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  • Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
    That is a great finding shoeb . I never imagined they would sink the faltu current produced by the lighting coil of the alternator, when not in use, in this way .

    It had happened so quickly , that I just remember the heated wire on my hand looking down to see red+green wire and instinctively pulling the connection . Then in a hurry I connected it rightly and locked up and left, it was 8:45am. I was in a big hurry, Sunday was jamai-soshti and I had to fetch 2kilo of mishti-doi from our favorite shop, and they will run out of stock by 9am on such days. No Mishti-doi or Sandesh on such a day would be a proper disaster .
    SO it occurrs to me on reading your observation. Yes you are right of course ... no way I could have connected wrong pole of battery to bike's connectors . So I examined the arrangement closely again today ..

    So yes , indeed no way to connect the green battery wire's terminal to the bike's red ! So what did I do on sunday ?!! I must have connected the battery's green wire to the battery red , shorting the battery for a moment !! That is the only thing possible . Darns !


    You tell me now what it is ? Simple fuse or circuit breaker ? The fuse on my old cbz-x doesn't look like this one for sure .

    Closer look , can see that strip inside ?
    Maybe the battery lost its charge momentarily and took some time to get back the charge after a sudden short ?That can explain why it took 5secs for the neutral indicator to light up ?
    Just my thought...............

    That is a normal blow-type fuse and not a circuit breaker,maybe your cbz has one.
    Can you post a picture of that ? Please ?
    See , the way I check for the charge state of a flooded lead acid battery is to check the open-circuit voltage with meter , then take off the caps and check the colour and consistency of the electrodes . Fully charged flooded lead-acid battery should have more than 12.5v and dark-grey to almost matt-black anode and a brownish cathode . None to negligible white powdery deposits(sulfate) may be there on the electrodes . Colour & water level should be consistent across all the cells . Each cell should measure around 2.1v fully charged (measured by inserting meter's probe into each cell to reach the cathode) . After this you can measure the specific-gravity of the electrolyte with hygrometer too . I learned all this faltu work hands on maintaining banks of batteries of various types for work .
    On examining this and other vehicle's batteries I found two defects . 1) The colour of the anode on 2-4 of the cells would remain a lighter grey colour after on-vehicle charging . 2) There would be large amount of white deposits(sulpate) on 2-4 cells . This indicates a improper formatting of the battery, imbalanced charging across the cells and surface-charge . A new lead-acid battery needs to be formatted by fully charging and then discharging to safe discharge depth atleast ten cycles . Battery should be maintained on trickle charging whenever not in use for long time, specially in hot climates . Also from time to time (say in 1-2 months) of use, the battery should be put on an equalising charge of more than 14.5v for about 2 hours to eliminate excess sulfate formation on the electrodes, equalising the charge state across the cells and prevent electrolyte stratification . Electrolyte level should be maintained above the electrodes, by addition of water if necessary after the charging is complete . So you can safely pull my leg that I am a bit too finicky about batteries .
    This is the charging voltage I get at 1/4 throttle at idle and battery connected . Ok, no ?
    Some good info there Pinaki ji,(Very useful for maintaining big and expensive batteries)
    These batteries last long,require little maintenance and are cheap to replace.
    No need to take care so much for these tiny batteries.
    Last edited by shoeb2015; 05-30-2012, 01:38 AM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by shoeb2015 View Post
      Maybe the battery lost its charge momentarily and took some time to get back the charge after a sudden short ?That can explain why it took 5secs for the neutral indicator to light up ?
      That is a normal blow-type fuse and not a circuit breaker,maybe your cbz has one.
      Can you post a picture of that ? Please ?
      Some good info there Pinaki ji,
      These batteries last long,require little maintenance and are cheap to replace.
      No need to take care so much for these tiny batteries.
      possibly .. when neutral didn't light up on turning the key , I immediately turned it off , sensing further trouble . Then turned it on after checking everything maybe two minutes later .. it turned right on and ran fine .
      trying .. kid brother riding that one now . But as far as I remember that fuse cartridge has a thin wire inside it ? not a strip of metal like this ?
      All my batteries get same treatment , including tinier NiMH and lithium rechargeable ones .
      Last edited by Pinaki; 05-30-2012, 01:48 AM.

      Comment


      • @Sibun,
        Do you have a Parts catalogue ? Can you get it from your retailer friend ?.

        Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
        All my batteries get same treatment , including tinier NiMH and lithium rechargeable ones .
        How do you check the electrodes ?
        How do you maintain those ? Any tips to share ?
        Last edited by shoeb2015; 05-30-2012, 01:53 AM.

