Re: KTM 200 Duke

Here you go:
1. Spare parts, well most service centers completely refuse to sell spare parts, I know this about maruti and VW as I have personally experienced this when I needed parts.
2. Has any one else had a bad experience with khivraj in B'lore? This is important because I'm buying my duke 200 this week and need to be absolutely sure of good service for my bike.
3. Brown=rust, please check for rust in the radiator like adviced here

-Amar

Re: KTM 200 Duke

2. About their service this is not the only case with me, last time I gave the bike for service there with small oil leak, they replaced the gasket, but the leak actually increased after their "fix"(I have photos for this, posted a few pages back), they scratched the tank and broke the left handle grip once and billed me for the grip without even telling me. They handle the bikes very irresponsibly, my friends NS200 also got scratched pretty bad when they were servicing it.

3. I flushed with water a couple of times and then with distilled water, the water came out clean, hoping that the coolant stays OK this time.

Edit: many other people have had good experience there. If you are a people person, you can talk to the service manager and staff and hang around the bike when it is getting serviced and get everything done properly. My people skills suck.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

I completely agree with what you say. BUT, I have been using this app on quite a few android phones of mine and have found most of my runs showing times near about manufacturer claims. That is why I trust it. I would LOVE to find someone with a V Box or something like that. If you know someone that would be great.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

He is running Kiirus ECU + a custom made FFE. The FFE itself is lot potent. When I rode his bike, I could feel surge in power. Abhay, Shivang [MENTION=29396]shiv[/MENTION]18 has a data logger, lets see if he can lend us his equipment for the run.

Even if the result is 2 secs more than what you have recorded, it is still very good. Thats Ninja 250 figures. And if it is accurate thats D390 territory.

Got to tune RD properly as speed limiter seems to have been removed.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Hi Everybody,
This is a question to bangalore folks, about service. How does everybody else rate khivraj service ? Or is the gent in the thread above the only one who is being treated badly?

I'd really appreciate your inputs, as my vehicles are usually serviced with much loving and care (and the process is keenly watched by me towering over the service attendants)

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Dude,
The treatment differs from people to people an time to time. I am regular to the Khivraj svc center. Let me explain you to get your bike treated well.
Take your bike early and tell them what you want and how to be treated with your bike. You should supervise your bike from the very first moment. Even while washing your bike, you can ask them to remove the belly pan and the Sprocket cover to get it cleaned completely and you can tell them to flush air from the rear side of the radiator once the cleaning is done. If you are not gonna open your mouth, nothing will be done. You are paying money dude, you should have enough courage to ask them, it's your right. Even after billing, you can ask them on what basis they have quoted the bill and you can even ask them to show the price list for servicing, what they have.
Stay close to the guy who is working on your bike and ask queries if you have any. No need of sitting quite and far away from your bike, as this happened with me at Mekhri circle svc center.
Before going prepare an examine sheet to get the job done.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Very true.
You even have to tell them not to lube the chain from the outside so it won't spill all the excess lube all over the bike.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Hey guys!

I've been missing out on lot of interesting conversation lately. Sorry about that, I had some urgent deadlines with my work. I think I haven't ridden my bike more than 20-30 km in last couple of weeks...
And I STILL haven't done any of my promised top speed runs, but as things stand, I will most likely do it tomorrow.
I also downloaded few Android apps for my phone for 0-100 kmh runs. BTW @abhayshanu, some apps can be more accurate than others, but the most important thing is to have a very good GPS lock (at least 10 or more satellites) and to have an app that has a mode to refresh the GPS status at a higher frequency than normal for more accurate position because we're moving at high speeds. And it's much better to do the tests on a clear sky day than on cloudy days. Of course, it depends on the quality of GPS in a specific phone.
The app I downloaded is called Android-Speedometer (https://play.google.com/store/apps/d....android.tacho). It has good reviews and looks good with many options (faster GPS polling, 0-xxx kmh runs, 0-xxx m runs), but I haven't tried it yet. I'm interested in 0-100 kmh and 0-402m (quarter mile) runs.


