Petrol prices update thread

[liionheart]

Regarding #5: Go over the balances sheets of these petrol companies. For example - iocl. Check three columns of special interest. The profit the company is making(Yes they declare a profit to keep stakeholders happy), the grant govt of India is giving and the subsidy the govt of India is giving.
You will get this data on iocl.com . The number of "educated" people who liked that photo is amazing

-- I have been dealing with data (real data -- not some fb image

We all know at the start of Indian govt. after independence some commodities were operated by govt. as Public sector for good of common man, and builiding nation.

Public sector like IOCL, GAIL etc are created & Managed by govt. for social welfare & public interest. And we all know how important petrol & diesel are for building economy & common people, so does it feels ironic that same public sector laments for profits & loss over common man interest for which purpose they are created.

Come to Xtra premium petrol sold by IOCL they sell it 3-4 rs more than normal oil, but in fact they mix a chemical priced only 2-3 paise for a ltr. of petrol, see if they want to earn money(profit) there are lots of genuine ways, but kindly keep basic fuel price with in reach of people

Now see the other side of pics also How much oil does Reliance Export annually through its refinery, much much more than the total capacity of IOCL, BPCL etc combined. Dont you see some thing is wrong in here I am not pointing at Relience as they are private company but public sector and govt. management and purpose of Public sector to work for social welfare,

I will not dwell for importance for petrol or diesel for building economy or common man... But govt. cuts a large part of hard earned salary of working class every months as a tax. SO we pay tax for what??

Earning Profit is not a right for these company but serving social welfare is their responsibility along with govt .

[NitinGirish]

Just did some quick calculations from the Final Accounts available at IOC website. From IOC atleast, government has profited in FY 11'. Latest results are not available in the website yet.

I've attached the calculation sheet but I would just look at only two figures: Excise duty is Rs.25789.90 Cr and Subsidy is Rs.24281.5 Cr (22604.84+1676.66). So what is this burden government keeps talking about?

EDIT: Would be interesting to do this exercise for other PSUs also and also look at the schedules.

[Mik]

And we all know how important petrol & diesel are for building economy & common people, so does it feels ironic that same public sector laments for profits & loss over common man interest for which purpose they are created.

Come to Xtra premium petrol sold by IOCL they sell it 3-4 rs more than normal oil, but in fact they mix a chemical priced only 2-3 paise for a ltr. of petrol, see if they want to earn money(profit) there are lots of genuine ways, but kindly keep basic fuel price with in reach of people

Now see the other side of pics also How much oil does Reliance Export annually through its refinery, much much more than the total capacity of IOCL, BPCL etc combined. Dont you see some thing is wrong in here I am not pointing at Relience as they are private company but public sector and govt. management and purpose of Public sector to work for social welfare,

I will not dwell for importance for petrol or diesel for building economy or common man... But govt. cuts a large part of hard earned salary of working class every months as a tax. SO we pay tax for what??

Earning Profit is not a right for these company but serving social welfare is their responsibility along with govt .

Sir, i will not speak as a government spokesperson here.
But, diesel is much more important to infra than petrol (Petrol is easy revenue for the govt by a non voting middleclass) Hence, diesel is heavily subsidized (Check pakistan prices to see what kind of benefits we have)
Are we willing to pay the actual cost of an LPG cylinder or for that matter can a poor person afford to pay the market rate of kerosene.
Regarding direct taxes -- less than 3% people in India pay income tax(This data is there in the public domain) -- and we all know the kind of dhaandli everybody in India does (From the IT guy over declaring hra, submitting fake receipts -- to the peons -- to the IAS guy -- right upto the minister) by under declaring stuff -- by promoting black money(in every aspect - by unbilled transactions to selling properties with black money to hawala transactions).
What is this crap about "social welfare" by IOC. Smell the coffee - its a liberalized and capitalized world. Check the prices of Shell petrol - even before the hike. India is no longer the socialist nation of the 60s and 70s. Still we are lucky that kerosene, LPG and diesel are subsidized.
While we can go on being cynical about the incumbent government (rightly so) or the scams that are there - at the end of the day - the government needs to mop up money to build infra, pay salaries, run defence and administer the country. If they dont do a good job here - vote them out.

We can go around in circles trying to convince others or ourselves about this -- there is hardly any point. We are not decision makers and atleast i am not doing anything to influence any decisions. All i can do is pay my taxes properly, not submit fake receipts, not dupe other people, hope for the social upliftment of the country(for people who desperately need it - not the "middle class" which goes around in cars and cries foul) and pray for a better tomorrow
Peace. over n out. No more replies from my side. Gotta ride tomorrow

[princesirohi]

what u stated is wrong, how is it possible that only 3% of people pay taxes?

do you think only 3% of total population works in private sector?

ever heard of TDS? Tax Deduction at Source.

We pay taxes even before the salaries are deposited in our account.

hey delhi xbhpians... file an RTI application to ask how the price of petrol is calculated, how much taxes etc?

