Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Check if the balls are of same size.
If possible, try to get a packet of bearing balls made by SKF. TOP is also good and costs just Rs.36/-
If the race and cone are not damaged then they can be re-used. Greasing and replacing the balls is sufficient.

After re-assembling- Turn the steering head adjusting nut 1/8 of a turn after it seats completely such that the handle feels a little hard to turn. After re-installing everything back, find a speed breaker and go over it few times repeatedly (2-3 times) faster that what you would do normally.Then re-adjust it such that the handle is free to turn and does not exert much pressure on the bearings- Very important. This is to make sure the balls and race seat properly.

3 years means that its life is almost over and can leak anytime. I have had not so good experience with the seals leaking within few weeks after fork oil change.
Get OE oil seals(made by SFN), each costs Rs.80/-
Copper washer and top cap o-ring can be re-used.
Fill 160ml in each fork pipe.

I would prefer to use Castrol longlife premium over waxpol AP grease as castrol has EP additives. If you have waxpol wheel bearing grease then that is even better.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Yes I am planning to do that with micrometer screw gauge but - a) need to open up the bike before I can compare with the ones already in there b) old balls in the steering are likely to have worn a bit and give false readings for OE size .
What number of these balls should there be ?
Shopkeeper assures that they are common size between bajaj & other bikes of similar capacity . Have scoured market here but skf or hero-honda etc branded ones are not available without full set . Tomorrow shall look again in a nearby herohonda parts shop . But bajaj OE should not be worse than Hero's no ? ... if it fits that is
Mechanic insists no need to disturb the oil seal since there is absolutely no sign of any damage at all . And i don't want to travel all the way to bansal motors again now . Decisions decisions .

This waxpol grease is actually certified for bearings by NLGI as GC ( highest grade for bearing use ) . There is no other grease that I know in our market that is NLGI certified . Castrol , motul , gulf , servo etc may be better quality or not , but do not have the nlgi certification . Along with ELF lex3(also ap3 type) , I've used this one since more than 10years . I got this 500g tub recently as soon as the shop stocked it again .



More accurate (measuring cylinder) needed ? Mine is marked "approx vol" , was from a surgical instruments shop .

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Replacing oil seal is better as it is 3 years already. If you replace now you don't have to work on fork for next 3 years.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

^
I would have replaced the oil seals -
a) If it leaks then you will have to repeat the whole procedure again.
b)Mechanic needs to come to your place
c)If the leak goes unnoticed and gets contaminated then new oil needs to be changed.

If SKF fork oil seal is available at your neighborhood shop then you can use it too. Rs.35/- each. Not as good SFN but does the job, I have used it for more than two years in my passion.

My suggestion is to replace the oil seal and be tension free. Wait for sibun to replyor even better, make a short call.(I think he is free usually before 9:00Am and after 7:30pm-just a guess by looking at his posts )

If I remember correctly it was around 20~23. You need to put back the exact no of balls removed.

Your measuring jar should be pretty much accurate considering that you bought it from a surgical instrument shop. I have even used kitchen measuring jar in the past.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Ok , I stopped being lazy and got these ...



This was available too , genuine hero steering bearing balls , size 6mm , Nos 42 , part No - 9621106000S Price is ₹63.00 . So the hero service center did lie when they said only ball & racer sets are send by hero ! ( forgive for shaky iphone pic on a rainy day ) .



Took out the bajaj's steering balls and measured just now with micrometer . Average size is 4.76mm (diameter) , and total number of balls is 46 . So they'd be unusable on my Splendor+ . Nahi ?

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

@Pinakiji- I am extremely sorry that i replied so late. My Internet pack was over and the damn Internet at office was not working.

