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**splus** · 08-12-2013, 06:23 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Why was your engine opened. Yes, you may be correct. I dont believe in babying my bike/car during the running in. I ride it the usual way, making a point never to lug the engine. I guess when people baby the bike, they try to restrict themselves strictly to a certain rpm where higher gears would cause lugging.

I try to push the bike quite often during the breaking in, making it a point not to hit the redline or rev limiter too often. I have been doing this since last 4-5 years.

I did the same on my 220 DTSi, and when I went for the mods, Joel said the block and piston was in good shape. Wherein, my friend who completed the running very carefully, his block piston was in a bad shape when we had gone for mods.

My P230 (after the mods) held up fine till 20K kms before I sold it. Doing the same with my Duke, and I see bike responding well to throttle inputs.

I can experience the front lightening up when I push the bike hard. I am not complaining, I love that feel. I feel little more power and this machine can do power wheelies.

I will be visiting Joel by this year end in Bangalore to get the head work and other mods.

My engine wasn't opened. I only talked to some mechanics (not KTM) who opened many engines of various bikes, and that's what they said. They also said the reason for glazed cylinder walls was the owners being too gentle with their bikes in initial period.

The mods sound good! If one can get a such a good performance from stock engine with just ECU remap then I can only imagine what can be done with engine mods!!!
Vikram from Motozone mentioned last week they'll soon get some modified engine parts for Duke so the rev limiter can be safely raised to 13k rpm. Don't know what else. Maybe call him and check what they are planning...

I just talked to Vikram again regarding the air filter. I wrote before they were offering BMC filter for Rs 3.5k - my mistake, they don't have it, and it normally costs around 5.5k.
Anyway, they sell Pipercross air filters for Rs 3.5k. He said the improvement is considerable if the air filter is put on stock bike, but much more with the bike with remapped ECU. He also said that BMC and KN filters are good but not suited for Indian roads because of too much dust, and that's where Pipercross filters perform better.

I'm thinking whether to order one... It feels that the bike with remapped ECU needs more air.

Originally posted by Trideep View Post

Hi All,

After much debate with myself, decided to go for the KTM Duke 200. Its been 5 days since I got a brand new duke and had a few questions in mind.

I noticed that the engine oil used was Motul 7100 at the time of delivery, from what I have read in this thread, people normally get with Semi Synthetic oil, so will using Full Synthetic oil hamper the engine later? When I asked the ASC guys, they said that they are delivering all bikes with 7100.

My last bike was a Pulsar 150 and I could easily find Neutral, but its been a little difficult to find neutral with the Duke, as in I keep shifting between 1st and 2nd, and only after some effort I find neutral. Is this normal until the first service?

Its completed 240 kms and its been great so far, but 2 days back, I pushed the bike to 7k rpm and since then its making a khat khat noise from around the engine area after using the bike for sometime. Seems like its the tappet noise, should I be concerned. Also, its only present after using the bike for sometime, its not there at startup.

Sorry for all the noob questions!

Congratulations!

It's quite normal about the noise. No worries, it'll settle itself after some use. Just use it freely, and the guys in service center will do its job at the first service.

Regarding the oil - well, from what I have read, everywhere it says it's practically not possible for engine to be broken in properly with fully synthetic oil. Synthetic oil is too smooth for the metal parts to properly align to each other. What will happen is the same glazed cylinder walls, as if a bike is being babied.

I'd suggest to change the oil to Motul 3000 fully mineral oil as soon as you can, together with oil filter. You can buy the oil filter from KTM and change the oil at any street mechanic shop.
You need 1.2-1.4 liters of oil, so you could buy 3 cans now for 2 oil changes.
If I were you I'd change the oil now and then again at first service, and keep the fully mineral till some 2000 km. After it change it to Motul 7100.
Give your engine a chance to properly break in for better engine, performance and mileage.

**chinmayakar** · 08-12-2013, 06:54 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Was browsing through Motozone site (as I am on Notice Period and have less work), and I must say I am impressed by what they have to offer. Good to see fine tuners cropping up in Mumbai.

I liked the Leo Vince exhaust. Any idea how it performs? Any one using it?

I also found 42 teeth rear sprocket, will the acceleration be hard?

Anyone using motozone products? It will be great if we can have a review.

