Bajaj Dominar 400 Ownership Experience Thread

[B7ACKTHORN]

Hi!

Need some advice and help. Have been having a weird problem in my 2017 Dominar. The coolant goes from Max to Min in about 2-3 months. The service centre guys in Kirti Nagar, Delhi changed the seal in October and told me that it was good to go but when it happened again they told me they need to open up the engine and clean the engine entirely as the coolant is leaking into the engine. I understand that they may need to do it if the coolant is mixing with the engine oil as that can be fatal for the engine but I still don't get as to how that is going to solve the problem of the coolant leakage. Also, a 3 year old bike needs to get its engine opened? Isn't that sad? Should I report this to Bajaj directly?

Thanks.

The mechanic is right, there are two ways coolant seeps into these engines, one by a faulty pump rotor seals and the other one is through internal gasket failure inside engine, both are high probable causes. It "can" solve your issue, as the engine needs to be stripped open to bare bones, reseal the crankcase with new sealant and this has solved the issue in some of the KTM engines too which had this "magic disappear" syndrome. I'd suggest you mail/call Bajaj and keep them apprised regarding your last to current interval on replacing the pump seals and the status quo. Chances are high, you will have to shell out from your pocket. I'd strongly recommend you to undergo this engine surgery so you save yourself bigger expenditure in the future.

Good luck!

Keep your observations posted.

Cheers!
VJ

[kiran2508]

Hi!

Need some advice and help. Have been having a weird problem in my 2017 Dominar. The coolant goes from Max to Min in about 2-3 months. The service centre guys in Kirti Nagar, Delhi changed the seal in October and told me that it was good to go but when it happened again they told me they need to open up the engine and clean the engine entirely as the coolant is leaking into the engine. I understand that they may need to do it if the coolant is mixing with the engine oil as that can be fatal for the engine but I still don't get as to how that is going to solve the problem of the coolant leakage. Also, a 3 year old bike needs to get its engine opened? Isn't that sad? Should I report this to Bajaj directly?

Thanks.

It's not about 3 years old bike, but how many kilometers bike has covered and how it was ridden for those miles!! Some rubber coolant hoses have shelf life of only 3 years and manual says to replace them every 30K kms or 3 years whichever is early.

Max to Min drop of coolant over a period of 2-3 months is pretty normal in Bajaj/KTM bikes, the reservoir level for Max to Min is only 200ml, the radiator holds the remaining 800ml. Leak occurs due to various reasons, cracked old coolant hoses, worn out sealant near hoses end point, evaporation.

Service center might be lying when they say coolant is mixing, Do you white smoke? green color engine oil or bubbles in engine oil inspection window? any loss in power or hiccups? any leaks near head are or valve cover area?
If there are no symptoms like this, then there is no mixing pretty much.

Bajaj itself mention in their owner manual to get a half engine head job like valve cover removed and tappet checked for every 15K kms and for every 30K kms to replace all coolant/radiator hoses, timing chain, head gasket, water pump seals. So opening engine doesn't mean it's a fatal thing, even for periodic maintenance opening up engine is necessary.

You can verify things to done for 3years/30K kms in D400 manual attached.
https://www.bajajauto.com/pdf/Owner'...ar-400BSVI.pdf

[Vishal Wagh]

[QUOTE=leedonotrix;n2229334]Hi!

Hey leedonotrix, kiran2508, @B7ACKTTHORN

It can be happen due to evaporation (based on coolant to water mix ratio and quality of coolant) as no white smoke complaint nor any excess oil level complaints you have mentioned. If bike still has not given to workshop, just check oil level and if you have no idea how much it was at the time of oil change service, drain the oil in the workshop and check quality. You will get enough idea to make a difference between oil and coolant mixed oil. Based upon observation making a final decision makes sense.
Also there is sp. Tool called Coolant leak tester available which in which if pressure drop is significant that means coolant is leaking somewhere.

[leedonotrix]

It's not about 3 years old bike, but how many kilometers bike has covered and how it was ridden for those miles!! Some rubber coolant hoses have shelf life of only 3 years and manual says to replace them every 30K kms or 3 years whichever is early.

Max to Min drop of coolant over a period of 2-3 months is pretty normal in Bajaj/KTM bikes, the reservoir level for Max to Min is only 200ml, the radiator holds the remaining 800ml. Leak occurs due to various reasons, cracked old coolant hoses, worn out sealant near hoses end point, evaporation.

