Re: KTM 200 Duke

Yes, Duke runs a closed loop system.
From what I remember reading on the internet even the closed loop system can work only within a certain range, really don't know the technical part behind the operating/adjustment range.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Basically most of these bikes available out here including CBR250, CBR150, Ninja 250, Ninja 300 and of course the KTM 200 use what is know as a narrowband O2 sensor. Bikes equipped with such sensors are not truly closed loop systems. As the name suggest the narrowband sensor have a limited purpose. Their true job is to measure if the bike is working under a Air Fuel Ratio of 14.7:1 (also known as the ideal AFR) under idle, moderate acceleration and at static throttle positions for cruising at steady speeds and the system either makes rich or leans out the AFR as necessary. However, when you accelerate hard, the requirement for AFR changes, in such situations, the O2 sensor readings are ignored and the system becomes a open loop system.

Therefore, the true purpose of such closed loop systems is better emission control and fuel efficiency.

Re: KTM 200 Duke


Hi Abhimanyu!! Thank you for that piece of information. So does this mean remapped ECU wont have trouble with varying altitudes as Shiv mentioned? In the stock form, I did not notice any difference in performance with varying altitude.

I am sorry if I sound too naive.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

It actually depends on what the remapping entails. If they are going to complete wipe of stock map and overwrite with new values then maybe there will be some problems. If they are limiting to only changing certain parameters (such as removing rev limiter), but essentially leaving most of the map stock then I don't see any problems. Also depends on if they are asking you remove the O2 sensor and making it into a open loop system.

I mean I do not have any experience with a flashing of a ECU, so I really don't know what they are going to do in practice. For my Ninja 300, I have ordered a AreaP micro fuel controller, which will entail removing the O2 sensor and making the system open loop one.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Vroom, vroom!
Guys, just an initial update, I'm quite busy so I'll write more in evening.
I got the remap, 9k Rs, all easy. The most noticeable thing about the remap is (surprisingly) how smooth the bike has become! Wow. Those who like to ride more relaxed and in lower rpms should definitely go for it!

Another thing is of course the pickup - it's much stronger now. But one shouldn't expect to see Duke 300 instead of 200. It's something like Duke 230...

The rev limiter kicks in just before 12k rpm, something around 11,800 rpm. Happy!

The bike tops at 69 kmh in 2nd gear.
If you're doing 20 kmh in 2nd gear and whack open the throttle the bike will jump, noticeably more than before.
And even if you're doing 60 kmh in 2nd and open the throttle it'll jump equally.
The wide Duke grin has just become wider.
But the interesting thing is that the bike does all this in a much smoother way!

I'll be on a highway tomorrow afternoon, but the winds are strong, so I doubt I'll be able to check the top speed.
It's not about if the bike can pull it, but this is the only time when a very light weight isn't good. It's just too light for strong winds, anything over 130 kmh feels dangerous with strong but short blasts of wind coming sideways...

Dude, why don't you sell your FZ and buy a Duke? You can get almost a new Duke now for as low as 90k Rs! It's crazy! It's a fire sale now due to many D200 owners upgrading to D390...

I got a very precise and identical info about the top speed limit from both Kiirus and Motozone guys. It's a chip inside a speedo that needs to be rewired.
I asked the Kiirus mechanic last night, he was a KTM mechanic before so he knows about it, but Kiirus haven't yet fiddled with it, so they didn't want yo try anything.
Motozone guys have and they do it for 1k Rs.

Of course, when possible I'll check the top in 6th gear. But, even then, I think bikes from different lots have different speed limits.
We'll have more info soon when we all do the top speed tests.

That air pipe is some 35cm long! Way too long.
The stock filter is in the filter box which has that pipe attached.
Would BMC filter just replace the stock?
If that pipe stays then it's the pipe that's a bottle neck for more air, not so much the filter itself. So, I'll see what to do about it... Maybe I'll try taking a box and filter out just for a short test to see the difference.
Apparently the BMC filter should be much better than stock one.

There's one great thread with most amazing photos of a Duke in Ladakh last year.

The guy said no problem whatsoever with power even in highest passes. Just a small power loss...
So the ECU should work great, no matter what altitude.

I had Apache 160 FI before, and it was constantly going off at altitudes of 2000 m. It really sucked. At normal altitudes it was ok.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Thanks abhimanyu31, that's exactly what i was trying to say. If the stock ECU has not been completely wiped out then upto certain extent the bike's ECU should be able to handle the variations in temperature, barometric pressure etc. Now since, there are no details given from KIIRIUS except better performance over stock, i am not sure how much room does the new map gives your bike to keep the AFR stoichometric i.e. ideal chocolate brown tan on the spark plug with the variations in environment.

If you guys can contribute in clearing out these doubts when going for the long distance test run with the KIIRIUS remap, it would add something more to this discussion and at the same time we all can figure out the benefits and the possible drawbacks of remapping the stock ECU especially when taking touring/ long distance rides into consideration.