Will be calling him up later (much later), as I know if I call him, and if I like what he says, then it will be very hard for me to stay away.

**karticraja** · 08-12-2013, 07:07 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by splus View Post

BTW, can you comment on the acceleration of stock sprocket vs 39T?
Is it a big difference?
Does the bike accelerate much slower or just little bit? Or pretty much similar as with stock sprocket, but just "feels" it accelerates slower?

I talked about it with both Abhishek from Kiirus and Vikram from Motozone. They both said the same thing - there's a chip inside the speedo which tells the ECU to cut the power if the top speed is reached. Different speedos (from different lots of bikes) have different limits.
The way to bypass this limitation is to disconnect the cable from the front wheel that goes to the console and measures the speed. The console would work, but only the speed would not be shown. That way the chip in the speedo wouldn't tell the ECU to cut the power. However, the only way to check the speed would be with GPS.
Disconnecting a speed cable isn't really an option for anyone, so the only way to get rid of that limiter is to rewire that chip inside the console. Motozone guys said they do that for Rs 1000 if a speedo is sent to them.

For example, my August 2012 Duke was cutting off at 136/137 kmh with the old map that had the rev limiter at 10,500 rpm in all gears. Which points to the fact that something else than ECU was cutting the power off (which would cut the power at 139 kmh).
I am not completely sure (I was maxing the engine at 136 kmh, it was windy), but I think it cut the power again at the same speed with Kiirus ECU few days ago.

I'll first change to 40T sprocket and test the top speed with it, and if it cuts off at that speed then I'll be looking to rewire that limiter one way or the other.
A really low kick by KTM to add such a top speed limiter, btw!!!

Hi Splus, as far as acceleration is concered, after changing the sprocket to 39t, there is a noticebale and considerable reduction in acceleration which definitely changes the characterestic of Duke for which it is known for - Lunatic Acceleration. But not that it is very slow now - Decent acceleration is available. However the power is still good till 10k rpm even in 6th gear.

As far as the speed cut off is concerned, as far as I know, the speed is cut off based on the engine speed only. Not the vehicle speed. You can check this by engaging 6th gear when the vehicle is at stop by pulling the clutch fully and then you open the throttle fully. You will notice that the speed will be zero but engine will cut off at 10.5k rpm.

**DukeDey** · 08-13-2013, 10:44 AM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

[MENTION=18379]splus[/MENTION] can you post the link for the motozone website? I am not able to find it.

Thanks
Dey

**splus** · 08-13-2013, 11:56 AM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by DukeDey View Post

[MENTION=18379]splus[/MENTION] can you post the link for the motozone website? I am not able to find it.

Thanks
Dey

They are on FB:

MOTOZONE

https://www.facebook.com/motozoneperformance

MOTOZONE, Mumbai/Pune. 7,761 पसंद. Tuning House with Performance Upgrades & Aftermarket Parts for Bikes & Cars....

Their ECU dropped to Rs 8k now.
If Abhishek from Kiirus is right then Motozone buy their ECU from Kiirus.
But they seem much more engaged in tuning of all kinds of bikes, as you can see on their FB page...

**splus** · 08-13-2013, 12:08 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by karticraja View Post

Hi Splus, as far as acceleration is concered, after changing the sprocket to 39t, there is a noticebale and considerable reduction in acceleration which definitely changes the characterestic of Duke for which it is known for - Lunatic Acceleration. But not that it is very slow now - Decent acceleration is available. However the power is still good till 10k rpm even in 6th gear.

As far as the speed cut off is concerned, as far as I know, the speed is cut off based on the engine speed only. Not the vehicle speed. You can check this by engaging 6th gear when the vehicle is at stop by pulling the clutch fully and then you open the throttle fully. You will notice that the speed will be zero but engine will cut off at 10.5k rpm.

Ok, thank you.
I'm curious how it'll feel with 40T and Kiirus ECU. I think it should still have a very good acceleration, but if not then I'd rather put 42T.

As for speed - I'll have to check that and see.
ECU limits only the rpms.
But, if both Abhishek from Kiirus and Vikram from Motozone are right then there's an additional chip in speedo itself that is connected to ECU, which cuts the power based on speed, not rpms.