Service center might be lying when they say coolant is mixing, Do you white smoke? green color engine oil or bubbles in engine oil inspection window? any loss in power or hiccups? any leaks near head are or valve cover area?
If there are no symptoms like this, then there is no mixing pretty much.

Bajaj itself mention in their owner manual to get a half engine head job like valve cover removed and tappet checked for every 15K kms and for every 30K kms to replace all coolant/radiator hoses, timing chain, head gasket, water pump seals. So opening engine doesn't mean it's a fatal thing, even for periodic maintenance opening up engine is necessary.

You can verify things to done for 3years/30K kms in D400 manual attached.
https://www.bajajauto.com/pdf/Owner'...ar-400BSVI.pdf

The bike's been ridden for about 21k kms. Usual commute and occasional short trips outside the city. No white smoke, no hiccups, no leaks and no bubbles. That's why I was wondering what's really happening. The guys at the service centre told me that one coolant top up is good for about 5000 kms or 6-8 months and what's happening with my bike is not normal. If everyone here agrees then I think I should just get it done and over with and go with what they are suggesting. They quoted an amount of approximately 7k and a week's time to fix this. I'll also consider keeping Bajaj in the loop. Thanks a lot!

[leedonotrix]

The mechanic is right, there are two ways coolant seeps into these engines, one by a faulty pump rotor seals and the other one is through internal gasket failure inside engine, both are high probable causes. It "can" solve your issue, as the engine needs to be stripped open to bare bones, reseal the crankcase with new sealant and this has solved the issue in some of the KTM engines too which had this "magic disappear" syndrome. I'd suggest you mail/call Bajaj and keep them apprised regarding your last to current interval on replacing the pump seals and the status quo. Chances are high, you will have to shell out from your pocket. I'd strongly recommend you to undergo this engine surgery so you save yourself bigger expenditure in the future.

Good luck!

Keep your observations posted.

Cheers!
VJ

Thanks a lot for the information. Really helps when I can cross check these things with a community like this. I'll go ahead with it then and keep Bajaj in the loop as you suggested. Thank you again!

[leedonotrix]

[QUOTE=Vishal Wagh;n2229365]

Hi!

Hey leedonotrix, kiran2508, @B7ACKTTHORN

It can be happen due to evaporation (based on coolant to water mix ratio and quality of coolant) as no white smoke complaint nor any excess oil level complaints you have mentioned. If bike still has not given to workshop, just check oil level and if you have no idea how much it was at the time of oil change service, drain the oil in the workshop and check quality. You will get enough idea to make a difference between oil and coolant mixed oil. Based upon observation making a final decision makes sense.
Also there is sp. Tool called Coolant leak tester available which in which if pressure drop is significant that means coolant is leaking somewhere.

What if it's because of evaporation? What's the solution? Should I try some other aftermarket coolant?

[s1d]

It's not about 3 years old bike, but how many kilometers bike has covered and how it was ridden for those miles!! Some rubber coolant hoses have shelf life of only 3 years and manual says to replace them every 30K kms or 3 years whichever is early.

Max to Min drop of coolant over a period of 2-3 months is pretty normal in Bajaj/KTM bikes, the reservoir level for Max to Min is only 200ml, the radiator holds the remaining 800ml. Leak occurs due to various reasons, cracked old coolant hoses, worn out sealant near hoses end point, evaporation.

Service center might be lying when they say coolant is mixing, Do you white smoke? green color engine oil or bubbles in engine oil inspection window? any loss in power or hiccups? any leaks near head are or valve cover area?
If there are no symptoms like this, then there is no mixing pretty much.

Bajaj itself mention in their owner manual to get a half engine head job like valve cover removed and tappet checked for every 15K kms and for every 30K kms to replace all coolant/radiator hoses, timing chain, head gasket, water pump seals. So opening engine doesn't mean it's a fatal thing, even for periodic maintenance opening up engine is necessary.

