuel efficiency was nothing to write home about. But this setup has turned the stock on it's head.

Uday's R15:

With big bore + stock exhaust: Low-end and midrange similar to my bike and a good top end whack (I've only ridden it in lower gears it felt like it would do good speeds and I'm told it does) Later when the exhaust was bolted on the bike it made it more punchy throughout the powerband.

Joel's custom exhaust weighs approx 1.2Kilos and is 5.xx kilos lighter than stock. In terms of weight alone you are making your bike go a little quicker and you can lift his custom exhaust with your pinky finger. It's that light. Quality build. It looks and sounds great. It's loud, but then it's supposed to be loud. It's a performance exhaust after all.

With the exhaust + Big bore kit Uday's bike I felt it revved up quicker and freely than my own bike (considering my r15 has a reworked head) and this was noticeable while riding his bike. His bike had run 3K-4K kms on the big bore before exhaust upgrade.

Reliability: Many of you might be wondering how reliable this might be. Joel has spoken a lot about it already. I'd like to mention that there's oversize pistons available so when it's time to change, plonk in the next oversize and run the bike. It will last a long of time. I've learnt how much abuse the R15s Stock crank and clutch can take during my stay in Bangalore so not worried about my setup's reliability.

Cost: PM Joel. It's nothing compared to what you get in return. Just a fraction of the cost of the whole bike. IMHO It's a TOTAL VFM setup. I will recommend everyone atleast the big bore kit.

I feel a little stupid for initially deciding to wait till 30K kms to go for an upgrade only because I have perfect service record on my bike. Anyways I've decided to continue working on my build whenever feasible. Some more upgrades will happen soon since the options are many. Until this build happened my bike's engine was never opened up for any kind of work. There's no point in feeling proud about the stock engine anymore. And after this there's no way I can revert to stock. It's just not good enough.

Perfect Street Setup: Big Bore + Custom Exhaust w/o DB killer. w/db killer kills the purpose of having a custom exhaust in the fist place. (And ECU when it's launched will further improve the whole setup)

Conclusion: The very minimum of big bore is the best thing you can do to improve your R15s overall performance and ride-ability. Everyone might not get an exclusive setup, regardless it's a very straightforward job which a good mech can do anywhere. Get the kit, bolt it on and RIDE. Any further upgrades will only make it more worthwhile. It comes at a fraction of the cost of your bike. Don't think twice about it!





You guys need to stop cribbing about being a student and being broke. There are so many students here working and studying and getting one step closer to their dreams. Kits for RTR? There's atleast 1-2 RTRs which come to Joel for the works every day. If you guys are serious about performance. It's time to get off the internet and work your ass off, save up, kit up your bike and enjoy the smile plastered across your faces on every single ride. And please stick to the topic of this thread.

Cheers,
KwokFist

P.S. Chrome exhaust belongs to Uday and the stock exhaust is mine!

^^ Nice review there, and I feel its unbiased and straight forward. Thanks for putting it up.

Pull in 6th from 3.5k? That speaks a lot about the mods.