Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Could anyone please help me on what might be the cause / solution for RBW throttle stopped working.

Yesterday when i was on my way to office, the throttle response stopped working all of a sudden and the bike didn't rev any further in middle of the road. It was idle at ~1.8RPM. Somehow managed to push it to office parking. Did some research on biking forums, google, owners manual and repair manuals but no luck. Did checked the fuses(yeah came to know RBW doesn't have any fuse only after referring the owner manual) and wires for any damage after office hours. All in good condition.

So today i towed it back to the SVC (20Kms from office) and gave it at the SVC. Guys from SVC told this is the first time they are encountering such an issue and they need to check by swapping the entire throttle sensor assembly and by getting guidance from their engineering team. As SVC doesn't have the throttle and switch assembly, they told it might take week time to get the part and do the trail and error method.

Not sure why this issue came suddenly. I use my RC390 for office commute and touring(solo). Have clocked 6K on the odo and bike is just 5 months old. Worried since what bad would happen during solo tours if something happens like this.

I also don't rip the bike much, very rarely crosses 7K rpm.

If any one has encountered the same issue or know how to resolve it please share as it will be very much helpful. Also please share what can be done for a temporary fix in RBW throttle MC during unexpected situations where there wont be a ASVC.

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

the first thing that the svc should have checked is to connect their diag tool and see if it throws up any error. did they do that ? if so,what was the error if any..?
apart from that just some visual inspection to see if some wire snapped/got chewed by a rat or some failed electronics (which i assume would throw an error code that the diag tool might pick up).
electronics.. sigh

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Hey Sid, Thanks for the reply. Nope they didn't do anything with the diag tool on the time when i was there at the svc, even i too missed to request them to do so. All the svc guys were just excited to see a throttle failure for the first time. All they did was start the engine and rev the throttle to see if it is working. Eventually it didn't and it wont. The only thought which came to them was to swap the assembly with a new one and check if its working, for which they needs the parts to be available.

Since they told the part will be available only by Monday, i told them i will take my bike back to home and come back when the part is available so that i will also be available at the time of inspection and know what might be the issue and solution. But they insisted and told to leave the bike in SVC, so that they will check whenever they get time and cannot wait for us.

I will check with them about the error code and issue tomorrow if possible.

Also i read in the Duke 390 thread that during RBW failure, the bike will go into limp mode/safe mode which will lock the RPM to a safe value (~3K/4K). But my bike was just at the idle RPM (~1.8/1.9) with which i was able to go only 14KMPH max in 1st/2nd Gear. How it will be helpful to cover longer distance if incase no one there for towing the bike. Now feeling bad about electronics in the bike.

I also have a older FZS in which i have did a DIY for throttle cable, accelerator cable, Fuel sensor, Chain sprocket and brake shoe replacement / regular services(all with the help from xbhp and youtube). Never took it to SVC/mechanic post service free services. Sorry to compare fz with the beast(RC390), but these are the two vehicles i have ridden and i like both of them to the fullest.

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

shit happens man.. irrespective of the machinery. electronics are a little more complex when it comes to doing a road side juggad to get going.

as for the limp mode, it depends on what went wrong.. some cases the bike might not even fire up.. limp mode is not going to be a solution for every failure, it aint some magic pill.

as for the svc troubleshooting the problem, unfortunately that's the state of affairs at most of the authorized service centers. no proper procedure to diagnose the root cause, simply focused on just replacing parts or shooting in the dark.. at least yours is under warranty, so it will be covered for free (don't be surprised if they charge you labor..which should be free).
if it aint your fault (or something like a rat chewing up some wire), then it will be covered under warranty.. but is more important i feel is identifying the actual cause of the problem rather than simply replacing entire assembly's (blame the consumers' low level of knowledge.. and these svc guys royally rip them off).

so go to the svc, ask them to connect the diag tool (the green bosch diag too, not the older grey bajaj unit) and check.. that's a good place to start. it could be as simple as a bad connection or damaged wiring (in which case warranty claim might be tricky).. so start with the diag tool and take it from there.

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience


Sensitive electronics! It's sad to see that your RBW system happen to give up prematurely which isn't acceptable by all means. The RBW is a pretty robust system and unless the handlebars are dropped dead weight to the ground, do they encounter such failures, but in the end Murpyh's Law comes into play, anything that can go wrong will go wrong. First off, we have a sensor near the throttle grip assembly, a premature death of this sensor can cut signals to the throttle body. Secondly, check the wiring themselves, sometimes, a pin or a connector can come loose and lead to such troubles.

Nonetheless, it's wise to push this failure under warranty by all means. Though this is a learning curve for the mechanics themselves, there's nothing much other than to replace the failed parts. Start off with the throttle grip sensor assy and then take it from there. Do keep your observations posted.

Cheers!
VJ

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Thanks for the valuable inputs Sid & VJ , Here is what happened. Yesterday i went early to the office and around 5.30PM i got a call from SVC to collect my bike saying the issue has been resolved. Since it was too late for me to reach SVC before 6PM, I told i will collect it today. Today morning i visited the SVC and requested them to clearly explain what might have caused the issue. They told it might be a faulty throttle sensor and because of that it might have failed no answer on what might have made it to become faulty. Their first attempt in swapping the sensor assembly had rectified the issue. They have changed the complete part where the Self start and Engine kill switch assembly along with throttle sensor will be there. I also asked did the issue had thrown any error code when connected with the diagnostic tool. They told only FI related issues will be recorded in the ECU and these wont be registered. I am not sure if i can believe what they said because i too don't have much knowledge about it and my little knowledge was all engine related issues will be recorded in the ECU and can be seen using diagnostic tool. Then i asked about the cost of the part which they replaced and they told it will be coming around 2K. When asked about what should be done if this occurs again, reply was a guarantee from the mechanic that it wont happen again and if i encounter any further issues at times when i cant reach the SVC he told to call on his mobile so that he will guide me on what needs to be done (Impressed by a polite answer at last ).