If that's true then, according to logic, changing the rear sprocket wouldn't help, this chip would still cut the power at the same speed, regardless of changed rpms.

We'll see soon... I'll have another highway ride in a few days, and then will be changing the sprocket and doing a service.

**chinmayakar** · 08-13-2013, 12:26 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by splus View Post

Ok, thank you.
I'm curious how it'll feel with 40T and Kiirus ECU. I think it should still have a very good acceleration, but if not then I'd rather put 42T.

As for speed - I'll have to check that and see.
ECU limits only the rpms.
But, if both Abhishek from Kiirus and Vikram from Motozone are right then there's an additional chip in speedo itself that is connected to ECU, which cuts the power based on speed, not rpms.

If that's true then, according to logic, changing the rear sprocket wouldn't help, this chip would still cut the power at the same speed, regardless of changed rpms.

We'll see soon... I'll have another highway ride in a few days, and then will be changing the sprocket and doing a service.

Hi Serge, may be the chip in the speedo wont show more than 135 or 136? I mean restrict the numbers that you see on it. Have you read about similar chips on other bikes or cars that are speed limited?

Also, on Motozone site I did see a 42 teeth sprocket. Will acceleration be better with 42 teeth and Kiirus?

**splus** · 08-13-2013, 12:42 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Hi Serge, may be the chip in the speedo wont show more than 135 or 136? I mean restrict the numbers that you see on it. Have you read about similar chips on other bikes or cars that are speed limited?

Also, on Motozone site I did see a 42 teeth sprocket. Will acceleration be better with 42 teeth and Kiirus?

Well, I really don't know. I've heard about this chip independently from both Kiirus and Motozone guys, but haven't heard about it from anyone else.
However, I've had my own experience on old map that my bike was cutting at 136 kmh, whereas it "should" had cut at 139 kmh.
And I MIGHT have hit the same(?) limiter few days ago, but I am really not sure about it. Hopefully it won't be too windy in a few days so I'll be able to ride faster than 136 kmh, and see if that happens.
Of course, I would VERY much like if that doesn't happen, and that there's no any other limiter but the one in ECU!

No, the way the power was cut of at 136 kmh on my old ECU map before last December was pretty much like an ECU limiter, it cuts the power, you can feel it easily, and the speed drops down by 2-3 kmh.

I thought you already have 42T sprocket?
How old is your bike?
As [MENTION=63586]DukeDey[/MENTION] said, there's hardly any difference in acceleration between 43T and 42T. But 42T gives 3 kmh higher top speed...

If Motozone sell ONLY the rear sprocket that could be good, because KTM service centers sell only entire set with a chain and both sprockets. I think for some Rs 1.5k, more or less, can't really remember.

How much is 42T from Motozone?
I might order one if I decide to get the Pipercross air filter from them...

**sonu611** · 08-13-2013, 03:41 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

My bike was given for service at Khivraj Domlur. There was slight oil leak from engine head area.
After the service, when i went to receive the bike (2 days later), the bike was sitting in the ground floor, a quick inspection and i saw that the bike was not even washed properly. Leaving outside in rain would have cleaned the bike better in my opinion. After talking to the guys present there, I was taking out the bike without re washing because i was in a hurry to get back to office. I kept the bike idle for 30 seconds and checked the engine head, to my surprise, the oil leak actually increased.

From the picture u can see that the bike was not even washed properly. Now I talked to those guys and asked them to redo the gasket again. They re did the gasket and all was fine. But now I noticed that it is still leaking albeit in a small amount and that too after hard riding.

Would it be ok to do a trip of 1200km(4days) with the bike, topping up oil as necessary, or should I get it fixed asap. I am not sure I can get it fixed immediately because, I do not want to goto Khivraj ever again, and auto service is too far.

Any advice in this regard would be really helpful

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**chinmayakar** · 08-13-2013, 03:48 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by sonu611 View Post

My bike was given for service at Khivraj Domlur. There was slight oil leak from engine head area.
After the service, when i went to receive the bike (2 days later), the bike was sitting in the ground floor, a quick inspection and i saw that the bike was not even washed properly. Leaving outside in rain would have cleaned the bike better in my opinion. After talking to the guys present there, I was taking out the bike without re washing because i was in a hurry to get back to office. I kept the bike idle for 30 seconds and checked the engine head, to my surprise, the oil leak actually increased.

