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Karizma/Karizma R Ownership Experience

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  • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

    Originally posted by vijayvenkatesans View Post
    Got an NGK G Power a while back for Rs. 170. Got it installed today as soon as my bike hit reserve. Here's a pic of the stock carb with AFR at 3.5. Am I running rich or is it fine?
    [ATTACH=CONFIG]130694[/ATTACH]
    Looks fine IMO.
    "Biking is Divine"

    All Karizma Owners Connect With Each Other On the Karizma Group on facebook


    https://www.facebook.com/groups/HeroHondaKarizma

    https://www.facebook.com/AnmolSharmaPhotography

    https://www.facebook.com/ThinkDigitall

    http://anmolksharma.blogspot.in/

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    • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

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      Got these brake pad set today. Quality looks better than the ASK pads. Okami (param automotive) RS 90
      Karizma R

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      • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

        Originally posted by ravi@17bhp View Post
        Opened the engine today to replace the cam chain and the guides. Found the 10k kms old bore (rebored to 0.5 size) to have a lot piston-cylinder clearance, so much that part of the piston rings are visible clearly. Check the photos. Will do the measurement of gap with feeler gauge later. The white line at the edges is the top piston ring. The lathe expert did a poor job and bored the cylinder more than required.Seems the cam lobes worn out a bit. You can see it in the following pic. The middle 80% of the lobe surface is flat and at the ends its raised a bit. I could feel it when touched with my finger.Recently when I was changing the carb insulator, I noticed carbon formation on the back of intake valve and thought there is intake valve leak. But, I found the valves are seated properly without any leaks. Poured petrol on the valves and left it for an hour. No leakage found in the manifolds. This is the condition of valves.Thought of going for next OS for the bore, was ready to experiment again, but due to time constraints in the future, I may not spend much time with the bike, so decided to go for new bore kit. As the valves are just 20k kms old, and as the seating appears to be good, decided against valve seating job. Changing the following. Bore KitCam shaftCam chain sprocketCam chain and guidesTensioner appears fine but will recheck and replace if needed. Sourced all the parts and work will be done tomorrow. Will update tomorrow again. [MENTION=32286]psr[/MENTION] sir, please notice the spark plug color. Its white on exhaust valve side and a little brown on intake valve side.
        I had a talk with shoeb just now about your post.I would keep my post short and precise:-1.From your bore post it is clear engine oil has been seeping into chamber from quite a time. So replace with new bore as none in two wheeler lathe do boring on boring machine. Only four wheeler lathe does it. While replacing the bore check the rings gap by inserting the rings in bore and checking. If the gap is more buy oversize ring and use the oil ring by grinding the edges.2. Camshaft- Change that as the worn camshaft will screw the low end and mid end torque.3. Change the timing kit for smooth and longer lasting valve train.4. Open the complete engine and change the con-rod in a good lathe. As without a new con-rod new bore will be a waste as it will eat up the new bore.5. Check the clutch housing and change the rubber grommet in the housing and also change the clutch plates. If they are new then no need to change.For longer lasting of engine open the complete engine and do a overhaul. Play special attention to crank, bore kit, valve train and clutch.Any doubt feel free to ask here.And last but not the least take the help of shoeb as he is also in hyderabad and he is also an expert when it comes to bikes.If i would have been at hyderabad then would have personally helped you.
        Photo of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/854067-post963.html-3.88 lac km cont....Ownership review of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/832255-post608.html- slowly updating as and when getting time. HERO HONDA CBZ EXTREME(2011) - 47K KM AND COUNTINGhttp://www.xbhp.com/talkies/motorcyc...tml#post904152-carb tuning guide