Ok for your queries then let me explain in point wise:-

1.For fork oil seal then let me tell you that if you are just draining the old oil and re-filling new oil by removing top cap then no need of even touching the oil seal. But if you are completely dismantling by removing fork pipe, piston and cleaning then it is mandatory to use new seals in forks. Once the pipe is removed then the oil seal is damaged. While fitting new oil seals then apply a thin layer of shock oil on the inside edges of seal so the pipe doesn't scratch the coating of oil seal. Use the old oil seal to punch the new oil seal into place. Also use kerosene to clean fork and never diesel.

2. For steering balls i would advice not to touch that if it is not giving problems, because once you open re-grease with new balls then racer will not last more than 5k. The reason behind this is that the balls are not only worn but also the racer is worn with balls and they have set into a pattern. If you set new balls they will accelerate the wear of racer. So my advice is to use new racer or not touch it if you are having no problems. And this is very important which i am saying now. Never i repeat never use OE racer set. Instead get SKF racer set. SKF has two models racer for our old model racer. One is plain as ours and another is the balls are fitted in racer as in new extreme and pro series. The difference is that pro and all new models use bigger racer which has cage but ours is small model racer and it doesn't have cage for racer balls. But SKF has come with a model that has cage. I am using it now and believe me handle is as free as on bearings. My extreme handle feels jam compared to it. I always fit the racer and forget about it and it also never require adjustment. Usually it last for 30k and i never used OE as once i used OE and it got bad after 15k. I use TOP which cost Rs.100 and lasted 25-30k but after SKF came with cage model for our bikes i am using it and now it is at 30k and still feels like new and has never required adjustment.

3.For same damping as new use 160 ml fork oil in each leg. Pump it properly before fitting top cap to flush out the air in shock.

4. And for you grease query then use Waxpol as it is far better than castrol. As you have mentioned it is only NLGI certified grease all others are ELGI certified. I have used it once but now not getting it. It will not get dry like cake and it is the best grease available in market.

And regarding that bajaj balls never use that as they are made by HCH which is a chinese company. Even the bearings are provided by HCH and are cheap bearings. I have personally checked these at my friends shop.


And finally if you have any urgent query then please free to call me. You can call me anytime be it midnight then also you can call me. I am always available for friends.


I have some updates of my joy which i will post in next post.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Been waiting for your attention for 2 days now . These parts have never been touched in my Splendor+ since it was bought in 1st July 2010 ( 16000+kms now ). So naturaly there has been gradual degradation in their operation -

a) fork is become a bit hard & late(slow) to compress .
b) steering handle is a bit stiff to turn and feels dry to turn like it has no lubrication left in it .
c) a single kat sound from steering when front brakes is applied suddenly .

Otherwise the fork is working kinda ok in small potholes too , no noise , no dive , no leaks etc . Steering is turning ok too , linear and silent without any dips or clicks while turning . Bike can run on like this for another 10k kms I think . Any other usual guy would have left it alone untill it broke but I don't like riding on like this . Moreover my best friend's wind-125 has damaged these same parts on his bike from long neglect . His steering head racer bearing's seat is gone , difficult weld & lathe work is needed on it now . Forks are fully damaged and clanking , has to be replaced now . I don't want the same things to happen to my bike . So I am trying to upkeep things on this bike before it breaks and seeks attention by itself .

My plan is -
a) Fully dismantle and clean and refill fork . Replace oil seals only .
b) Clean and regrease the steering head bearings without any parts change .

Steering head bearings to be replaced with skf caged bearing set after another 10k kms or so , I already know the problems with the currently sold OE racer set from my CBZ-x , otherwise I'd have agreed to the full set change like the service center was selling . I have seen that even the new HF-dawn has the bigger racer set too , no ?

Now my question to you is
a) is it ok to just drain and refill the fork from top cap ( considering the age and mileage of my bike ) ?
b) any such problems like you mention if I just clean and regrease the bearing ? ( keeping the same balls )

Bajaj's bearings may be chinese but quite a few platinas and discovers and pulsars I know are running 20k kms plus with it , nahi ? They are a smaller size bearing than splendor's but the cost difference is remarkable ( ₹15 vs ₹63 ) .
Another thing I found is that the part number for Splendor's steering head bearings is same as that for Honda CT70 , CT90 trail bike sold internationally . You can just google it to find this ( 9621106000 ) .

