Sir, I would like to add one more point, when I saw the video about Designing the R15, I understood how the Harmony is achieved in designing every part. The answer to the 100 section rear tire gave me good knowledge on how a bike/engine is started and derived. So the point is, Will the chassis, Brakes and other parts support the upgrade. (Coz even the Daytona kit comes with a Body kit)


Yes Thanks Bro, I apologize I missed your name in the thread, Yes not to forget you were one among the experts who adviced me on Run-in techniques and to use Engine braking. Duke 200 is a wise choice and direct route to 20+HP instead of shortcuts and I wish you all the best

+1; Completely agreed.

Person who knows what he's doing will adhere to all those points, will know his/her & the ride's limit before & after the mods. Only a mindless person will nod "NO" to any of those points & still go with the mods; and that bloke is what we call mindless rider.

Thanks for your reply... I was referring to those who are hot headed,and without discipline on the road....imagine a potent vehicle in their hands....
Since as you say you are not one of them, you will surely understand this..Like you said Lack of maturity,lack of value for life and lack of biking education are the ID of a Mindless rider, to whom i was referring to...

What about the Research and development?
Those who push the limits/envelope to go further and discover the actual limits Vs myths and false beliefs.
Find out how far you can go before a component fails, be it a engine part or the human factor.

Race drivers are always pushing the edge, otherwise they are no-longer competitive and stop winning races. The engine stress's are far greater than a factory built engine. you can get a semi race engine built (have enough money and the world is your oyster) and ride/drive around the streets.
Simply having a modified vehicle does not necessarily label you as a mindless rider, Infact if anything you know your limits as you have designed, engineered and pushed the limits, Then you can detune for reliability, longevity etc. Endurance Vs Sprint for example.

Those who simply go out, bolt on some mods and expect to have race type engines are the "mindless riders"
They have not bothered to do their research and just blindly follow others (sometimes) wrong advise.
These types usually try do stupid things and can harm other road users with their mindless stupidity and ignorance.

Human nature is to push the limits, explore the unknown and experience it first hand. Had there not been any adventurous people in history we will still be living in caves.

I always say there is a time and place for everything. Sure you can ride your hotted up/ highly modified vehicle on the road but at the correct time and place.

True .... the point of discussion on engine upgrade ,and it's pros and cons were in itself detailed with many experiences shared . the brakes definitely along with the rubber(tire,wheel) need to be upgraded to ensure safer braking and stability...the exact Dyno figures of the respective engine improvement will be helpful.

Very true description of the mindless drivers I was refering to...just two days back a 12 yr old child travelling as pillion on an Activa was hit at great speed from behind by one of two bikes ,racing with each other ,and needless to say a life was lost...Pushing our limits without harming others is what exploration and life is about.

I can only speak for the R15 when I say, that the brakes and the tyres can take a whole lot more than what the stock engine throws at them....

I agree that R15 has potent rubbers and brakes but the modified setup demands more than the stock setup. Atleast, steel braided lines adds to the bite.

no offence but these general statements are exactly whats wrong with many.
A general statement is very easy to get away with.
Just for an example, can you specify from where did you conclude to the above statement? and on what basis can you say that the tyres can take a lot more than what a stock engine can throw? do you know what is the break away force on the r15 under standard test conditions? do you know what coefficient of friction is there? how did you ensure that your stock engine is not having a defect and that it is producing its full torque right from the push of starter?

what if i say that you are wrong since i have seen people do burnouts on the r15 which means that the tyre was unable to maintain he traction?

you see, i do not mean to offend you in any sense but general statements do not bind anyone. same applies to most of the so called tuners. I respect Joel for his dedication in the race tuned engines and no doubt he is a good engineer / tuner.
But do remember most tuners are Humans, and have families to support and making money is where people make general statements and get away with whatever they claim.
Peace

Guys, I really don't know where this thread is going.