        Comment


        • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

          Originally posted by sibun View Post
          I had a talk with shoeb just now about your post.I would keep my post short and precise:-1.From your bore post it is clear engine oil has been seeping into chamber from quite a time. So replace with new bore as none in two wheeler lathe do boring on boring machine. Only four wheeler lathe does it. While replacing the bore check the rings gap by inserting the rings in bore and checking. If the gap is more buy oversize ring and use the oil ring by grinding the edges.2. Camshaft- Change that as the worn camshaft will screw the low end and mid end torque.3. Change the timing kit for smooth and longer lasting valve train.4. Open the complete engine and change the con-rod in a good lathe. As without a new con-rod new bore will be a waste as it will eat up the new bore.5. Check the clutch housing and change the rubber grommet in the housing and also change the clutch plates. If they are new then no need to change.For longer lasting of engine open the complete engine and do a overhaul. Play special attention to crank, bore kit, valve train and clutch.Any doubt feel free to ask here.And last but not the least take the help of shoeb as he is also in hyderabad and he is also an expert when it comes to bikes.If i would have been at hyderabad then would have personally helped you.
          Thanks @sibun for the inputs. I would change the parts as indicated. Regarding the timing kit, 20k kms back I have changed rocker arms and valves. So, was thinking to leave them untouched. Do you suggest changing them too? I have replaced the clutch plates just 500 kms back. They are entirely new. What is this clutch rubber grommet? Is it easily available as a spare?

          Regarding the crank, the last time (10k kms back), there was some side play in the conrod and the lathe guy put an oversize bearings and adjusted the play. I don't know if he had changed the pin. Now, an OS conrod would work? Do I get proper crank pin for the OS conrod? Is there any way other than getting a new crank ?

          I spoke to Shoeb a while back. Will talk to him tomorrow and see.
          HH Karizma (Current) || CBF Stunner PGM-FI || Honda CB Unicorn Dazzler
          Honda Aviator || Kinetic Flyte || Kinetic Blaze || HH Splendor

          Two ZMAs, 9 Days in Western Ghats

          Comment


          • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

            Originally posted by ravi@17bhp View Post
            What is this clutch rubber grommet? Is it easily available as a spare?
            Regarding the crank, the last time (10k kms back), there was some side play in the conrod and the lathe guy put an oversize bearings and adjusted the play. I don't know if he had changed the pin. Now, an OS conrod would work? Do I get proper crank pin for the OS conrod? Is there any way other than getting a new crank ?
            I spoke to Shoeb a while back. Will talk to him tomorrow and see.
            This grommet (or a better word - bushing) holds the clutch basket and its gear. It acts as a dampener.
            Common symptom of worn-out bushing is noise at idling RPM.

            To check for play- You must hold the clutch basket in one hand, the ring gear by another hand and try to turn them in opposite direction. There must be little to no play.

            Apparently, worn out bushing can even damage the GPT which in-turn damages the crank.
            All thanks to sibun for sharing his knowledge and experience. Thanks a lot dear.

            We will have a look at the crank and decide what to do. There is absolutely no need to go for new crank as it can be re-built by using all necessary parts, properly.

            Comment


            • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

              Originally posted by shoeb2015 View Post
              This grommet (or a better word - bushing) holds the clutch basket and its gear. It acts as a dampener.
              Common symptom of worn-out bushing is noise at idling RPM.

              To check for play- You must hold the clutch basket in one hand, the ring gear by another hand and try to turn them in opposite direction. There must be little to no play.

              Apparently, worn out bushing can even damage the GPT which in-turn damages the crank.
              All thanks to sibun for sharing his knowledge and experience. Thanks a lot dear.
              Do you mean 'Clutch Bell'? The last time the mechanic replaced them when there was play. But, as we don't get any stock OEM grommets, they replaced them with some local made grommets meant for Unicorn. I checked the play when I opened recently to clean the centrifugal filter. There was no play at all. Is there any chance that the grommets wear out without causing play?

              Originally posted by shoeb2015 View Post
              We will have a look at the crank and decide what to do. There is absolutely no need to go for new crank as it can be re-built by using all necessary parts, properly.
              Those words are a bit soothing.
              HH Karizma (Current) || CBF Stunner PGM-FI || Honda CB Unicorn Dazzler
              Honda Aviator || Kinetic Flyte || Kinetic Blaze || HH Splendor