You can verify things to done for 3years/30K kms in D400 manual attached.
https://www.bajajauto.com/pdf/Owner'...ar-400BSVI.pdf

coolant drop over 2-3 months regularly is NOT normal. unless there is an external or internal leak the coolant level should more or less remain constant (maybe some evaporation loss if its parked under the scorching sun for long periods of time).. otherwise the coolant loss isn't more than 150ml a yr under normal use.

also sometimes the coolant isn't filled up properly, especially the initial refill or a refill when you drain and refill. usually you would require a top up after a couple of days because the coolant is sucked in to the coolant jacket of the engine and this results in a 'drop'.. after topping it off, it should more or less remain constant. the way the coolant system basically works is that when it gets hot enough the thermostat opens n coolant is sucked in from the expansion tank and circulated back in to it (so you might notice it fluctuate between min-max depending on when (hot vs cold engine) you look at the tank.

leedonotrix have you drained the engine oil and checked ? if not please drain the engine oil and coolant separately and check if you see and signs of mixing (oil would appear greyish if coolant was mixing with it.. same for the drained coolant)
another cause of coolant 'disappearing' could be a head gasket failure, that is resulting in minute amounts of the coolant being vaporized in the combustion chamber and this minute amount is probably not resulting in any visible smoke.
also make sure the thermostat is in good working order.
unlikely the crank case needs to be stripped open.. maybe just new seal kit once again along with a head gasket replacement and a new thermostat if required, and maybe the coolant hoses with new clamps to rule out leaks/evaporation.

[s1d]

[QUOTE=leedonotrix;n2229386]

What if it's because of evaporation? What's the solution? Should I try some other aftermarket coolant?

you can try motul motocool expert, can buy it on amazon.. been running for 4yrs on my duke with no issues. obviously it cant 'fix' a leak but otherwise is a good coolant that you can use. I hardly see any coolant consumption.. mine is mostly parked in a covered parking. make sure you drain the existing coolant, run some distilled water thru the radiator and drain it and fill with motul motocool expert. like i said after first couple of days you will most likely notice a drop, a top up should be all you need.. you could also add a bit of water if you r out of coolant (motocool comes in a 1 liter can)..100ml water to top up a liter of coolant will do no harm.

[B7ACKTHORN]

Thanks a lot for the information. Really helps when I can cross check these things with a community like this. I'll go ahead with it then and keep Bajaj in the loop as you suggested. Thank you again!

Yes, to the point about evaporation. Though the possibility of vaporizing is very much there. The point one needs to keep in mind is, with a sealed container, vapor will condense back to liquid. For example, this is what the radiator actually does. Doesn't it turn water vapor from the engine to liquid during the cooling process Don't worry about evaporation, unless a pressurized unit has a leak, the vapor is going nowhere, it eventually condenses back to liquid. And even in case one goes full Dakar, coolant loss due to vaporization is extremely minimal and wouldn't be noticeable in the expansion tank.

I would recommend you to use a good premixed coolant. The point is pretty much clear, 200 ML to 300 ML loss of coolant every week to a month is a red flag and must be checked, and not coolant or water evaporation. It starts off as minimal loss and eventually starts rapidly losing in the engine leading to engine seizure.

Get it thoroughly diagnosed.

Cheers!
VJ

[Vishal Wagh]

Yes, to the point about evaporation. Though the possibility of vaporizing is very much there. The point one needs to keep in mind is, with a sealed container, vapor will condense back to liquid. For example, this is what the radiator actually does. Doesn't it turn water vapor from the engine to liquid during the cooling process Don't worry about evaporation, unless a pressurized unit has a leak, the vapor is going nowhere, it eventually condenses back to liquid. And even in case one goes full Dakar, coolant loss due to vaporization is extremely minimal and wouldn't be noticeable in the expansion tank.

I would recommend you to use a good premixed coolant. The point is pretty much clear, 200 ML to 300 ML loss of coolant every week to a month is a red flag and must be checked, and not coolant or water evaporation. It starts off as minimal loss and eventually starts rapidly losing in the engine leading to engine seizure.

Get it thoroughly diagnosed.

Cheers!
VJ

I have added evaporation point is because as many of us has seen in old movies in that Jeep guys where adding water. The reason behind that is because water where start to boil at 100℃, there is no way to stop vapour from escaping. Now we add antifreeze called as coolant when mixed with water. Which helps to max. boiling temp. Which not only hepls to max cooling but also reduces rate of evaporation considerably. That's why we don't carry water Jerry can nowadays. If mix proportion is not 50/50 (pretty much accuracy is needed here. those who performed chemistry practical understand) rate of evaporation will differ.
Now imagine riding in stop/go traffic where bikes heat a lot, how much evaporation term is considerable.

Just three point need to be remembered while dealing with coolant level low problems
1. External leak
Can be seen visually or sometimes need to be coolant leak tester to find out minute leak
2. Internal leak
a. In majority of cases coolant and oil mix. Need to check oil contamination
b. Head Gasket leak. Coolant burns inside cylinder. Sometimes white smoke can be seen sometimes not.
3. Evaporation

This will help to understand better and give enough idea about coolant.

