Now that said, I might have to see how the condition of my bike's O2 sensor is. i am getting less FE than how it used to give 6 months back..
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Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
From my understanding, the lambda sensor is the O2 sensor and it helps to measure the concentration of oxygen remaining in the exhaust gas to allow an Power Control Module to control the efficiency of the combustion process in the chambers... which definitely mean it could be the reason for the low FE.Originally posted by monisab2003 View Post
Now that said, I might have to see how the condition of my bike's O2 sensor is. i am getting less FE than how it used to give 6 months back..Splendor - 2k to 2006
Karizma - 2k3 to 2009
P180 - 2k6 to 2k9
Hunk - Oct 2k7 til now
ZMR - 2010 to Forever
RX135(2k) - 2013 to 2018
Ninja 250R (2010) - 2016 til now
RayZ - 2015 til now
Ninja 650 (2014) - 2017 til now
Delhi to Narkanda
Delhi to Coimbatore
Delhi to Nepal
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
I guess you have conceived my issue the other way. I am observing way more efficiency than what I used to see earlier.Originally posted by rreneav1987 View PostFrom my understanding, the lambda sensor is the O2 sensor and it helps to measure the concentration of oxygen remaining in the exhaust gas to allow an Power Control Module to control the efficiency of the combustion process in the chambers... which definitely mean it could be the reason for the low FE.
Now that said, I might have to see how the condition of my bike's O2 sensor is. i am getting less FE than how it used to give 6 months back..
When the lambda sensor not on its role, the system would run richer which should only bring down my vehicle's efficiency level. But it's happening inversely.
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
Ah! I read it the other way.. How is that even possible? :-oOriginally posted by monisab2003 View PostI guess you have conceived my issue the other way. I am observing way more efficiency than what I used to see earlier.
When the lambda sensor not on its role, the system would run richer which should only bring down my vehicle's efficiency level. But it's happening inversely.
It should bring down the efficiency!Splendor - 2k to 2006
Karizma - 2k3 to 2009
P180 - 2k6 to 2k9
Hunk - Oct 2k7 til now
ZMR - 2010 to Forever
RX135(2k) - 2013 to 2018
Ninja 250R (2010) - 2016 til now
RayZ - 2015 til now
Ninja 650 (2014) - 2017 til now
Delhi to Narkanda
Delhi to Coimbatore
Delhi to Nepal
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
With the O2 sensor not in the ECM's sensing, ECM will automatically go into open loop mode....The ECM had already learned your driving habit, and so it will be present inside the ECM memory...so using that the ECM is calculating the AFR for a given throttle position and RPM...Since the wire seems to have got cut while returning on a long journey, ECM has That run in it's memory and using it....Originally posted by monisab2003 View PostI guess you have conceived my issue the other way. I am observing way more efficiency than what I used to see earlier.
When the lambda sensor not on its role, the system would run richer which should only bring down my vehicle's efficiency level. But it's happening inversely.
If the battery gets disconnected, then all of this memory will be lost and ECM will start using the Standard OE preset settings....hope this is helpful..When Was The Last Time,You Did Something For The First Time.
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
This is because your bike's ECU has recorded your riding pattern in its memory. The temporary maps are doing the job currently.Originally posted by monisab2003 View PostI guess you have conceived my issue the other way. I am observing way more efficiency than what I used to see earlier.
When the lambda sensor not on its role, the system would run richer which should only bring down my vehicle's efficiency level. But it's happening inversely.
Edit - Raghavan sir just explained it more clearly.Got a $5 head? Get a $5 helmet.
Because everyone who passes, isn't a martyr!
Bullet Service Guide CBR 250R Parts Manual Fz16 service manual - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-...VFQmJzakk/view
Hero Moto Corp Bikes' Parts RE STD 350 Wiring Diagram (CI) Service Manual - Classic 350/500
ZMR parts - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-U...it?usp=sharing
P200NS Spares' prices - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...taGd5R2c#gid=0
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
But what about the increase in mileage? He claims almost 12 kmpl increase!!Originally posted by psr View PostWith the O2 sensor not in the ECM's sensing, ECM will automatically go into open loop mode....The ECM had already learned your driving habit, and so it will be present inside the ECM memory...so using that the ECM is calculating the AFR for a given throttle position and RPM...Since the wire seems to have got cut while returning on a long journey, ECM has That run in it's memory and using it....
If the battery gets disconnected, then all of this memory will be lost and ECM will start using the Standard OE preset settings....hope this is helpful..Splendor - 2k to 2006
Karizma - 2k3 to 2009
P180 - 2k6 to 2k9
Hunk - Oct 2k7 til now
ZMR - 2010 to Forever
RX135(2k) - 2013 to 2018
Ninja 250R (2010) - 2016 til now
RayZ - 2015 til now
Ninja 650 (2014) - 2017 til now
Delhi to Narkanda
Delhi to Coimbatore
Delhi to Nepal
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
RTMI increase is irrelevant as it just shows the average FE on the last 8 seconds of riding pattern and it keeps on cycling every 8 seconds. I sometimes see 199 kmpl (yes you read it right!).Originally posted by rreneav1987 View PostBut what about the increase in mileage? He claims almost 12 kmpl increase!!
RTMI = real world mileage only on the highways with a steady riding pattern.