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

[MENTION=29030]Pinaki[/MENTION] ji
If you would have ran your for 1 year then i can say u can go for only oil refilling from top cap. But your bike had ran for 3 years without any oil change in between so i would not suggest you to just refill because to estimate oil-seal can be in its end of life, and can leak anytime without any warning. So then you will have to disassemble again everything to fix your problem.
So why to leave like this. Therefore, it is recommended to do complete overhaul i.e, complete disassemble cleaning and refiling to make it trouble free for the next 2~3 years. Also fork will work better than just refiling.

On just refilling we need 150ml of oil
On complete overhaul 160ml is required.

Regarding steering- you can re-grease without any parts change because i have done this in my bike once and its running better without any problem and i have ridden for 8k+ kms after re-greasing and still going good. Each side have 22 balls and there will be no large gap left after placing all balls. Your waxpol grease is best to go with!!

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Thanks paul , I am intending to do just as you say . Yamaha service used to regrease the steering fully once a year on my crux and rx as a routine matter . Never made such nakhda like Hero .
Each side has 21 number six balls (6mm) , the total in the OE part packet is given as 42 . Unit cost is printed ₹1.5 , total price is printed ₹63 . I did all this boring checkings at the authorised parts shop today only . Did you put 22 ?
Yes , i know this grease is quite good and doesn't dry up ... wasn't finding it at the shop for long time , now they got after all my pestering . If you check the certified products list of NLGI usa , it is perhaps the only Indian product in it .

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

I knew you were waiting and i have also seen the post but was un-able to reply. Usually 16000 km is not much as i have run my joy sometime 27k without changing shock oil and racer i touch only when gives problem almost after 30k.

1. I would encourage you to fully open the shock and clean it with kerosene, let it dry and wipe it thoroughly with lint free cloth and then re-fit. Only new oil seal is required and while fitting check both springs are of equal length. If difference is there just elongate the shorter one to other one by striking lightly with hammer to the sides of springs on a line. Replacing only oil and completely opening and re-fitting both have different performance. Completely opening and servicing is always better.

2. For racer no problem, open re-grease and fit. I also do another small exercise to polish the racer. What i do is apply some valve grinding paste and polish the racers so that any irregularity on surface is removed. Then i clean it with kerosene and re-fit. It is not required if racer doesn't have any ball marks. Just change the balls and you are good to go. Use waxpol grease.

3. Regarding extreme racer then all new models come with bigger racer that has cage built into it. Models coming with bigger racer are new DAWN, DELUXE, SPLENDOR PRO, PASSION PRO AND XPRO, SUPER SPLENDOR, GLAMOR,IGNITOR, EXTREME, HUNK, ZMR. PLEASURE AND MASTREO HAS CAGE BALLS BUT HAS DIFFERENT TYPE OF RACER, THEIR RACER ARE MORE BIGGER AND DEEP. OLD MODEL RACER WITHOUT CAGE AND SMALL RACER ARE USED IN CD100, SS, SPLENDOR AND PLUS, PASSION AND PLUS, JOY, CD-DAWN(OLD MODEL), CD DELUXE(OLD MODEL LIKE SPLENDOR STYLE), CBZ(OLD MODEL), AMBITION, SLEEK, STREET, AND KARIZMA.

So basically there are three models of racer, one is new model with cage which is used in all new models, pleasure model which is used in pleasure and mastreo, and old model which is used in old model bikes. You can get OE for new model and pleasure model as they are quite good and last long, but for old model get SKF cage model cost Rs.330 or get TOP company cost Rs.100 and use SKF balls in it cost Rs.28. Even that Rs.100 racer will last longer than OE.