For guys who think the modifications are not necessary and should be left as is, that it gives you the peace of mind, so be it.. its your view, and I respect it

For me, the stock bike did not give me any peace of mind. I had scuffles with the best authorized service center in my city. Vouched not to go back to them, but ended up in their garage for want of a better solution.

Saw the modifications available from Joel, heard a lot of reviews. None negative until recently. I had a Pulsar 220, Went in for the Big Bore 230, stage three headwork and the FFexhaust. have finished close to 3000 kms after the changes. Have tested the bike for top speed only ONCE. Fell in love with the smoothness offered by the setup and I am at calm ever since.

Most would say, you could have gone in for a new bike instead of spending on modifications. I would say its worth the spend considering that i have to spend double the money i would need to buy a bike that could offer me that calmness I require.

And since Harish has still not provided some hard facts, I would say all his allegations are baseless.

Signing off from this thread after adding in my views. Have fun.

Pls go through it completely, we're discussing on how to get the performance modification done in a right way. We're not for or against anyone.

You'd a bike from one of THE BEST customer care manufacturer in this country. One simple email to Rajiv/Rahul Bajaj was more than sufficient to terrorize your local ASC.

So what went wrong now? Pls do not hesitate to share.

Well I could be wrong, I've checked the top speed of my Rx & CBR several several times & ridden with T.W.O for hours (read it hours) together, that's what is reliability. That should not be lost with perf mod + the output of Dyno.

Respect your view as well, but for most people it wasn't the case.

Fine; take the CBR 250R goodies thread, all that is required is an output from Dyno chart between a stock CBR 250R & modded CBR 250R with a reliable engine. Why that has not been done yet? Has it been done on any R15 or your P220?

General Statement??? Well, One does not need to look at the slip angle curves of a tyre to judge its grip... Those stock tyres are ridden at a pace beyond what anyone can manage at the track, full throttle at insane lean angles and what not... And come on, a couple of extra bhp because of mods doesnt make a bike like the R15 any less safer... Its not like its power curves are going overwhelm the tyres anywhere in the rev range because of the mods... Its very easy obvious if you ride it...

On retrospect I do see your point w.r.t the thread man... So ok... I am just OT...

• This thread doesn't say anything new w.r.t the desirablity of resorting to performance mods.
• The crediblity that comes out of narrating from personal experience is some-what eroded by canvassing for other tuner in the 2nd half of opening post.
• I didn't like Samarth's tone in this thread. I wouldn't have bothered earlier but after becoming a mod he should have shown more restraint, atleast while venting out his personal frustration.
• Congrats Joel on your marraige
• I think tuners need to come-up with install/how-to docs and have official partners for installations. Installation is a separate task in itself and calls for involvement of professionals.

Congratulations Joel !

I agree with having a detailed video or a pictorial guide to let the customers know how to install the kit / get it installed.

Official install partner would really be a boon.

Thanks !

Just because he happened to have a good experience with something he tried later at his own risk, doesn't mean his bad 'Joel'd R15' experience was a fraud.

Its just a product, some people have good experiences with them, some don't, there is nothing wrong in writing about your bad experiences. We go all gaga about Honda and their bulletproof engines, but for a fact, I spot at least 4 Hero Honda bikes every week on my daily commute (which is barely 2.5km / 3-4 minutes long) spewing white smoke from their exhausts.

As for him canvassing about his own products later in the post, I am glad we have some competition. Because with competition, the eventual winner is the customer.

This thread just brings to the forefront the untold side of performance mods. We should appreciate someone actually taking the time to write all of it down because most wouldn't because it would generally feel like rubbing salt into your own wounds. I am happy that his mods eventually worked out to his satisfaction. Though its upto the readers to read all reviews about all performance mods, positive or negative, with a pinch of salt.

Samarth might be a mod, but he is also a person with opinions. It is not compulsary for all the mods to be politically correct all the time. They are also allowed to express themselves like the rest of the members.

@Joel congrats on your wedding. But I guess you got all this bad press due to issues caused during installation. Time to work on this point too.