Real world mileage if increasing drastically might sadly link to a fuel pump failure about to happen soon. I've seen everyone reporting an increased FE by 7-10 kmpl a few months before the pumps died.Got a $5 head? Get a $5 helmet.
Because everyone who passes, isn't a martyr!
Bullet Service Guide CBR 250R Parts Manual Fz16 service manual - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-...VFQmJzakk/view
Hero Moto Corp Bikes' Parts RE STD 350 Wiring Diagram (CI) Service Manual - Classic 350/500
ZMR parts - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-U...it?usp=sharing
P200NS Spares' prices - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...taGd5R2c#gid=0
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
Whoa!! That's going to be a costly affair!Originally posted by Divya Sharan View PostRTMI increase is irrelevant as it just shows the average FE on the last 8 seconds of riding pattern and it keeps on cycling every 8 seconds. I sometimes see 199 kmpl (yes you read it right!). [emoji14]
RTMI = real world mileage only on the highways with a steady riding pattern.
Real world mileage if increasing drastically might sadly link to a fuel pump failure about to happen soon. I've seen everyone reporting an increased FE by 7-10 kmpl a few months before the pumps died.
Yes, I have seen 199 too.. lolSplendor - 2k to 2006
Karizma - 2k3 to 2009
P180 - 2k6 to 2k9
Hunk - Oct 2k7 til now
ZMR - 2010 to Forever
RX135(2k) - 2013 to 2018
Ninja 250R (2010) - 2016 til now
RayZ - 2015 til now
Ninja 650 (2014) - 2017 til now
Delhi to Narkanda
Delhi to Coimbatore
Delhi to Nepal
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
Thanks [MENTION=32286]psr[/MENTION] sir & [MENTION=41586]Divya Sharan[/MENTION] for your inputs.Originally posted by Divya Sharan View PostRTMI increase is irrelevant as it just shows the average FE on the last 8 seconds of riding pattern and it keeps on cycling every 8 seconds. I sometimes see 199 kmpl (yes you read it right!).
RTMI = real world mileage only on the highways with a steady riding pattern.
Real world mileage if increasing drastically might sadly link to a fuel pump failure about to happen soon. I've seen everyone reporting an increased FE by 7-10 kmpl a few months before the pumps died.
[MENTION=32286]psr[/MENTION] sir: But, how is that even possible that the ride has become a lot more smoother? Is it due richer fuel mixture as the vehicle is always in open loop mode? Will it be a problem in the long run if this O2 sensor is not connected to system?
Any problem to fuel pump?
I assume that ZMR is always on closed loop since, the current behavior of the bike, be its fuel efficiency or engine smoothness, it all got changed at any given level of throttle inputs. Is my observation correct?
[MENTION=41586]Divya Sharan[/MENTION]: I have observed this increased KMPL during my daily office commute for the past three days which itself is on highways. So, the given figures are found during steady throttle inputs only. Even I have observed the 199KMPL stuff so many times and I have an understanding of how this RTMI figure fluctuates, but I am sure that is not the current case here.
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
An open loop means no real time AFR monitoring and ECU selects the next best higher Fuel ratio...ie., marginally richer...If you still see better RTMI , then like Mr.Divya Sharan said, be prepared for Fuel Pump failure.....But with the O2 sensor out of the loop , predicting it may not be accurate, since the ECU is indicating from past records it is holding in memory...Originally posted by monisab2003 View PostThanks @psr sir & @Divya Sharan for your inputs.
@psr sir: But, how is that even possible that the ride has become a lot more smoother? Is it due richer fuel mixture as the vehicle is always in open loop mode? Will it be a problem in the long run if this O2 sensor is not connected to system?
Any problem to fuel pump?
I assume that ZMR is always on closed loop since, the current behavior of the bike, be its fuel efficiency or engine smoothness, it all got changed at any given level of throttle inputs. Is my observation correct?
@Divya Sharan: I have observed this increased KMPL during my daily office commute for the past three days which itself is on highways. So, the given figures are found during steady throttle inputs only. Even I have observed the 199KMPL stuff so many times and I have an understanding of how this RTMI figure fluctuates, but I am sure that is not the current case here.
Remember ONLY during steady cruising will the ECU be in closed loop. Slightly increase throttle or close throttle, ECU will switch to real time , ie., open loop to get real time O2 sensor values to make fresh calculations .When Was The Last Time,You Did Something For The First Time.
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
That is surely not correct. There is a reason why manufacturers like KTM ended up making their motorcycles heavier with marginal reductions in performance levels. All their products come with FI but major changes were required to make them BS4 compliant.Originally posted by Harvinder View PostGuys, is the ZMR BS-IV compliant?
I'm made to believe that all FI engines are BS-IV. Is that correct?
Of course, FI engines are more efficient and have better combustion properties. But that alone wouldn't make them compliant with the latest emission norms.
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Re: Hero Honda Karizma ZMR
All Hero bikes till date are BS3 compliant.Originally posted by Harvinder View PostSo ZMR is not BS-IV compliant?Got a $5 head? Get a $5 helmet.
Because everyone who passes, isn't a martyr!
Bullet Service Guide CBR 250R Parts Manual Fz16 service manual - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-...VFQmJzakk/view
Hero Moto Corp Bikes' Parts RE STD 350 Wiring Diagram (CI) Service Manual - Classic 350/500
ZMR parts - https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-U...it?usp=sharing
P200NS Spares' prices - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...taGd5R2c#gid=0
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