[aargee]

Mik - Let me not get too deep into calculations as numbers can be manipulative most of the times;
1. What might be the current tax due from the oil companies to the income tax department? Especially for IOL?
2. Why tax only on these fuels? There're other ways to generate revenues isn't it? Say on, cigarettes etc?
3. If the oil companies are making losses, why not hand it over to the private sector? That way the Govt can have one less headaches isn't it?

Last but not the least, wondering what could be the revenue if the Govt pressures the Swiss Banks to disclose the account balances of Indians holding accounts with them

[NitinGirish]

1. What might be the current tax due from the oil companies to the income tax department? Especially for IOL?

Rs.1355 Cr for last FY, i.e FY11. Latest results are not out yet.

There is also excise duty that was paid to Govt. to the tune of Rs.25789.90 Cr in the last FY.

[aargee]

Rs.1355 Cr for last FY, i.e FY11. Latest results are not out yet.

There is also excise duty that was paid to Govt. to the tune of Rs.25789.90 Cr in the last FY.

Exactly man!!! All these outcry on losses should be probably to hide this huge pile. Meanwhile, I came across this - Business Line : Companies News : BPCL profit up over four-fold in Q4, declares 1:1 bonus

[mid]

Exactly man!!! All these outcry on losses should be probably to hide this huge pile. Meanwhile, I came across this - Business Line : Companies News : BPCL profit up over four-fold in Q4, declares 1:1 bonus

They never said they are in loss, did they?
They use the word 'under recovery'!

[aargee]

They never said they are in loss, did they?
They use the word 'under recovery'!

Lol!!! Is there a world of difference? If they don't make losses, then why tax on fuels? Like I pointed above, there're several other ways to rip "AAM AADMI"

[mid]

Lol!!! Is there a world of difference? If they don't make losses, then why tax on fuels? Like I pointed above, there're several other ways to rip "AAM AADMI"

The same way the state government act like taking huge burden to reduce the price by not taking the EXTRA tax benefit they receive from the hike

Greedy people

[aargee]

The same way...Greedy people

Exactly; its much worse than greed, crook & humiliation. Every time the Rupee looses its value its always Crankgress in power. Don't know if its coincidence.

[Dreamwalker987]

Yahoo blog:Why the petrol price hike is a good thing
link:
Why the petrol price hike is a good thing | Atlas Invested - Yahoo! India Finance

[liionheart]

Sir, i will not speak as a government spokesperson here.
But, diesel is much more important to infra than petrol (Petrol is easy revenue for the govt by a non voting middleclass)

Now demarcation of fuel on basis of use is totally wrong now a days, every high profile cars have diesel version. And many public transport (important for infra runs on CNG or any other fuel type) & why I compare with Pakistan Where type of govt. & policies are totally questionable, why not USA or Europe??

What is this crap about "social welfare" by IOC. Smell the coffee - its a liberalized and capitalized world. Check the prices of Shell petrol - even before the hike. India is no longer the socialist nation of the 60s and 70s.

Then please announce them as private company not public sector. At least we will not be in illusion. Put in black & white, pass the policy in parliament that there will be no Public sector from now on.

All i can do is pay my taxes properly, not submit fake receipts, not dupe other people, hope for the social upliftment of the country(for people who desperately need it - not the "middle class" which goes around in cars and cries foul) and pray for a better tomorrow
Peace. over n out. No more replies from my side. Gotta ride tomorrow

Is there difference between tax stealing & tax planning?? And your 3% figure i doubt it, 3% is just the % of govt. employment in India.. so do you mean to say only govt. employ pay taxes ( may be my perception is wrong)

I had a friend working in IOCL, he says that by losses they mean that profit not targeted by their management not the exact loses. Actually it is comparison between profit target set by management & actual profit. the difference they term as lose...

If any XBHP ian in working in State owned Oil company, please elaborate.

How much Dhandli done in fuel transportation, loads of truck vaporizes in routes & from accounts, tapping from pipe (supply line out side company premises)....monthly supply to special persons..the list on & on.. And it is huge..lacs & lacs of amount in single day..

Please instead of raising prices, kindly manage your resources well, the loss(umm... i said losses) will surely will be less

[j4zb4]

Exactly; its much worse than greed, crook & humiliation. Every time the Rupee looses its value its always Crankgress in power. Don't know if its coincidence.

Even when the rupee reached 44 (43.8 to be precise) the Congress was in power...

The rise of teh dollar is mainly due to the withdrawals of FII... The government has got nothing to do with it... The Government can't control recession in Europe and the Amrikaas...

[Mik]

Yes my figures are wrong. The actual figure is 2.77% of people in India pay personal income tax. You can google for the info if someone is really interested. As a society we are so used to government doles that suddenly paying the real price of things is pulverizing for us.
Anyway.. butted into the thread to give the correct figure. Ciao.