@chinmayakar - I saw your short review of the tests and how you, at the end, realized that Kiirus ECU is even slower than a stock. Are you sure about it? I'm asking especially because at the beginning you had a positive experience with it.
I'm not an expert, but I know that sometimes ECUs can generate some errors and can be filled up, and perform worse than they should. This can happen on any ECU for any bike. If you think your Kiirus ECU performs worse than stock then how about taking it to SC and check if it has some errors, and let them clear it if there are.
But, something is definitely wrong there if you feel Kiirus ECU not offering stronger power, especially in lows and mids...

My experience with my Kiirus ECU hasn't changed at all since I got it. I just had a few short accelerations to check if the performance has somehow reduced over time, but it feels the same as it felt the first time I got the ECU (as posted here). The bike pulls stronger than stock in lows and mids, and it's not only the initial pull - after the initial pull it keeps pulling stronger than the stock. The stock ECU has noticeable jump in power only after 7k rpm, but Kiirus (at least in my bike) pulls stronger in lows and mids. So the power curve is actually more balanced - the pull beyond 7k rpm doesn't feel that much stronger any more.
I'm yet to do a comprehensive top speed tests, but it appears to me that Kiirus ECU map doesn't have more power than stock at top end. However, it has a big advantage of rev limiter set at 11,700 rpm compared to stock ECU at 10,000 rpm (in 5th and 6th gears), so it can pull longer in peak power, which would give it a considerable advantage over the stock ECU.
Not to mention the incredible smoothness of Kiirus, which is not really useful for acceleration or top speed, but is very, very useful in traffic or when riding slow.


What I would like to hear from @abhayshanu is to compare the performance of his stock ECU with FFE and Kiirus ECU with FFE??
That would be very interesting.

And of course, some more details about that FFE exhaust!! How much is an estimated cost? Is that an underbelly exhaust as well?? If it is then I'd be very interested! I like to keep the mass as centralized as possible, something I like about the Duke very much. A pipe takes away the weight from below the center and puts it higher up and on a side.

@Chethan Shivakumar - I tried to take out that small speed limiter blue-white wire out of the socket, but it's a nightmare. No problems in removing a socket out, after few tries it's an easy job, just couple of seconds. But to remove individual wires is really, really difficult. I haven't managed to do it, and instead only ended up with my blinkers not working any more. It's just some loose contact somewhere, which I'll fix, but it's a hassle nevertheless.
I'm tempted to just cut the blue-white wire. What did you say was the negative effect of it? That the mileage calculation doesn't work any more? Is that all?
What about the second blue-white wire, would it be better to remove it as well, and leave only the wires for headlight and blinkers?

Congratulations for the RD ECU piggyback! It's great you're doing a lot of tests and making a perfect map!
I visited RD last Dec when they were supposed to launch their piggyback (I was waiting for it for months), but their map still wasn't ready. Additionally, their map was based on the old KTM ECU map, which worked badly with my new KTM ECU map (this probably explains the varying experiences with RD with different Dukes). And their map was only boosting the top end.
So I had a talk with them, Duke is not a race bike that needs only a strong top end, but a street bike where we need mostly strong lows and mids. The stock top end is strong anyway. So we started to create a map together there and then, all in one afternoon. I ended up doing some 5 test runs with experimental maps, and came to a map which had much stronger mids with very good top end up to 12,800 rpm. At the end it was an OK map, but the lows were still low. I asked the RD guy to try to increase the lows as much as possible, but then the revs got jerky with lows only slightly stronger.
The RD guy said it was difficult/impossible to boost the lows any more because the piggyback ECU gets the signal from the stock ECU, which gives lower power signals in bottom end. The way the piggyback ECU works is it only modifies the signals it gets from the main ECU. So, the ECU is like a prism that comes before the piggyback ECU unit. If the power signal that ECU gives is too low then the piggyback ECU can't boost the signal too much.
What piggyback ECU unit is doing is basically modifying the ECU power curve. You can't create a whole new power delivery curve as you can do in a stand alone ECU, but it only modify the power curve of the main ECU.
That's why the same piggyback map won't work the same with different ECU maps. (BTW, I'd be REALLY curious to check the Kiirus ECU with RD piggyback attached and an appropriate RD map, that would have much stronger lows and mids!)