SVC didn't charge me for anything, all was claimed in the warranty. Since the showroom manager was a very nice person everything went smoothly.

Regarding physical damages to the sensor or wiring, I have not dropped the bike anywhere till now and never left it on any outside parking / rains. There was no damage to wiring by rat bite or anything all was in good condition. Not sure what triggered the sensor to failure.

Regarding limp mode is there any way that we can do reset of the errors / ignore the software based errors and start the engine and continue riding with it?. I have encountered "CAN EMS Failure" error for which i used to turn off the engine and turn on to ignore the error. Are there any software based error which can be ignored/reset'ted without using a diagnostic tool for a temporary fix. I believe this RBW failure is a sensor failure which doesn't relate to software errors. I am just curious if there is any way to ignore software errors during unavoidable conditions.

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

the part where they told you that only fi errors are registered on the diag tool is bullshit.
it captures a lot more data and error codes than just fi related, and sensor failure/abnormal readings will show up on the diag tool.

unfortunately you cannot reset the errors without the diag tool.. you can clear the errors using the diag tool (without fixing the issue), but it will pop up again after sometime. the correct way is to identify the root cause, fix it then reset the codes (called the dtc - diagnostic trouble codes) using the diag tool.

as for ignoring errors.. it depends on the error. like i said some might let you ignore (like say a high coolant temp, which you can wait a while till the temp drops and restart and ride) while others say like side stand down (due to a side stand sensor failure) will not let you even ride. some other issues with say like fi might put the bike in limp mode (again limp mode is not a magic pill for all issues)

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

As a matter of fact, not all electrical errors will be recorded in the ECU for faults. The primary sensors, are the lambda, the crank, and all the sensors in the throttle body, voltages and these the critical aspects are that the ECU records. The ECU won't record a failed indicator or a headlamp failure or a fuel gauge sensor as an error that's one. Secondly, any error can be viewed with the throttle wide open for five seconds with the ignition on (engine turned off) and once the throttle is left, the MIL will flash if there are any errors stored in the ECU, if not, then the bike is perfectly fine.

Your mechanic is partially right, if there is a fault code, this can be removed using the diag tool and it is all set. To see the errors code(s), switch on the ignition, WOT the throttle for exactly 5 seconds and leave the throttle back. If there are any fault codes registered in the ECU, the MIL will flash on your console. (This flashing will help determine what sort of a fault code that is) With this you can find out if you have any error registered in the ECU or not.

Cheers!
VJ

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

bro, i never said all errors.. only merely more than just fi related as [MENTION=94151]84L4[/MENTION] assumed.
it is better to fix the problem rather than just 'removing' the error using diag tool, because if the cause of error is not fixed but simply 'cleared' then it will reoccur.

am not sure if the procedure on the new 390 with its new style of can bus based electronics is the same as the old ones wrt checking the blink codes of the mil. i haven't tried it myself on a faulty vehicle so can't confirm.
btw the correct procedure at-least on the older dukes is to read the blink code: (the throttle needs to be open even before you turn on the ignition)
Hold the throttle open
Turn on the ignition (DO NOT START THE ENGINE)
Keep the throttle open for 5 seconds
Close the throttle
The blink code is displayed in the dashboard

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Using bike for more than 2 years but i was not aware that we can read these errors on speedometer console. [emoji20]

Thanks for info.

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

My wheels are squeaking while braking and also sometimes while reversing the bike. Odo is 9000kms. At first I thought it is a disc brake/brake pad issue, hence I thoroughly cleaned the pads and the rotor. Again the problem has resurfaced after 500 kms. Is it an issue with the wheel bearings?

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Use a sand paper to clean the disc, it's quite common thing, even it happened for me then it's faded after few kms however it's irritating though

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Squeals or squeaks are mostly caused when there brake dust accumulation inside the caliper housing and improper pad contact with the rotor. Remove the pads, clean them with compressed air, inspect the caliper pads and see for glazed wear or uneven wear. If you observe glazed wear replace the pads. Yes, glazing them a little with sandpaper does work, for some it works and for some it only returns to haunt them.

Cheers!
VJ

Re: KTM RC 390 Ownership Experience

Hatsumi Build Update:

The Powertronics Piggyback has been removed after we were unable to get any satisfactory performance put of it. I got the Ecu remapped by Celtic Tuning UK which by far is the most performance oriented map for the RC390.

The redline is at 14k Rpm with a little over 7.8bhp added in addition to the 3.2 bhp from the Arrow GP2 full system and the airbox upgrade.

The engine runs a lot richer in the higher RPMs. It pulls cleanly from 3k in any gear, no stuttering, no hopping. Launching the bike is a tad bit tricky and you will need to half clutch in the first gear to ease the power in and prevent a wheelie. Once you're off at full throttle, the controlled power wheelies will continue until you shift into 4th gear.

Attached a few videos of the Powertronics(RC Cup map) vs stock vs custom ECUhttp://cloud.tapatalk.com/s/5a8266b2...082511_141.mp4http://cloud.tapatalk.com/s/5a8266a2...211-WA0010.mp4

KTM RC and DUKE chain noise

Till today there is no solution for the noise of the chain which comes out from DUKE and RC , there is a knocking sound when the chain becomes loose . Even after tightening the chain , after riding 10-20kms Chain becomes loose and the knocking sound comes out .