And regarding Bajaj balls then they are cheap and Chinese brand (HCH) but they will last in bajaj bikes but in Hero they will eat up the racer. Its because those balls are hard balls compared to Hero balls as they are softer and more polished. You have both so just compare them and you can see the difference. More over bajaj racer are hard while hero racer are made of soft material. So a harder ball will damage the racer. Bajaj always sells the racer and balls in different packets but hero sells balls and racer in single packet. Although Bajaj balls are less costly but there racer is more costly than hero.

And buying Hero balls for Rs.63 is waste as SKF balls are available for Rs.28.

Regarding number of balls then the racer can very well accommodate 22 but 21 is used because with one gap the balls will move freely and wear less.

For your friends wind rather than welding and polishing the seat, i would suggest to cut thin strip of pan masala tin can, and use it as packing in between racer and frame where racer seats. It will become tight as new. Have done it on my cousin brother Samurai and it was working without any play until he sold it. Do not apply the tin packing all around but along two sides as that will itself make it tight. Applying on all sides will make it too tight and racer will not go.

Yes part number is same as all are same, so part number is same. This is Honda part number and has not been changed since then.


And regarding Waxpol then let me tell you that you will get it easily as waxpol is Kolkatta company, and its product are excellent. Their polishes, grease, and also their brake and clutch fluids are excellent. The sad thing is that they do not advertise much, have less price and so not have some flashy foreign name or is not imported so people thing they are not good. This has always been a problem with indian products.

But rest assured Wapol is up their with best in the market. I am a person who sees the product quality than its price and brand name.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Update - nothing went as planned . Heavy rains , absence of the helping hand and nearly end of leave forced decisions on me . I dismantled the steering head and found that the bearings were very sparingly greased from factory and rust had formed on some of the bearing balls . So I had to discard them , but I had not actually bought the Hero OE balls packet . I measured the OE balls and they were exactly 4.75 - 4.76 mm over many samples ( those weren't rusty ) . Well well , now that is the same size as the packet of Bajaj OE balls I had bought . So thats what I went with in the end . Racers were not damaged at all . Cleaned and regreased generously and fork is tight now . Shall adjust it after a few days of riding .
Fork oil change had to be postponed for want of time etc since fork is in relatively ok working condition without any leaks etc .



Now how come Hero mentions Size/Dimension of 6mm on the packet of it's steering-head bearings balls , while they measure out nearer to 5mm ( 4.75mm-4.77mm ) ??!! i.e the exact same size as Bajaj's . Any ideas ?

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion


Oh man ! , I wish you were in delhi ,so i could meet you & learn from you, it's almost impossible to find a person even half as nice as you .

I like your desire for perfection .

I request you to put a video of engine rebuilt , describing in detail :

1. How to do it?
2. Which are suitable parts?
3. Precautions while doing it

You are so helpful.

thanks

----consecutive posts auto-merged-----


If you rebuild the engine of crux , then please make a video of each and every step explaining everything.

thanks

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Sorry kabir , I no longer have the Crux , Rx135 and Max100R . Had to dispose them off for lack of time and want of space . At my age I am trying to simplify things and cut down upto essentials only . Thats why I bought this Splendor+ , it fits into the scheme of essential , simple and dependable things in life . Less bling , more substance .

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

Friends have u tried using nitrogen in your tyres. I switched to nitrogen.shopwala is saying that it pressure will remain constant for one month.have to check it.

Re: Hero Moto Splendor/Joy/CD-Dawn/Passion

In my splendor with MRF tube and tyre(two years old), the pressure falls max by 2 psi over a period of one month.
No sign of wear and not even a single puncture. Generally, after three years due to aging of rubber- air leaks out slowly through the rubber.

Never had any problem with "normal air" without moisture. Atmospheric air itself contains 78% N.
Here when we are not even sure of the purity of petrol, purity of so called "nitrogen" remains a big "?"

Try filling air from reputed petrol bunks having an automatic tyre inflator which usually has a desiccator inline.