Engine Oils

[muztariq]

first read this please.. Which is hotter? Which needs a sparkplug to ignite.. Which fuel has higher ignition temperature..

Diesel vs Petrol

you may also be interested to read this..
Quote : Gas units burn hotter than diesel units, and hence they have a significantly shorter life compared with diesel units.

https://www.dieselserviceandsupply.com/why_use_diesel.aspx

may be you are comparing a truck diesel vs a maruti 800 petrol.

Also, regarding your post - that 150 deg riding does not relate to engine seizures.. It meant you feel that at 150 deg celcius nothing much happens.. Misunderstanding I think..

Did i say mineral molecules break at 150 deg celcius.. No.
At 150 deg celcius the W40 oil thins down a lot and one important function of engine oil is to avoid metal to metal contact. At that temperature, the mineral oil thins too too much and the film strength is also way weaker.. This results in metal ro metal contact, generation of more heat resulting in complete engine seizure.. Thats why racing bikes uses w60 grade oils whose film strength remains sufficiently strong at that temp. Racing oils also have esters whose film strength remains intact at high temperatures.

[FranklySpeaking]

you may also be interested to read this..
Quote : Gas units burn hotter than diesel units, and hence they have a significantly shorter life compared with diesel units.
www.dieselserviceandsupply.com/why_use_diesel.aspx

Seems like you are yourselves not reading the links that you have been posting lately. Copy-pasting from the link you just gave:

While gasoline engines operate on spark ignition, diesel engines employ compression - ignition for igniting the fuel. In the latter, air is drawn into the engine and subjected to high compression that heats it up. This results in a very high temperature in the engine, much higher than the temperature attained in a gasoline engine. At peak temperature and pressure, diesel that is let into the engine ignites on account of the extreme temperature

first read this please.. Which is hotter? Which needs a sparkplug to ignite.. Which fuel has higher ignition temperature..

Diesel vs Petrol

I am sorry, nowhere does this link talk about the temperatures inside the combustion chamber or the oil temperatures.

Next time around, do go through the links yourselves first and then post. Thank you.

[murlidhar]

pffft. not again. i don't why i subscribed this thread.
sorry seniors and juniors too but let's keep the discussion healthy.

it's not about i am right. you are wrong. it's about sharing one's knowledge even it meant it isn't correct.
there is something called constructive criticism. let's not be rude.
let's not let our egos fly around.
we even have a topic about road rage in the forum.
i am sure we all are well educated too.
people google to these forums in search. it's not healthy for our forum either.
I did mention about this before too. we are brothers. let's gain things ( knowledge)from each other.

that said i am thinking of unsubscribing from this topic.
wanted to learn as much as i could but not getting much to learn except ......

[muztariq]

Seems like you are yourselves not reading the links that you have been posting lately. Copy-pasting from the link you just gave:

While gasoline engines operate on spark ignition, diesel engines employ compression - ignition for igniting the fuel. In the latter, air is drawn into the engine and subjected to high compression that heats it up. This results in a very high temperature in the engine, much higher than the temperature attained in a gasoline engine. At peak temperature and pressure, diesel that is let into the engine ignites on account of the extreme temperature



I am sorry, nowhere does this link talk about the temperatures inside the combustion chamber or the oil temperatures.

Next time around, do go through the links yourselves first and then post. Thank you.

you are again misunderstanding the whole concept.. And its not my duty to correct you.. But i will still try.
The compression in the diesel engine causes the temp. to go higher than gasoline engines and it auto burns.. in petrol engines the compression is low so it does not autoburn.. it is supplied with a spark plug to ignite the fuel. what happens after the fuel burns.. petrol burns hotter than diesel, resulting in hotter engine temperature, whereas diesel burns to form higher amount of gases at lower temperatures than a petrol engine resulting in lower temperature gases in the exhaust.
I did cut copy pasted to help you out, as its very easy to misinterpret if one doesnt read carefully.

@ murlidhar - arent we having a constructive debate here?

[Honda_CBF]

Voila.. Muztariq ji & frankly speaking ji, you both seems correct about temps attained by diesel and petrol engines (I'm no expert) diesels are hotter than petrol at compression stroke and petrols are hotter than diesels at power stroke.
@ murlidhar,
dont unsubscribe I'd say, atleast you'll be getting oil reviews
and I totally feel this debate is good & brotherly. Have seen few threads where modds have to pitch in & delete posts to stop personal attacks.

[murlidhar]

well don't know but i did feel there were sparks flying around

i managed to get a picture of engine oil from the vespa service center. according to them this oil is directly coming from Italy.
while i couldn't see any grade or any certifications on the oil but there was mention of API SL JASO MA in the workshop pdf that i managed to download from internet that belonged for European vespas. the grade was 5w40 but the manager of vespa service said that the grade for India is 15w40.
have had scams in adidas a few other MNCs in India. i just hope they not playing with my scooter
the can says it's petronas. that's all.
will go for servicing today. will take a better picture of it if possible.
the can is in 5l only and the cost printed on it is INR 1000 something.