From the picture u can see that the bike was not even washed properly. Now I talked to those guys and asked them to redo the gasket again. They re did the gasket and all was fine. But now I noticed that it is still leaking albeit in a small amount and that too after hard riding.

Would it be ok to do a trip of 1200km(4days) with the bike, topping up oil as necessary, or should I get it fixed asap. I am not sure I can get it fixed immediately because, I do not want to goto Khivraj ever again, and auto service is too far.

Any advice in this regard would be really helpful

Shoot a mail to Bajaj/KTM, and you will be surprised how Khivraj will be after you to fix the issue. In the mean time AutoService is the best bet, else, if you stay around banaswadi, get in touch with Nisar from NMW (KalyanNagar). Let me know if you need his number.

**chinmayakar** · 08-13-2013, 07:40 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Spoke to Vikram from Motozone, and I cant believe my ears. Serge, shv need your help here. Vikram has asked me to meet him on Palm Beach Road on Sunday, where he will give me a demo of his pipercross foam filter.

He claims the filter will make me super happy and will just blow me off. He said the massive power and thrust gain will make me regret my ecu remapping decision. Could that be true?

Shiv, do you have any idea. Can his claims be taken seriously. I mean, never heard or read of just filter change improving performance so much....

**Sanchit Arora** · 08-13-2013, 08:52 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Spoke to Vikram from Motozone, and I cant believe my ears. Serge, shv need your help here. Vikram has asked me to meet him on Palm Beach Road on Sunday, where he will give me a demo of his pipercross foam filter.

He claims the filter will make me super happy and will just blow me off. He said the massive power and thrust gain will make me regret my ecu remapping decision. Could that be true?

Shiv, do you have any idea. Can his claims be taken seriously. I mean, never heard or read of just filter change improving performance so much....

Ecu remapping combined with good air-intake and an exhaust is usually a deadly combo...

Pls provide a detailed comparison & feedback if you test it...

**anilp** · 08-13-2013, 09:03 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Another piece of information, service centre guys said a pair of Metzelers would cost 11k from them, while same woul cost 25k outside as Bajaj purchases in bulk. Stock D200 tires cost 7k.

That's two great pieces of news today. First was the end of the strike at Chakan, and then this. Thanks, chinmayakar.

**shv18** · 08-13-2013, 11:34 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Originally posted by chinmayakar View Post

Spoke to Vikram from Motozone, and I cant believe my ears. Serge, shv need your help here. Vikram has asked me to meet him on Palm Beach Road on Sunday, where he will give me a demo of his pipercross foam filter.

He claims the filter will make me super happy and will just blow me off. He said the massive power and thrust gain will make me regret my ecu remapping decision. Could that be true?

Shiv, do you have any idea. Can his claims be taken seriously. I mean, never heard or read of just filter change improving performance so much....

Well as i have mentioned earlier i have not tried my hands on the Duke 200s he has worked on.. just saw customers giving a positive feedback while i was getting my work done. I guess Mr. Vikram would be a better person to justify his claims.. if i am correct he would be one of the first sellers to our experience: who is willingly coming forward for a challenge and let the rider test it to its limits...so sooner or later you shall have the result in front of you mate.

If you are asking me about his work... yes it is really good. That guy knows what he is talking about. He literally knows each nuts and bolts of any bike with correct torque ranges required for each one of them. I have never seen such proficiency even in the SVC managers i have come across.

But regarding Duke i am afraid that's all from my end.

Cheers,

**abhayshanu** · 08-13-2013, 11:39 PM

Re: KTM 200 Duke

I honestly don't think you get such a humongous difference in power with JUST a air filter. In any case, I would love to drop in on Sunday [MENTION=35854]chinmayakar[/MENTION], using the stock sprocket now again so might give a proper comparison of Stock vs Remapped vs Air Filtered.

Also on the Top Speed limiting issue. IF that is true which it CAN be, it has to be official from KTM. I say this as most of us know that many high end German cars are limited to 155 MPH though have potential of reaching much higher speeds. That is something which is announced by every brand. There are people who remove the Speed Limiters. So again as I say, it IS possible but I don't think if KTM would do such a thing why wouldn't they make it public opinion.

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