              Two ZMAs, 9 Days in Western Ghats

              Comment


              • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                [MENTION=11210]ravi@17bhp[/MENTION]- No need to touch the valves. Since it has been changed 20k prior nothing to do. Just open the valves and clean the ports as your engine was burning oil so would have carbon deposits in ports. Clean the ports, polish the valves and re-fit back.For rocker arms, check the flat head which rubs against camshaft. Feels them with your fingers. If they feel smooth then no problem. But if they has slight grooves in them just change them.For clutch plates if you have changed them 500 km back them no need of changing them. Clutch bell grommets are not available original. Most of them use aftermarkets grommets and pins. Open the clutch bell and check for play and if no play then no need to change. Also if while leaving clutch from standstill bike makes sssssss....sssssssssss....... type of sound while clutch is engaging then the clutch bell along with GPT has to be changed.For crank nothing major, if the crank has side play nothing to worry as new crank also have it as without some play crank will be tight to rotate. Check for vertical play by holding the connecting rod at TDC and with palm of other hand strike the con rod lightly and in a jerky manner. If the crank shows vertical play then open it. Go for Oversize connecting rod with oversize pin. OE doesn't come with oversize but there are many good quality aftermarket ones that last as long as OE. Some of the brands are Alfa, NRB, MB e.t.c.
                Photo of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/854067-post963.html-3.88 lac km cont....Ownership review of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/832255-post608.html- slowly updating as and when getting time. HERO HONDA CBZ EXTREME(2011) - 47K KM AND COUNTINGhttp://www.xbhp.com/talkies/motorcyc...tml#post904152-carb tuning guide

                Comment


                • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                  Originally posted by sibun View Post
                  @ravi@17bhp- No need to touch the valves. Since it has been changed 20k prior nothing to do. Just open the valves and clean the ports as your engine was burning oil so would have carbon deposits in ports. Clean the ports, polish the valves and re-fit back.For rocker arms, check the flat head which rubs against camshaft. Feels them with your fingers. If they feel smooth then no problem. But if they has slight grooves in them just change them.For clutch plates if you have changed them 500 km back them no need of changing them. Clutch bell grommets are not available original. Most of them use aftermarkets grommets and pins. Open the clutch bell and check for play and if no play then no need to change. Also if while leaving clutch from standstill bike makes sssssss....sssssssssss....... type of sound while clutch is engaging then the clutch bell along with GPT has to be changed.For crank nothing major, if the crank has side play nothing to worry as new crank also have it as without some play crank will be tight to rotate. Check for vertical play by holding the connecting rod at TDC and with palm of other hand strike the con rod lightly and in a jerky manner. If the crank shows vertical play then open it. Go for Oversize connecting rod with oversize pin. OE doesn't come with oversize but there are many good quality aftermarket ones that last as long as OE. Some of the brands are Alfa, NRB, MB e.t.c.
                  Will check the rocker arms and replace them too if needed. Clutch bell had no play and it appeared good. One observation is, when the engine is hot there is like a sewing machine noise at idle, and it reduces a bit when I pull clutch lever. BTW, what is GPT? Will test the crank and do the necessary.
                  HH Karizma (Current) || CBF Stunner PGM-FI || Honda CB Unicorn Dazzler
                  Honda Aviator || Kinetic Flyte || Kinetic Blaze || HH Splendor

                  Two ZMAs, 9 Days in Western Ghats

                  Comment


                  • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                    Originally posted by ravi@17bhp View Post
                    Will check the rocker arms and replace them too if needed. Clutch bell had no play and it appeared good. One observation is, when the engine is hot there is like a sewing machine noise at idle, and it reduces a bit when I pull clutch lever. BTW, what is GPT? Will test the crank and do the necessary.
                    Thats the GPT sound. GPT is the small gear that is near the clutch bell which transmits crank rotation to the clutch bell. It is situated behind the centrifugal filter on the crankshaft.Since this sound is there check the teeths on GPT and clutch bell they must be worn, if worn you have to change them both eventough clutch bell will not be having any play.Check and change if they are worn then only change. Take shoeb with you and he can take some decisions.
                    Photo of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/854067-post963.html-3.88 lac km cont....Ownership review of my joy- http://www.xbhp.com/talkies/832255-post608.html- slowly updating as and when getting time. HERO HONDA CBZ EXTREME(2011) - 47K KM AND COUNTINGhttp://www.xbhp.com/talkies/motorcyc...tml#post904152-carb tuning guide