I am still not done with hot roding of my FZ. Once i get bored then i shall decide which upgrade will make a better sense. So far, based on all the discussions taking place here, i guess:

* A good condition KTM Duke 200 with lesser ODO readings 1 - 1.5 years: 90K
* Rear Sprocket mod 40T/ 39T: 300 bucks
* Proper preventive maintenance service & inspection (May include chain & sprocket replacement): 4 - 6 K
* Brand new set of tires (If required): 6-7K
* ECU Remap (if the results are positive from all our earlier testers) KIIRIUS/Motozone : 8K - 10K
* MRA Naked sports bike touring Windshield: 8K
* Renewal of Insurance (if required): 3k (i don't know what is the cost of the same for Duke)

So keeping all things into perspective, Grand Total: Rs. 1,24,300/- would be the cost of owning a fully loaded 2nd hand Duke ready for touring (Not including the name and registration transfer costs and other miscellaneous expenses). In Mumbai there are enough good Parsi men who spare no expense in keeping their rides in pristine condition than anything else (No pun intended!! ). Probably looking for a good deal from them would be a start.

Apache RTR FI system was crappy hence, you saw severe performance drop at higher altitudes. The same has not been the case with Yamaha R15s who went to Leh. But they were suffering from riding issues with the stock tires.

@Samschenker: Thanks mate for your inputs . While i was chatting with PSR Ji on the same, he quickly sent me a few links to confirm that Duke 200 has an O2 bung/Lambda Sensor:

1) Bosch O2 Lamba Sensor: KTM 200 Duke Motorcycle O2 Sensor - MAGNUM Bike BOSCH O2 Oxygen Sensor Universal Wiring
2) Dynojet PowerCommander set up for Duke 200: Dynojet Power Commander V suitable for a KTM 200 Duke (2012)

So for riders with no limits on budget may be going for a PowerCommander will yield better performance results?? I am not sure but just sharing the link : Welcome to Power Commander Motorcycle Fuel Injection Tuning Module

Hope i am able to add something productive on this thread.


Cheers,

Re: KTM 200 Duke

I know i am being a total noob and asking some real stupid questions but i have 1 more question. Based on ur rplys i have bought myself philips extreme vision lights of the same headlight specification of DUKE-H4 12V 60/55W,from the authorized philips dealer now the question is do i need to go in for a relay or anything like that or is it gonna be a direct fit?? plzz reply as i dont want my local mechanics to fool me!!!

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Forgive for barging into the theead..
If its the same specification as the stock bulb, then there isn't need of a relay..
a relay is used when we use higher current/power consumption devices..

Re: KTM 200 Duke


If the headlight specifications are same as stock then you don't need to do anything except unscrewing the old bulb and fitting the new one in place. All the best.

Cheers,

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Are the handle bar end sliders/weights available at Bajaj/KTM showrooms (at Indranagar, B'lore too)? Anyone's got 'em on the D200 here?
In one of the older posts, I read about one from Indimotard (750 bucks). How good are these?

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Just plug it & enjoy thats it.

Post your experience with philips on your D200 as my friend is also planning to upgrade his duke headlights.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

I am not sure but the ones on pulsar should be a direct fit on the duke 200.
I am saying this because on the 390 the bar ends look exactly like the ones on a pulsar 220. Even the handle bar grips are shared between the pulsar and duke platform.

Sent from my GT-I9100

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Thanks, mate. That's my impression as well; will check it out at the showroom.

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Hey Guys!! Planning to install BMC filter on Duke. ECU remap is holding well. Spoke to Abhishek this morning about riding on different terrains, altitudes, and his response was encouraging.

According to him there are couple of Duke owners in Bangalore with his remapped ECU and none of them reported any drop in performnace. Bangalore's climate does affect performance if the vehicle is not tuned properly.

Serge, were you in Bangalore to get the remapped ECU?

Anyways, anyone here with BMC filter? Any feedback?

Will update this thread after the weekend ride to Amby Valley. Abhishek says he used to ride to Amby Valley every weekend on remapped KTM and never faced any issues. Time to verify that. Serge, do you plan to go on a ride to hills nearby? Let us know your experience.

Also, I am glad to see people contribute, and this is one of the few ownership threads where I see people talking about Performance upgrades and other aspects of ownership instead of usual cries about some or other issues. Hope it stays like that..

Re: KTM 200 Duke

Hi Mate,

Do check with KIIRIUS if you need to tweak the map for the extra flow of air from the BMC upgrade as the remap was done based on the stock air filter i guess. Based on what i have learnt from CV carburettors, the effect of altitude sickness in bikes is not noticeable until you cross an elevation of 4000ft+. That being said if the remap is able to handle such altitudes then it is a good sign.


All the best with the tests...

Cheers,