That's one thing that made me reconsider my decision (I was going to go for an RD over the Kiirus initially) - ECU on its own can be mapped to have a perfect map, whatever you wish. A piggyback has to modify the existing main ECU map (and if it's a stock KTM ECU map then it has low power in bottom end, so it can't increase it much).
RD guys, while being a really nice guys, seemed more interested in cars than bikes, and preferred to only sell their piggyback ECU without really developing any maps for it. The piggyback ECU is a great device with total of 4 maps and possibility to shift between them easily according to a need, but without a proper map it's useless.
And I wasn't really willing to hook the piggyback to a computer and start developing maps myself...
But Chethan, you're doing a great service to all potential RD buyers by developing a perfect map for RD piggyback unit!!! IF you're willing to share your map(s)...

I will go to Bangalore and Goa in November. Chethan, if you're OK we could meet up then and test our bikes then. And even test the combination of Kiirus ECU together with RD piggyback...

Chethan, some time ago you said you preferred the 40T sprocket over 42T or 43T. Right now, you seem to be in favour of 42T.
Can you please explain why?
I should go to Pondy in next several days or beginning of next week, and I was thinking of changing the sprocket to either 40T or 42T.
I have tried only 43T, but it's easy to notice that 43T is too short, especially for my Kiirus ECU. I'm pretty sure the acceleration is slower with 43T than with 42T. It's becoming little irritating to see the revs go up very fast, but not the speed. But not really sure if the acceleration would be faster with 40T over 42T... On stock Duke 42T would most probably have faster acceleration. But not sure about 40T vs 42T on Kiirus/RD or FFE Duke.
That's why I'm still thinking whether to put the 40T. If not then for sure I'll go for 42T. 41T would probably be the best, but not sure it's available...


I'll post the already posted video of a Duke from Malaysia going 168 kmh. It's a pretty good and crazy high speed run. You can see that it actually hits the rev limiter few times at 168 kmh.
The guy who posted the video in YT comments says the Duke has 38T sprocket, airbox is probably open, and has a modified ECU (although the rev limiter kicks in at 168 kmh at some 10,500 rpm, same as old stock ECU map). From few other videos I saw that this bike has a custom exhaust as well. So, it's probably a combination of a tall sprocket, exhaust and custom air filter.

All that info makes me want to go for a taller sprocket, but just increasing the power even more. @abhayshanu, how's that FFE going?? And how do you find Kiirus ECU compared to the stock ECU?


ktm duke 200 top speed malaysia - YouTube

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Dude, By looking at this, I can tell only 2 things. Either he used Small Sprocket or changed the front wheel rim to 15".
But, WTF! :O 167kmph is too too much.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Thanks guys, getting my bike really soon now. Can't sleep.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Take it to Auto Service, Banashankari if you can. They are authorized service center (mentioned in the manual) and have been superb in my 4 services till date. The head service manager is very knowledgeable as well.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Had a small accident within two months from the first one. Somehow the rear tire slipped pretty bad on an unused railway track and I fell. The handling seems off now because the handlebar is bent. So my question is- can I get 390's handlebar fitted on my 200? The bar end sliders of the 390 would then fit too and protect the levers and the grips too in future.

Sent from my GT-S7562 using xBhp Connect mobile app

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Let me answer your questions.
1 - The app, I have tried MANY and Car Performance is by far the best. I have used the one you posted and that one is ok. Car Performance give ALOT more parameters.
2 - I have tried timings on a SGS3, Xperia S, Xperia Z and a LG GPro and all give out similar times. Will attach another one here with the Z. Always the accuracy is set to high and on this particular run the Lag was set to neutral, rather than positive, which is what is recommended.