                    Comment


                    • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                      Originally posted by sibun View Post
                      Thats the GPT sound. GPT is the small gear that is near the clutch bell which transmits crank rotation to the clutch bell. It is situated behind the centrifugal filter on the crankshaft.Since this sound is there check the teeths on GPT and clutch bell they must be worn, if worn you have to change them both eventough clutch bell will not be having any play.Check and change if they are worn then only change. Take shoeb with you and he can take some decisions.
                      What does GPT stands for? Is the the primary drive? If so, I have changed it just 10 kms back. May be I have to change the clutch bell too along with it. Do I?
                      HH Karizma (Current) || CBF Stunner PGM-FI || Honda CB Unicorn Dazzler
                      Honda Aviator || Kinetic Flyte || Kinetic Blaze || HH Splendor

                      Two ZMAs, 9 Days in Western Ghats

                      Comment


                      • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                        [MENTION=66132]sounakray[/MENTION] some pics of the projector type LED

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                        • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                          Originally posted by ravi@17bhp View Post
                          These days, I completely forgot that my bike has any rear brakes (virtually nonexistent); its time for me to replace the rear brake shoes. I remember reading a better shoes than the stock ones, some non-asbestos type. It was mentioned somewhere in previous post that I can't dig out. Could somebody please help me?
                          Ravi, sent you a PM
                          karizmatic

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                          • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                            Originally posted by ryan.virgo View Post
                            [MENTION=66132]sounakray[/MENTION] some pics of the projector type LED
                            Thanks for sharing the pics, [MENTION=34359]ryan.virgo[/MENTION], buddy! They really look great! BTW, I too have the same LS2 helmet.

                            Well, I couldn't resist my temptation this long and had already ordered a pair of 10smd LEDs on ebay for only Rs. 160 I got the delivery today, and am planning to install them tomorrow on my ZMR, along with the Phillips X-treme Vision.

                            Here are some snaps...

                            So, is this better than a projection type one? I don't really know! I just thought of trying it out - might switch to a projection type one later if I feel like it.

                            I'm still debating over whether or not to attempt the bulb replacement job myself.... :P

                            Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
                            Attached Files
                            Last edited by sounakray; 01-11-2014, 09:35 AM.

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                            • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                              Today suddenly petrol start leaking from carburettor. I had doubts may due to sludge it happening, so I went to the mechanic and asked him to open cab. This was first my cab was opened and found garbage inside. Mechanic cleaned every thing now its working fine. You can see on screw driver and that where it stored.







                              Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk 2

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                              • Re: Karizma/Karizma R

                                Today Ravi and I got the head removed to inspect the cause of oil entering into the combustion chamber.

                                We found a lot of oil on the top of Piston. Mostly it was confined to the exhaust and clutch side.(One point to keep in mind is that the bore is also forwardly inclined). This much of oil had settled after an hour of idle.



                                Shot from another angle.



                                Intake port was slightly wet with oil but did not seem that so much of oil could have leaked through it. Also notice the brownish deposit where the oil was getting burnt. Notice that the exhaust valve is absolutely dry and was not leaking as we had suspected earlier.




                                We then polished the valves by Hand as the lathe where Ravi had got the valve job previously, had messed it up. Both the valve seats had circular grooves(not visible in the pics).
                                Inlet valve polished. Comparing it with the undone exhaust valve.





                                Both the valves and seat polished.





                                Assistant mechanic installing the valve springs and retainers.


                                To eliminate other source of oil entering into the oil chamber, we removed the bore and found-out that the ends of Piston oil control rings were almost overlapping each other. However it was not the source of our oil leak.

                                After polishing the valves, we replaced the valve stem oil seals, head gasket and other few gaskets. Timing was checked once again after installing the tensioner.
                                We also inspected and cleaned the carburetor.

                                Then we asked the assistant mechanics to install the engine onto the frame and finish all other tidbits.

                                Unfortunately due to some urgent work, I had to leave and couldn't see the work till the end . Ravi got the bike done by 9:20pm.
                                Still there is some knocking sound in lower gears which was there even before overhauling.
                                Can confirm only after replacing the spark-plug and tuning the carburetor.

                                Tomorrow morning we will know if it is still burning oil after the engine is let to sit for some time.
                                PS- Rest of the story will be posted by Ravi.

                                @psr @sibun

                                Please comment.
                                Attached Files
                                Last edited by shoeb2015; 01-12-2014, 02:06 AM.

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