Cheers!

[leedonotrix]

Hello everyone!

So, I wrote an email to Bajaj and I got a call from the service centre the very next day. They asked me to come and said they'd check the engine oil to diagnose if the coolant is mixing. They did that and coolant was mixing with the oil after all. They have asked at least 10-14 days to fix it. They'll open up the engine. Hope that solves the problem.

Thanks to all of you!

Cheers!

[s1d]

Hello everyone!

So, I wrote an email to Bajaj and I got a call from the service centre the very next day. They asked me to come and said they'd check the engine oil to diagnose if the coolant is mixing. They did that and coolant was mixing with the oil after all. They have asked at least 10-14 days to fix it. They'll open up the engine. Hope that solves the problem.

Thanks to all of you!

Cheers!

great.. just as i suspected, probably the water pump seal wasn't installed properly or it simply gave up again. let them fix it and test it.
are you being charged for this repair or is it under warranty ? these svc guys are known to rip customers off, charging you for work never done. always a pain to leave the vehicle unattended at these svc's. do keep us posted on what happens. thanks!

[B7ACKTHORN]

Hello everyone!

So, I wrote an email to Bajaj and I got a call from the service centre the very next day. They asked me to come and said they'd check the engine oil to diagnose if the coolant is mixing. They did that and coolant was mixing with the oil after all. They have asked at least 10-14 days to fix it. They'll open up the engine. Hope that solves the problem.

Thanks to all of you!

Cheers!

Glad to know Bajaj did escalate this in a swift manner and as I've mentioned earlier, don't take chances with coolant loss. Make sure, you get the time to physically be present in the showroom during assembly, it does help to keep a good rapport with the service manager and if possible the mechanic who does the job. Replace your engine coolant with a premixed one, and try to avoid the green one. I'd recommend you to use Yamaha Coolant or Honda Coolant or Motul Premixed ones.

Good luck. Keep us updated.

Cheers!
VJ

[kiran2508]

great.. just as i suspected, probably the water pump seal wasn't installed properly or it simply gave up again. let them fix it and test it.

The bike is 3 years with 21K kms, if seal wasn't installed properly, it'd have failed immediately.

Seals are consumable component, it wears out eventually based on weather, riding style and maintenance. This is just a periodic wear just like fork seals. It can happen as soon as 15K kms and some can last as long as 50K kms.

There are two seals, one from the inside oil side, another outside on the coolant side. Installing the oil side is always tricky and mechanic needs to be skilled and have a special tool. Even a slight miss and he can damage the brand new seal while installing the oil side seals.

Also sleas are directional, the direction of the lip of the seal is important, if its installed reverse way with lip facing inside, again it'll start leaking.

[s1d]

The bike is 3 years with 21K kms, if seal wasn't installed properly, it'd have failed immediately.

Seals are consumable component, it wears out eventually based on weather, riding style and maintenance. This is just a periodic wear just like fork seals. It can happen as soon as 15K kms and some can last as long as 50K kms.

There are two seals, one from the inside oil side, another outside on the coolant side. Installing the oil side is always tricky and mechanic needs to be skilled and have a special tool. Even a slight miss and he can damage the brand new seal while installing the oil side seals.

Also sleas are directional, the direction of the lip of the seal is important, if its installed reverse way with lip facing inside, again it'll start leaking.

mine is a duke, 6yrs 41k km, seal has never failed, have a friends 390 that's clocked similar mileage without seal replacement (both of us had switched to the motul motocool expert coolant in the second yr, not sure if that is 'saving' the seal.. we r on the second dose of the motocool.. first 2 yrs the stock coolant whatever it was.. the next 3yrs motocool and past yr or so again drained and refilled motul motocool expert). i keep the water-pump seal kit under the seat as a spare lol.
seal can fail anytime, doesn't have to be immediate.. in his case it probably did fail within a few days of installing a new seal.. like you said it was either not installed properly or just plain bad luck of it failing again. a lot of these svc mechanics are just novices with no proper training and could end up screwing up such jobs like seal replacements be it fork oil seals/water pump seals due to carelessness. the past couple of yrs some of the services/repairs i've been diy with the help of my local mechanic(who usually does only activas), its been a learning experience for both of us! just getting the parts from the svc has been a pain!
we really can't do an autopsy without taking a look at the vehicle/part.. we are just limited to verbal advice, we can ask him to strip the entire engine and rebuild, but practically it might not work out for the chap
lets hope the svc addresses it properly this time.