3 - Chinmay has forgotten his remap. I have ridden and ripped the stock, FFE and Remaped bikes to their limit.
A - Stock :- Good mid range and dropping top end.
B - FFE :- Amazing mid range and much better top end. Bike revs more freely.
C - Remap :- Better mid than stock and MUCH more top end. Bike has a more linear power so it feels it has lesser power in the mid range.
4 - With the FFE the bike FELT much more free. I didn't think it has more power. With our tests we came to know it has more power than stock in mid and top, but not as much as the remap. When we tested, 0-anything I was the fastest. 40-top speed in 5th, I again was faster. BUT, when it came do downright 6k+ revs, the remap was much ahead than even me. Chinmay has forgotten but, in a drag wih stock. He could sit upright and still win by a noticeable lead.
5 - Now I am using the FFE + Remap combo and it is PERFECT, for me atleast. The amazing low and mid of the stock is amplified and I get a much needed pure top end power.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

OK, this makes sense...
I remember that after getting the Kiirus I noticed that the bike felt as if it needed some more "breath". As if more power was available but it became more clear that it could get even better. Either needed more air or a free flowing exhaust, or both.
Have you tried to open the air box and test the performance that way?

BTW, that image is too small, but I can see the results more or less. Still, 5.5 sec for 0-100 kmh sounds way too fast, that's exactly a D390 result. Ninja 250 does 7.5 sec. The easiest way to test it is to have a 0-100 kmh drag with a D390! Or, as @chinmayakar suggested, try to check with @shv18 if he has a data logger to lend.

I just had few small speed runs on a small road and tried to measure the results with that app I posted but it didn't even automatically start. I tried another one, but it had mixed results, which is probably a GPS issue. I will try Car Performance (https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...erformancefree for the free one) tomorrow with better testing.
I haven't tried 0-100 kmh run in a long time, first time now with Kiirus ECU, so it's only now that I see how much faster the acceleration is with Kiirus compared to stock! Wow!
I would REALLY love to see the accurate 0-100 kmh results for 43T, 42T and 40T sprockets!

@Syed Zakir Ahamed - Hehe, the Duke in that video has 38T sprocket. No small wheels there...
168 kmh isn't such a big deal, especially if you know that the other bike in that video is Kawasaki Ninja Kips 150RR, a 30hp 150cc 2 stroke baby monster which does 210 kmh...

Re: KTM 200 Duke

I didn't forget about the remap. The remap is agreeably faster than the stock, however, it still bows down to FFE at the bottom end and mid range. In a drag with the FFE, no matter how well i shifted, he could always beat me and he was then able to carry the momentum at the top end.

To give you an idea how powerful it is, Me and Abhay swapped our bikes at Sion. The moment I started his bike, I could feel surge in power, and within minutes, I vanished from that scene and landed in Vashi (15Kms ). I don't remember when was the last time I was so fast.

Nilesh was accompanying me. He can shed more light on this.

Against the stock, Kiirus wins hands down. However, during that test, none of us felt it was substantially more powerful. It had better top end, however at bottom end and mid range, it was marginally better than the stock. We had couple of drags that day, and when ever I didn't time the shifts properly, Stock would take a lead, and only after some distance I could regain the lead due to better top end.

You can say I purposely mis-timed the shifts to see how long it takes to take the lead back. I had expected Kiirus to take very less time. Sorry to get my P230 into the picture, but, when I had souped up my P220, no matter how bad I dragged it could take the lead within very short distance. Just to give you an idea what I am trying to say.

My plan now is, RD + FFE, while Abhays bike is Kiirus+FFE.

So we got varied setup in the team, along with 2 stock Dukes, one from the first lot with 43 teeth and a new Duke with 42 teeth.

Also, I have moved up to 43 teeth sprocket from 42 teeth, and the acceleration is mad.

It is so mad, for the first time in 10 years my wife was afraid to sit pillion. She was like I dont want to sit behind any more. She was too scared by maniac acceleration.