        Comment


        • [off topic]

          For NiMH you can buy smart chargers with battery-recondition and analysis capability like the Lacrosse BC-1000 , PowerEx MG C9000 charger analyser, Maha etc etc . Or buy Sanyo Eneloop batteries SANYO eneloop | Ready to use Rechargeable Battery - The only battery you will ever need - simple .
          For lithium ion batteries - it's bit more complicated . Thermal regulated chargers atleast & long storage in refrigerated condition . Read this - Understanding Lithium-Ion and Smart Battery Technology HP Pavilion Notebook PCs - HP Customer Care (United States - English)
          And never allow any of these batteries to drop to hard floor etc or allow them to knock around in a bag or dash-cabinet etc. They have thin glass tubes inside .
          Last edited by Pinaki; 05-30-2012, 02:24 AM.

          Comment


          • I was cleaning the carburetor and found a picece of very small tube attached to the float end where the float pin attaches to the float .
            I Don't know who fixed it there(Maybe during the warranty period in 2004 ?),it also lowered the float height considerably.

            After removing that piece the engine is super-smooth and runs cooler
            I never knew that float height can make such a huge difference .

            Is it a common practice to adjust float level using small tubes ?
            Last edited by shoeb2015; 05-31-2012, 08:10 PM.

            Comment


            • Lower float height makes your fuel-air mixture lean and vice-versa .
              No , it's not the common practice as far as other carburetors are concerned , but in case of this particular carb , they are left with no choice . There is no provision in this carburetor's construction to adjust the float level .



              In other carbs , the tiny protruding tang you see at the base of the float (to which the float-pin attaches on the other side, marked in light blue) is adjustable up-down in some way , usually it's made of metal and can be bend to adjust . This lowers/raises the float level . In this particular model keihin PB carb(from my 2010 splendor) , that tang is plastic , moulded in fixed position . Cannot be adjusted . It was also marked with permanent markers-pens , so I think that they adjust it correctly at the factory and then melt/mould the adjustment tang to the fixed position , so that their own service-center jokers can't unsettle it in future in any way .
              Float height adjustment is critical to the operation of the carburetor, so much so that Keihin makes a special tool for it .
              Last edited by Pinaki; 06-01-2012, 12:48 AM.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Pinaki View Post
                Lower float height makes your fuel-air mixture lean and vice-versa .
                No , it's not the common practice as far as other carburetors are concerned , but in case of this particular carb , they are left with no choice . There is no provision in this carburetor's construction to adjust the float level .

                In other carbs , the tiny protruding tang you see at the base of the float (to which the float-pin attaches on the other side, marked in light blue) is adjustable up-down in some way , usually it's made of metal and can be bend to adjust . This lowers/raises the float level . In this particular model keihin PB carb(from my 2010 splendor) , that tang is plastic , moulded in fixed position . Cannot be adjusted . It was also marked with permanent markers-pens , so I think that they adjust it correctly at the factory and then melt/mould the adjustment tang to the fixed position , so that their own service-center jokers can't unsettle it in future in any way .
                Float height adjustment is critical to the operation of the carburetor, so much so that Keihin makes a special tool for it .
                ???All this while I was thinking you marked it .

                What is the correct way to measure the float height ?
                What is the recommended float height ?

                Does New float comes with markings ? I don't have any markings or measurements whatsoever so buying a new float will do ??
                Last edited by shoeb2015; 06-01-2012, 01:02 AM.

                Comment


                • No no , I have had bad luck always tinkering with things I half understand .
                  You can build a level check tool easily . Get a feet or two of transparent tube from nearby exide battery shop . They give it free as overflow tube with new bike batteries , for which it's useless of course, correct fit for this carb's drain nipple . Put bike in mainstand in level ground so that the carb is level to ground(not tilted any way) . Close fuel petcock . Fix this transparent tube to the carb drain outlet, after removing the rubber drain tube . Bend to a U-shape and fix the other(open) end of the tube somehow to the side of the carb bowl . Use duct tape, metal wire loop .. whatever . Open fuel petcock . Open carb drain screw with screwdriver . The petrol should flow down the tube and come to rest in it at the same level that's inside the carb bowl(mark the level with fine marker pen) . The correct level for keihin PB carb as far as i could find out from very sketchy info is just where the bowl meets the carb body +/- 2mm for adjustment . If it needs any adjustments , in this case I guess you have to do jugaads like the one you found . Here are two pics of such a tool in operation from a different carb model , but I think you'll get the general idea ..