[ravi@17bhp]

All, there is good conversation. Good information comes out when there is a challenge. I am sure the members here know they are just exchanging information and clarifying doubts, rather than taking it personal.

well don't know but i did feel there were sparks flying around

i managed to get a picture of engine oil from the vespa service center. according to them this oil is directly coming from Italy.
while i couldn't see any grade or any certifications on the oil but there was mention of API SL JASO MA in the workshop pdf that i managed to download from internet that belonged for European vespas. the grade was 5w40 but the manager of vespa service said that the grade for India is 15w40.
have had scams in adidas a few other MNCs in India. i just hope they not playing with my scooter
the can says it's petronas. that's all.
will go for servicing today. will take a better picture of it if possible.
the can is in 5l only and the cost printed on it is INR 1000 something.

Petronas is a good oil. As long as its W40, 5w or 15w doesn't affect the engine at high temperatures.

Sometimes, I feel we are too much concerned about engine oils and their grades. Any oil from a good brand like Shell, Gulf Pride, Motul, Mobil do serve well for our purpose.

[muztariq]

@ murlidhar -
give us a review of the oil.. Imported and 200 rs per litre .. Wow. I hope 1000 something is not 1499, 1399 something.

Also,having some fun while having informative conversations makes it more interesting.. There is no expert here.. The flow of information is give and take type.. Otherwise it would become a lecture from a professor.

[Honda_CBF]

Any oil from a good brand serve well for our purpose.

+1 to that.
Only difference is feel from the oil and negligible +/- on engine life.
@ murlidhar,
do post a review of that oil.

[murlidhar]

ahem....
regarding a review of the oil is tough for me since this is the first time i am using on a 4 stroker.
am pretty much pleased with the smooth engine.
got the first service done and now i can feel the engine more smoother.
saw the old oil too it was dark in color. the newish oil is Brown in color.

that's it.
now about the cost factor.
my scoot takes 700 ml and i have been charged INR 182.
so that makes it 260 a litre n 1300 for five litres.
hmmm but i still think the mrp rate is just above 1000. atleast the picture that i have taken shows the first two digits. they look legible to me. there is quite a different between 3 and 0 for the second digit.
however i have asked them if i can buy the whole 5 litre pack and they said they not sure and will take permission from the plant in baramati and only they can sell it.
no one has yet asked for a 5 litre bottle na.
: )

[vivekgautams]

I recently filled a FS(Shell Advanced ultra 10W40) oil.Now after 400km, I noticed that the bike (RTR 180 ABS) leaks out oil from the cylinder head.(a few gear slips & a few false neutrals, but not a big deal)
The engine oil was found on the front mud guard & on the exhaust pipe( right in front of the engine) & on the plastic covering the battery..
Is it a huge issue, as the engine oil level has dipped negligibly. Has anyone else faced the same problem..?? What should I do to resolve the problem..

[muztariq]

I recently filled a FS(Shell Advanced ultra 10W40) oil.Now after 400km, I noticed that the bike (RTR 180 ABS) leaks out oil from the cylinder head.(a few gear slips & a few false neutrals, but not a big deal)
The engine oil was found on the front mud guard & on the exhaust pipe( right in front of the engine) & on the plastic covering the battery..
Is it a huge issue, as the engine oil level has dipped negligibly. Has anyone else faced the same problem..?? What should I do to resolve the problem..

it seems the head gasket it leaking. Plz get it replaced.
Clutch is also worn out. No fault of the oil.
How many kms you did on this bike?

[vivekgautams]

it seems the head gasket it leaking. Plz get it replaced.
Clutch is also worn out. No fault of the oil.
How many kms you did on this bike?

The bikes odo was 13200km when i filled the FS..Now the odo is 13700km.
The gear slips or false neutral occurs only when the engine is cold( starting 2-3 km) then the gear shifts & clutch is perfect..

[Honda_CBF]

I recently filled a FS(Shell Advanced ultra 10W40) oil.Now after 400km, I noticed that the bike (RTR 180 ABS) leaks out oil from the cylinder head.(a few gear slips & a few false neutrals, but not a big deal)
The engine oil was found on the front mud guard & on the exhaust pipe( right in front of the engine) & on the plastic covering the battery..

seems like only valve cover gasket is leaking (from the pic) not the head gasket. Though the leak is not small. Get the gaskets changed. And keep a watch on oil level until you get that gasket(s) replaced.

[Pinaki]

The bikes odo was 13200km when i filled the FS..Now the odo is 13700km.
The gear slips or false neutral occurs only when the engine is cold( starting 2-3 km) then the gear shifts & clutch is perfect..

Is that the recomended grade oil for your bike? .... better check the owner's manual and revert to recommended grade . Gasket/seal looks to have been damaged by overheating . Replace them and keep a check on heat and oil levels .