                  I have no idea how a new float bowl part will come from HeroHonda with level etc set ... have never bought one, but I vaguely remember once Yamaha service center asked me to leave the bike(which of course I didn't) and then they tried a number of new float+pin etc combination till one set worked right .
                  Last edited by Pinaki; 06-01-2012, 01:49 AM.

                  Comment


                  • Thank You Pinaki ji.
                    I have transparent tube lying in my tool box,I will check the float height and report it here tomorrow.

                    I opened the carb because the engine was feeling sluggish to rev-up and
                    rev-down after high speed runs and no amount of AFR adjustment would work,engine felt as if it was running lean.
                    If I ride the bike slow,everything is fine

                    After removing that piece of tube,it fixed 95% of the problem.

                    @Sibun- I need your help.
                    Last edited by shoeb2015; 06-01-2012, 02:07 AM.

                    Comment


                    • I guess it was running lean . I know cause mine is too , without any adjustments . The scope of AFR adjustment with the AFR screw,idle nut etc is a very narrow range with this carburetor . What I believe is that this carb was designed to be simple fix and forget kinda device .. with a little adjustment for manufacturing and fitting variations , baas . So the jugaad done to your float height was putting the correct AFR out of the range of adjustment possible with the AFR-screw etc .
                      The remaining 5% of your problem now may be because by removing the jugaad piece, you have offshot the correct AFR and running a bit on the richer side now. Just my guess . Check that float level and see .
                      If you remove the slide mechanism at the top of it by unscrewing the large serrated cap where the accelerator cable goes in, you'll find a cylindrical slide mechanism, a spring and a long needle kinda(valve) thing . I believe a wider range of adjustments is possible by moving up/down a collar ring attached to this needle valve . But Sibun'jee only knows the details of it .
                      Last edited by Pinaki; 06-01-2012, 02:43 AM.

                      Comment


                      • @ Sibun / Pinaki

                        Please post a detailed procedure of carburetor tuning which includes
                        1.float level adjustment
                        2.air screw adjustment
                        3.Slide Piston needle cir-clip adjustment

                        How to identify
                        1.correct idling rpm and smooth firing.
                        2.If the mixture is lean or rich.(symptoms/indications)


                        Waiting for your detailed posts.
                        Last edited by shoeb2015; 06-01-2012, 05:02 PM.

                        Comment


                        • please wait till sunday.i have all the solutions for your problems be it coil, afr and resistors. please be paitient. i am tied up with work and presently posting through my mobile standing at work site in this 40+ temperature.
                          @shoeb- do not fiddle with the air screw. your problem is different. most probably i will open my joy valve and bore so i will post the photos also.please mention which bike and how much it has run after engine overhaul .
                          Photo of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/854067-post963.html-3.88 lac km cont....Ownership review of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/832255-post608.html- slowly updating as and when getting time. HERO HONDA CBZ EXTREME(2011) - 47K KM AND COUNTINGhttp://www.xbhp.com/talkies/motorcyc...tml#post904152-carb tuning guide

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by sibun View Post
                            please wait till sunday.i have all the solutions for your problems be it coil, afr and resistors. please be paitient. i am tied up with work and presently posting through my mobile standing at work site in this 40+ temperature.
                            thanks sibun, closely watching this thread now, no hurry,post at your own peace....make sure you post the correct part no resistors and 4 Hole lighting coil which is compatible with 2001 passion 1st gen model.


                            btw what is afr ?

                            Comment


                            • I have a 2003 Splendor and the headlight is an old one. In 2005, I fitted the new reflector headlight from the new lot Splendors. Now, the illumination and beam throw is really bad from it, really bad, just like a torch light. Are there any alternative direct-fit headlights that have better illumination and beam throw? Anybody has done any modification?

                              @pinaki, seems you have done good modification and has knowledge about splendor. Any suggestions from you?
                              HH Karizma (Current) || CBF Stunner PGM-FI || Honda CB Unicorn Dazzler
                              Honda Aviator || Kinetic Flyte || Kinetic Blaze || HH Splendor

                              Two ZMAs, 9 Days in Western Ghats

                              Comment


                              • No problem Sibun,take your time.


                                It is a 2004 splendor+, done 16,000kms only.
                                I change the oil every six months,carb cleaning every 5,000 kms.
                                Fuel tank,valve and filter cleaning every year.
                                I clean and lube the chain,air filter every month,inspection and minor tweaking/exploring/fiddling/tinkering twice a week.
                                Average Daily usage is < 2 km @50 kmph max.(Used for procuring groceries and other daily chores,stop and go).
                                Distance covered in first two years-10,000kms,last five years -only 6,000 kms.
                                Last edited by shoeb2015; 06-03-2012, 10:26 AM.

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